Jump to content


Photo

Drop Kerb Pcn


  • Please log in to reply
28 replies to this topic

#1 Mini-Mad-Craig

Mini-Mad-Craig

    Crazy About Metro's

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,298 posts
  • Location: Travelling in a fried out Kombi

Posted 12 January 2017 - 01:28 PM

Hi guys!

 

I was greeted by a nice little PCN from Hillingdon council this morning for parking over a drop kerb. It's pretty clear that I was parking across a drop kerb (I didnt even realise this was punishable  :shy:) but I always go to a special effort to make sure I'm not blocking the driveway associated with the drop kerb. As you can see I am parked well over a meter from where the driveway for the garage actually begins. I understand that are also for pedestrians and wheelchair users etc but given that there is an entire two garage stretch of drop kerb where nobody should park, surely my car is not causing an obstruction?

 

Shall I give in and pay up the £55 or at least put a case forward? and what are your genuine opinions? Am I reasonable or a moron?

 

Take note; where the purple Metro is there was another car when I parked there last night and I parked as close to it as I could leaving reasonable room. I didnt leave 2ft between the purple metro and the car behind it and had just pulled up to grab something from the blue one.

 

15894902_912056518931080_175355271825939

 

15994451_912056575597741_316059438303122

 

15974877_912056665597732_460349068287257

 



#2 nicklouse

nicklouse

    Moved Into The Garage

  • TMF+ Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 17,899 posts
  • Location: Not Yorkshire
  • Local Club: Anonyme Miniholiker

Posted 12 January 2017 - 01:48 PM

and what about the gateway you are obstructing? or is that just fence?

 

could be the "fence" in newer than the drop curb and the building was a garage etc......

 

I would pay up and then question it.



#3 Mini-Mad-Craig

Mini-Mad-Craig

    Crazy About Metro's

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,298 posts
  • Location: Travelling in a fried out Kombi

Posted 12 January 2017 - 01:52 PM

Just a fence all the way along. 

 

It is a controlled parking zone ends road which means there should be signage indicating the special enforcement in place I think?

 

zone-ends-sign-c6tb6f.jpg

 

I think I have a lot of grounds for protesting really. 

 

1) The DK is in front of a Solid wall and is not used as a driveway
2) The DK is close to another DK nearby and clearly wasnt being used
3) Lack of proper road markings indicating a dropped Kerb
4) Residents frequently park in front of this Kerb and its opposite counterpart (image from Google Maps support this)
5) Inconsistent enforcement of this special enforcement area.
6) the obstruction was too minimal to prevent the use by pedestrians or wheel chair users


Edited by Mini-Mad-Craig, 12 January 2017 - 01:56 PM.


#4 Carlos W

Carlos W

    Mine is purple, but I have been told that's normal

  • TMF+ Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10,110 posts
  • Location: Sittingbourne, Kent

Posted 12 January 2017 - 02:20 PM

Go with 1 or 6 or both.

You moved from Medway?

#5 Mini-Mad-Craig

Mini-Mad-Craig

    Crazy About Metro's

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,298 posts
  • Location: Travelling in a fried out Kombi

Posted 12 January 2017 - 02:51 PM

Thanks! Yep I'm living at Brunel Uni until June. Not sure where from there. Back to California I hope! 

 

Heres the road on maps for some context

 

15995128_912097372260328_750536037520740



#6 GraemeC

GraemeC

    Crazy About Mini's

  • TMF+ Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,300 posts
  • Location: Carnforth

Posted 12 January 2017 - 03:03 PM

I would suspect the remit is to target those parked wholly on the pavement and verge and that you've unfortunately got caught up by a jobs worth.

Personally I'd contest it politely but not risk the full fine hitting you.

 

Looking at that last photo, one reason I could see for the dropped kerb is to allow vehicles entering or exiting the drive on the opposite side (the dropped kerb just visible in the shot) sufficient room to manoeuvre given the narrow road.



#7 Ethel

Ethel

    ..is NOT a girl!

  • TMF Team
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 25,379 posts
  • Local Club: none

Posted 12 January 2017 - 04:10 PM

Banged to rights, my lad!

 

It looks like you've fallen foul of some stealth taxation, but you are clearly obstructing a drop kerb, even if it appears pointless. You could chance a quick, grovelling, letter and you may get lucky. I doubt you'd win if you disputed it.



#8 Mini-Mad-Craig

Mini-Mad-Craig

    Crazy About Metro's

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,298 posts
  • Location: Travelling in a fried out Kombi

Posted 12 January 2017 - 05:47 PM

Cheers guys. 

 

I appealed it basically begging hoping I get somebody nice. Stating that I'm a support worker who is always out in the community with wheel chair users and therefore am always very respecting of where I park etc, and that do not see how I was possibly causing an obstruction where I was parked. Lets hope I get a nice lady who's just come back from her lunch break. 

 

Can I have some honest answers here, Would you have parked where I parked? 


Edited by Mini-Mad-Craig, 12 January 2017 - 05:48 PM.


#9 Ethel

Ethel

    ..is NOT a girl!

