12 replies to this topic

[colinu]

Checking the car over yesterday I found some play in the right-side front wheel. Raise the wheel off there ground, grab it at 12 and 6 o'clock and rock it in-out... there is probably 3mm play at the rim. Grab it at 3 and 6 o'clock and it's rock solid (even after I remove the brake caliper). Any ideas what could be causing it, or what I should inspect when I give it a thorough strip down?

 

I did a partial strip down yesterday and removed the hub carrier... I couldn't see anything obviously wrong. Although I didn't knock out the bearings (Timkens with less than 500 miles on them) they look OK and are running freely and without nastey noises in the races (even when torqued up to 150lb/ft). The play/wobble definitely isn't from the swivel ball joints - seems to be the CV shaft wobbling slightly/vertically on the inner side of the hub carrier. Could it be that the inner bearing isn't sitting correctly on the CV, or maybe the CV shaft is 'worn'??? Also should the spacer between the inner and outer bearings be clamped solid between those two bearing races? I have a feeling my spacer is floating between them.

 

Note: It's only done 500 miles since I fully stripped and rebuild the front subframe, suspension, and hubs (and this play may have been there from scratch as I can't recall checking for play at that time). The bearings pressed in square, true and tightly. The only 'unusual' thing about the build is that I used metro turbo flanges (the only type that can accommodate my 1st gen Minispares 4-pots).

 

 

   Cheers,

   Colin.

[timmy850]

If you've got 12-6 o'clock movement and not 3-9 then I'd say ball joints.

 

If your bearing spacer is "floating" then your wheel bearings will be too tight and it will be difficult to turn the wheels around.

[colinu]

Definitely not the ball joints. If I look at the inside edge of the hub carrier I can see a tiny but of up/down movement between the outer CV and carrier body.
As for the spacer... there's a raised lip inside the hub carrier that you press the races against. If the spacer is narrower than the lip then it'll float (but the races would still be fully supported???)

[timmy850]

If your spacer is too loose, when you torque it up the inner races will compress into the outer races too much and it won't turn properly. 

[colinu]

OK, so the bearing is torqued to 150lb/ft and everything turns properly,  so baring a full strip down and thorough inspection I'll assume the spacer is OK.

Getting back on track... any idea what would most likely cause the 12/3 o'clock play?

[The Principal]

theres only a few parts that can give you play, wheel bearing, ball joints or steering arm bolts as Timmy says wheel bearing 9-3, ball joints 12-6, or steering arm 9-3

[midridge2]

12 to 6 could also be worn bushes on the bottom arm were it connects to the subframe.

[Chance]

I had this and was sure it wasn't bearings because there was no other indication

However I changed all the ball joint's, bushes and it was still there

Decided to just change the bearings and found that the outer race in the hub could move up and down and spin around a small amount

Bought a new hub, and new bearing, wheel is solid again, this was a while ago now and the car is off the road now but was OK up to that point

I decided to change both front bearings

When I did the other side the bearings went into the old hub fine but when I last checked I had the same movement as before that was on the first side

So I suspect that the hub is knackered, maybe due to my bearing fitting and assembly
But I will be changing that hub and bearing again when I get round to sorting the rest of the car out

I'm not saying go ahead and get a new hub etc but I was sick of the play ...even though it wasnt that bad but it annoyed me on mine and that's all I could find that was bad

And it cured the problem...just wish I didn't mess with the other side which was fine beforehand

[Cooperman]

Jack it up, put an axle stand under the sub-frame, lie down and get someone to rock the wheel whilst you visually inspect to see where the free play is. It will be obvious and will be upper and/or lower ball joint or lower arm inner bush.
That way you'll know what needs fixing. It will be an easy job whichever it is.

[colinu]

As stated above the movement is not the ball joints (nor lower arm bushes) - it's movement within the hub carrier. For peace of mind I might just replace the carrier, bearings, and CV joint. And be done with it :)

[InnoCOOPER]

I had a similar problem and after stripping hubs, cleaned inspected bearings; ok, re packed, reassembled still same movement 9 - 3 position. Thought it may be spline wear but in the end it was the split collar washer not pulling up tight but only half way!

 

New collar, problem solved.

[tiger99]

Were the new bearing outer races a tight fit in the hub? They should need quite a lot of force to push them in. If they go in easily, the hub casting is worn.

Mostly they are put in with the "calibrated persuader" so it is not easy to directly measure the force, but it should take a few blows to get them seated.

I drive them in using the old outer ring, reversed, to spread the hammer blows. Or you can use both old outer rings, a length of threaded rod, nuts and large washers to make a crude press. But slit the old outer rings right through with the angle grinder first, so they will be slightly compressible and will not jam when their edges enter the hub. They will still be stiff enough to use as load spreaders for pushing the new bearings in. I have used that trick on a number of cars and still have various old bearing races, complete with cut, in the nether regions of my tool box.

Edited by tiger99, 25 August 2016 - 09:52 PM.

[Spider]

From FAQ, might be of help

 

http://www.theminifo...wheel-bearings/