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Kad Front Hub Bearings Won't Tighten Up


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#1 bikewiz

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Posted 25 April 2014 - 03:54 AM

As the title says I have a set of new KAD front hubs with new genuine Timken bearings, single hole axles. Haynes states the torque spec at 188-199 ft/lbs for single hole axle 155 ft/lbs for multiple hole. KAD instructions say 150 ft/lbs. Even at the higher torque there's still play. I've torqued them up with a flat washer then the split washer but they still have play. Any suggestions? The drive flanges don't appear worn, one side has a new split washer. I'm tempted to replace the drive flanges as I can't figure any other place the play would be coming from.

Other pertinent info;

Torque wrench is a Snap-On click type calibrated in November '13 (a beautiful tool by the way)

Also every part in the front end has been replaced or renewed, the play is definitely between the hub and drive flange.



#2 timmy850

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Posted 25 April 2014 - 06:13 AM

Bearing spacer is slightly to thick? Maybe the KAD hubs are slightly different to the original ones

#3 Vipernoir

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Posted 25 April 2014 - 08:46 AM

Check that the drive flange isn't bottoming out on the CV splines - if it bottoms out before the bearing is tight, you will never eliminate the play.



#4 bikewiz

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Posted 25 April 2014 - 01:53 PM

I got a quick response from Colin at KAD he believes it's the bearings. I've got another set to try and then I can check the spec on the Timkens.



#5 Gr4h4m

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Posted 25 April 2014 - 02:22 PM

I must admit that KAD's customer service was great when I was fitting one of their brake kit.



#6 bikewiz

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Posted 25 April 2014 - 03:10 PM

Gr4h4m agreed, I sent them an email last night and received a reply this morning. Good service.



#7 bikewiz

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 05:03 AM

So when I set the hubs up I used a new set of the"be all end all" Timken bearings instead of the bearings KAD supplied, which had no markings, which I assumed were inferior to the Timkens. I guess I was wrong, no matter what I did the Timkens would not adjust properly, the spacer is out of spec for a mini front hub regardless if was the KAD set up or genuine. So much for the superiority of the Timken bearing. Out of spec spacers on a set of 82GBP bearings, nice.

I guess I'll get the spacer ground to spec so I can waste a little more money.



#8 Captain Mainwaring

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 08:03 AM

So when I set the hubs up I used a new set of the"be all end all" Timken bearings instead of the bearings KAD supplied, which had no markings, which I assumed were inferior to the Timkens. I guess I was wrong, no matter what I did the Timkens would not adjust properly, the spacer is out of spec for a mini front hub regardless if was the KAD set up or genuine. So much for the superiority of the Timken bearing. Out of spec spacers on a set of 82GBP bearings, nice.

I guess I'll get the spacer ground to spec so I can waste a little more money.

 

 

You sure the hub isn't machined too deep (for std timken bearings) ? measure what KAD sent out versus the OEM bearings.



#9 bikewiz

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 02:24 PM

 

So when I set the hubs up I used a new set of the"be all end all" Timken bearings instead of the bearings KAD supplied, which had no markings, which I assumed were inferior to the Timkens. I guess I was wrong, no matter what I did the Timkens would not adjust properly, the spacer is out of spec for a mini front hub regardless if was the KAD set up or genuine. So much for the superiority of the Timken bearing. Out of spec spacers on a set of 82GBP bearings, nice.

I guess I'll get the spacer ground to spec so I can waste a little more money.

 

 

You sure the hub isn't machined too deep (for std timken bearings) ? measure what KAD sent out versus the OEM bearings.

 

The spec on the KAD hub measures the same as the iron OE hub. The spacer on both Timken bearings were out of spec one worse than the other they're only off by a few thousands but enough that they wouldn't tighten up properly. I didn't measure the bearings KAD sent I only measured the old bearing spacers and compared them to the new Timkens. The suggestion from KAD was to use the bearings they supplied as they have had issues with the spacers on some Timken bearings.



#10 Fast Ivan

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 02:53 PM

out of interest what was out of spec; the spacer or the overall dimension of the two bearings and the spacer?



#11 bikewiz

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 03:17 PM

out of interest what was out of spec; the spacer or the overall dimension of the two bearings and the spacer?

I only measured the spacer.



#12 Fast Ivan

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 03:42 PM

my understanding is that its the overall size of the assembly that was important, the spacer being used to bring the overall dimension in to tolerance, not entirely sure where I got this from but probably on here. 

Where did you get the size of the spacer from in order to determine that its out of tolerance?



#13 Dan

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 04:01 PM

You can't compare the spacer in your new set to the one you removed. As above the spacer is sized to suit the bearing races in the set it comes with so the total stack height is the same. Also the inner and outer part of each individual bearing in the set must stay together and if you mix them the stack height will be off.

Is there a groove or other witness mark on the nose of the CV joint where the split taper washer pinches it?

#14 bikewiz

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 04:24 PM

You can't compare the spacer in your new set to the one you removed. As above the spacer is sized to suit the bearing races in the set it comes with so the total stack height is the same. Also the inner and outer part of each individual bearing in the set must stay together and if you mix them the stack height will be off.

Is there a groove or other witness mark on the nose of the CV joint where the split taper washer pinches it?

This is all good info however the problem was solved by replacing the bearings with the KAD supplied bearings. I'll trust what KAD said as it corrected the problem. The Timken bearings were assembled as a set but I didn't measure them "stacked" I do know that assembled and torqued to the correct spec they were loose. I'll measure the Timken stack out of curiosity. Do you know what the stack dimension is?



#15 Fast Ivan

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Posted 27 April 2014 - 05:08 PM

I would be interested in the Timken measurements, the stack and the individual components if possible, if you could post them up or pm them to me I'd appreciate it. I've got another Timken here as well as an after market bearing assembly and it would be good to compare.

It could save peps a lot of grief if a quick measurement before assembly could be carried out.

 

So I guess what your saying bikewiz is that there was a difference of a few thou between the KAD supplied spacer and the Timken spacer, do you still have these measurements as well?






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