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Another Ex-Works Cooper S?


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#1 Spider

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 10:39 AM

From what I've read in Peter Browning's book an Ex-works Mini, let alone a Cooper S seems a very rare thing indeed and he seems very sceptical that such a true car would exist and that's from when he wrote the book back in the 70's as I recall.

 

None the less, I saw this and thought I'd post here for comment. I won't say 'never' but I am dubious.

 

http://www.coys.co.u...6-mini-cooper-s

 



#2 JBW

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 11:48 AM

May be genuine, but I believe that Abingdon probably swapped registration numbers around as did Ford competitions.

As a side note there is a Cooper S locally that was built with parts from the competitions department.

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#3 mab01uk

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 11:57 AM

Photo I took of JMO 969D at the MCC Beaulieu Mini Cooper Day in June 1984......

IMG_zpszt72nzhi.jpg

 

Some long ongoing discussion here:-

http://mk1-forum.net...php?f=4&t=14118



#4 rally1380

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 01:37 PM

Is it just my eyes.....or if you look at that advert, and see behind the carpet on the drivers side inner arch (glue is obviously not very good) and around where the steering column passes through the toe board.....is the colour of the shell a light blue??? 



#5 Cooperman

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 02:20 PM

JMO969D was bought from Abingdon by a good friend of mine Rob Lawrence. He used it successfully in 1969 until about 1972. In fact I ended up helping him with service on the Circuit of Ireland in 1969 after our Porsche broke.
I have no doubt it was re-shelled at least once probably using a slightly damaged 850 shell. That was what we all had to do in order to keep on rallying.
Whether it has continuous history I know not, but it was a very genuine car when Rob had it

#6 rally1380

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 03:13 PM

JMO969D was bought from Abingdon by a good friend of mine Rob Lawrence. He used it successfully in 1969 until about 1972. In fact I ended up helping him with service on the Circuit of Ireland in 1969 after our Porsche broke.
I have no doubt it was re-shelled at least once probably using a slightly damaged 850 shell. That was what we all had to do in order to keep on rallying.
Whether it has continuous history I know not, but it was a very genuine car when Rob had it

 

 

So my eyes aren't lying then.....possible reshell.  You'd think they'd paint it all though and for the current price tag you'd hope it was my eyes failing.



#7 Cooperman

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 03:33 PM

Almost definate re-shell. The hard life Rob gave it after its life in the BMC team would have meant the shell can't have survived.
Nothing unusual about that and just the same as all the ex-works cars.


Edited by Cooperman, 31 August 2016 - 04:46 PM.


#8 nicklouse

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 03:42 PM

LOL rally cars were often reshelled weekly.

 

or once or twice a season.

 

I am sure there have been more than a few Ex works cars with the same reg plate as someone founds and restored a discarded shell that happened to have the right number on it somewhere.

 

 

it all comes down to (as they say in the art world) providence.



#9 mini-geek

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 05:26 PM

Or having friends in the right places to cover up your lies...

#10 yeti21586

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 05:44 PM

Or having friends in the right places to cover up your lies...


Except when they did it it wasn't illegal so no lying!

#11 mini-geek

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 05:46 PM

I'm not on about historical matters

#12 mab01uk

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 05:51 PM

Or having friends in the right places to cover up your lies...

 

Not really lies, different times when originalty was not a priority but winning events was....as has been said many times the Works Mini Rally cars were regularly re-shelled and numberplates and chassis plates swapped depending on availability and convenience for a forthcoming rally. If the BMC advertising and marketing dept required it, the Austin and Morris plates and badges were also swapped to suit.....there are even some photos of Works cars with Austin Cooper S badges on the bonnet and Morris on the bootlid and the same cars running different numberplates on different events!

Nobody at the time could have known these cars would one day be worth a small fortune and they were eventually sold off at the end of their works days for bargain prices to be thrashed and crashed by privateer race and rally drivers throughout the 1970's and beyond.......

The same is true of most other manufacturers at the time like the Ford Escort rally cars, etc....


Edited by mab01uk, 31 August 2016 - 05:52 PM.


#13 Cooperman

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 06:01 PM

The works teams swapped reg. nos and vin numbers around the way we swapped girlfriends around back then. But no-one cared because we were only interested in winning rallies, not in what the car could be worth 50 years later.

 

At the end of their 'works' lives, the cars were either sold to promising private owners or broken up for spares. What you bought then was a good car to full works specification with a V5 and a number plate. You really didn't care whether it was the actual car which had carried that number plate on 'such-and-such rally'. What you had was a super car capable of getting you some good results. I rallied in an ex-works 997, re-shelled and re-built into a 1275 'S' at Abington with the number 18CRX. It was a great car and very competitive. It was bought from the works by Paul Easter who sold it to a fellow club member.

 

With old rally cars all you are ever buying is the number and a car which may well not be the original. It's not just Minis, it is all historic so-called 'ex-works' cars.



#14 86mayfair

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 06:04 PM

This car is well known as having no relation to it's original form, and very little effort has been made to make any of it correct. They tried selling it last year for over £100k and it didn't sell then, even with people in the room bidding it up to try to get it moving



#15 Ivor Badger

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Posted 31 August 2016 - 06:49 PM

May be genuine, but I believe that Abingdon probably swapped registration numbers around as did Ford competitions.
As a side note there is a Cooper S locally that was built with parts from the competitions department.


Well Stuart Turner ran Abingdon before his sabbatical at Castrol and joining Ford. There is an excellent article on building works minis in Motorsport in the late 60s. The theory was that each car was built from scratch for each rally and just took a convenient number. I remember passing a severely damaged Escort being driven down the M6 on a Tuesday, it was going the other way and seeing it in immaculate condition on Thursday afternoon in Willenhall. They sure knocked the roof out quick.

Edited by Ivor Badger, 31 August 2016 - 06:50 PM.





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