41 replies to this topic

[Mito]

i was just joking mate 

Oh, so it was YOU who left me gasping for breath the other day!

were they 4 stroke or 2 stroke bikes?If they were 2 stroke bikes then I really don't understand the complaint! They smell great! And I don't really understand the complaint if they were 4 strokes either

Edited by Mito, 01 March 2017 - 09:46 PM.

[Rocket.]

Makes me laugh that motorcycle engines are supposedly "archaic" what does that make Mini engines!

[DomCr250]

Yep, a 1970's Honda C50 is probably more fuel efficient than the majority of new cars and any sports bike has a power output per litre that puts any other petrol engine to shame.

Nothing wrong with a lungful of R40 mix either ....even the modern synthetic two stroke oil's are always worth a sniff.

Edited by DomCr250, 01 March 2017 - 10:29 PM.

[Tommyboy12]

The problem with diesel has never been the passenger cars that use it. The 15 biggest heavy oil (not quite diesel) powered ships on the planet emit more than all passenger cars combined, petrol and diesel. Admittedly they are actually very fuel efficient as a % of weight of freight moved but you can't get around the fact that they're completely emissions legislation free and consume hundreds of tons of fuel a day, each!

[tiger99]

I have had a sudden thought about the ancient canal barges with primitive diesel engines which pass very close to many city centres, even London. These engines, per horsepower, must be quite filthy. But in the overall scheme of things I am sure they are not worth bothering about. Or the could be retro-fitted with steam engines like some of them originally were, burning something clean. I see a business opportunity here....

 

I happen to think that there should be an incentive, based on emissions, for upgrading older vehicles. A good.clean Euro 6 engine in various classics, for instance.

[R1minimagic]

The important thing about particulates is the 'particle number - PN' rather than the particle mass - PM.  

 

Old engines spewed out a lot of stuff (bigger particles) that you could see.  Modern diesels have a lot lower particle mass but the particles are a lot smaller because of the improved combustion., These are the most concerning as they can get through your lungs into your blood stream...

 

A PN limit of 6 x 10^11 / m3 was introduced a few years ago.  Diesel Particulate filters were fitted to all diesels since 2008/9 which brought the tailpipe numbers down about 100 times lower.  If you look at most diesel exhausts these days you will see they are still shiny on the inside of the taipipe (i.e. very little soot is getting through the DPF)

 

Now, PN from petrol engines has the opposite trend.  It has gone up because of direct injection.  Direct injection engines limit is 10 times higher so they emit about 1000 times more tiny particles than a diesel with a DPF.  As this is stuff you can't really see, they don't get the nasty press like diesels.

 

Because of this all petrol engines are going to have Gasoline Particulate Filters (GPF) fitted.  However, as the petrol engine is much more sensitive to back pressure, the PN will still be higher than a diesel.

 

Next, NOx - All EU6 diesels have very good NOx control through use of SCR (adblue system) or LNT.  As such, they are also no worse than a petrol.

 

I wish these journalists and government bodies would be honest and clear about the latest diesels.  The industry has spent billions and billions of pounds developing this stuff for politicians and other people that don't know one end of an engine from another saying we should ban diesel, its absolutely crazy.

 

I can understand limiting combustion engine use in cities, that is just common sense in general but its just going too far really to say ban diesels.

 

Just think how the price of petrol would go up if that happened!!  Or the price of a unit of electricity!

[R1minimagic]

And if you don't want to take my word for it, check for yourself here:

 

https://www.dieselne...dards/eu/ld.php

[mab01uk]

Fact Check: are diesel cars really more polluting than petrol cars?

https://www.theengin...=tenews_3395412

Edited by mab01uk, 09 May 2017 - 01:38 PM.

[OzOAP]

I have a chipped Transit Connect, it flies and play about with highly tuned 2 stroke bikes. No smoke, No poke!!!
Also build race engines for a living.
Just waiting for the do-gooders to come and lock me up.

[minimissions]

I have a 2002 E46 BMW 320d (so another target I imagine)

 

I only bought as i needed the space being a touring and do over 400 miles a week, I cant see some of utter Crap being made these days coming close to the 65+mpg of this car without me being seriously out of pocket buying it or massive monthly payments.

 

Maybe they need to look at all these factory's trying to make "eco elec" cars are causing just as much fumes!

 

They need to bring the fuel costs down and make some good petrol cars!

[R1minimagic]

I've got a 2002 Golf TDi which i use to commute mostly motorway 125miles every journey.

 

I can get almost 80mpg out of it if i take it easy and thats confirmed with fuel receipts too!  Even if i drive quickly i can still get 65mpg.

 

There is no way i am getting rid of it, its virtually bomb proof, do all my own servicing and keep it in tip top condition.

 

I think if people found out how much it cost to replace god knows how many DPF's, EGR valves, SCR catalysts etc etc on EU5 and EU6 cars they wouldn't dare trade in their older diesels.  They would prefer to keep on breathing in dirty air like they have been all their lives :)

 

Thinking about inner cities, virtually every house/building/factory/shop has a boiler but none of them have any form of exhaust/flue aftertreatment on them whatsoever.....how much particulates and NOx are they collectively putting out?  Even the most modern condensing boilers are merely designed to improve thermal efficiency, not really reduce emissions....

Edited by R1minimagic, 10 May 2017 - 06:33 PM.

[Cooperman]

I certainly won't be getting rid of either of my diesels, a 2007 BMW730D and a 1997 Land-Rover Discovery 300TDi, any time soon.

 

If I did change either it would be for a BMW740i petrol or a Land-Rover Discovery 3.9 V8 petrol.