  • TMF Team
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 25,379 posts
  • Local Club: none

Posted 12 January 2017 - 06:35 PM

Probably, it'd depend on my expectation of traffic wardens. Especially now some are private companies working on "commission".

#10 JXC Mini GT

JXC Mini GT

    One Carb Or Two?

  • TMF+ Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 776 posts
  • Location: Tunbridge Wells

Posted 12 January 2017 - 07:42 PM

 

Thought this might be of some help? I wouldn't pay the fine I would set out the reason for your appeal highlighting the fact that no obstruction was being caused and request the reason why the ticket was issued.

 

Good luck

Dropped kerb parking law

There are effectively two types of dropped kerbs; the type outside of private or business residence to allow access to the property, and those found at or close to pedestrian crossings. Parking a vehicle across either type of dropped kerb is classed as an obstruction and either the police or local councils can enforce the contravention. Based on the resources a particular authority has in dealing with the contravention, particular attention will typically be allocated to offences that impede the passage of those with disabilities.

Parking adjacent to a dropped kerb becomes a contravention where a vehicle is parked on the carriageway alongside a place where the footpath, cycle lane or verge has been lowered to the level of the carriageway to enable easier passage to:

  • Pedestrians crossing the carriageway
  • Cyclists leaving or entering the carriageway
  • Vehicles that enter or exit a property across a footpath

 

The Highway Code rule 243 advises drivers that ‘Except when forced to do so by stationary traffic, DO NOT stop or park:

  • where the kerb has been lowered to help wheelchair users and powered mobility vehicles, or where it would obstruct cyclists
  • in front of an entrance to a property’
What is considered dropped kerb obstruction

drop-kerb-300x96.jpg

The extent at which obstruction is considered as a contravention code 27 of parking adjacent to a dropped footway includes the height transition kerb stones between the lower and higher part of the kerb as detailed in the diagram to the right.

Who can issue a penalty charge notice for parking alongside a dropped kerb

Council enforcement
Under the Traffic Management Act 2004, grant councils that are Special Enforcement Areas (SPA) the power to enforce contravention code 27: Parked adjacent to a dropped footway.

Police
Although the police generally now have less of a role for dealing with parking issues, Fixed Penalty Notices (FPNs) are often issued to motorists that leave their vehicle in a hazardous position, or a location that may impede wheelchair users. Alternatively, the police may find the owner of the vehicle and ask them to remove it, or possibly remove the vehicle themselves.



#11 M J W J

M J W J

    One Carb Or Two?

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 976 posts
  • Location: Midlands
  • Local Club: not yet

Posted 13 January 2017 - 01:28 PM

I'd contest it with various reasons that have been stated above and then if that fails offer them '£5 out of courtesy to cover administration fees' also stating that you feel the fine is excessive due to the circumstances.

 

My dad did this once and got himself out of a £140 parking fine.

 

I on the other hand contested a parking fine after being ticketed for blocking a driveway and lost. IT WAS MY F***ING DRIVEWAY! The reasons given was that I was preventing access for emergency vehicles.



#12 Itsaminithing

Itsaminithing

    One Carb Or Two?

  • TMF+ Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 849 posts
  • Location: Berkshire
  • Local Club: Not One Worth Mentioning

Posted 13 January 2017 - 11:58 PM

You're bang to rights in being fined for parking in front of a dropped kerb....

or you would be EXCEPT it shouldn't be a dropped kerb where you parked - from the pictures it doesn't seem to comply with any of the government or local authority regulations on the maximum width of allowed dropped kerbs.

Maximum widths allowed for dropped kerbs & how far they extend from the garage vary according to the authority responsible but reading this will give you something to think about-

http://www.hounslow...._policy_app.pdf



#13 Ethel

Ethel

    ..is NOT a girl!

  • TMF Team
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 25,379 posts
  • Local Club: none

Posted 14 January 2017 - 01:22 AM

There could be a case to make there. Get your tape measure out Craig  :shifty:



#14 Van13

Van13

    Speeding Along Now

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 314 posts
  • Location: England
  • Local Club: Unknown

Posted 14 January 2017 - 01:20 PM

Fight it all the way I had similar about 10 years ago went to a hearing took photos,a video a statement from the persons home who kindly said they had no problem with the parking got a telling off but no fine

#15 Cooperman

Cooperman

    Uncle Cooperman, Voted Mr TMF 2011

  • TMF+ Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 23,014 posts
  • Location: Cambs.
  • Local Club: MCR, HAMOC, Chelmsford M.C.

Posted 14 January 2017 - 10:03 PM

If you are leaving the UK on a permanent basis from June, you could keep on writing and arguing, then after about April just ignore all correspondence. Finally just give them your USA address and tell them to send all further correspondence there. They will simply give up.

My son moved to France and some parking organisation tried to chase him as his car had been registered at my address. In the end they just gave up.

It is very expensive for any parking organisation to chase debts abroad and there is no way for them to enforce payment, so they don't wish to lose the court costs and legal charges involved with issuing court papers.

Even if they did get a court judgement, how would they enforce payment if you are not a home owner in the UK and they can't identify any actual assets not related to your work or studies here?






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users