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5 Port Injection Vrs Su And Dizzy Advice Needed


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#1 Ann-Wilson

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 07:49 PM

Dear Team, 

I really need some advice on direction to go here.....

Background.

Started a complete restoration of a 1989 Mini Mayfair in 2009. Thought it would take me two years (working for 5-6 weeks during the summers only on it). How wrong was I!!!!!

Now years later I have a problem that I have not been able to solve in the last 2 years..

 

I bought a 5 port injection system from SC maybe 4 years ago to fit a new 1293 rebuilt engine, mild head plus Sw07 cam lightened, balanced fly...The restoration has taken place on the south east corner of Poland...where we spend the summer hols...

 

I have had the system installed for 2 summers now..this one will be the third...However I have struggled to get the car running to a point where I feel I can drive it back. I have covered about 6 km..longest stretch 3 km. The injection system runs a base map that will see the car start but seems way off on fueling....I have contacted SC and asked their advice...they said to get it set up before driving it back......But who can do this? the software SX tune is something I am not sure chip tuners know here and I am not confident about this...

 

i tried one of the other maps on their site...the standard 1275. runs slightly better but still nowhere consistent enough to consider the 1700 km needed to get back to SC to set it up....

 

i know that others have had the running issues at the start with this kit as i have read about them here....

 

i am considering putting the carb and dizzy on from the previous engine back on? Is a 998 cc engine i think 1.5 inch su. the dizzy is from the 998 as well. would this run at all?

 

could this get me back to SC? 

 

is there anyone else people know of who can work with sx tune? perhaps in Germany...? 

thought about driving to hamburg and catching ship to Harwich..?

 

i could buy an hiff 44 and Perhaps the 123 distributor with the 16 preset settings? thoughts? is it easier to setup than the 5 port system?

 

last question. if i did stick on a carb etc. can i still use the mpi tank and electronic fuel pump?

 

really appreciate any advice...any suggestions?

 

thanks

 

 



#2 Anthony30

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 07:53 PM

Twin carbs with mapped ignition. :highfive:  ;D



#3 minisilverbullet

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 08:03 PM

Any competent tuner will be able to use the SX tune software. 

 

I had a local place here in Sweden do mine. They just asked m,e to bring my laptop with SX installed and there were no other issues. 

 

SC also helped me remotely using team viewer  



#4 nicklouse

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 08:11 PM

It kinda depends on who you know where.

As above laptop and someone with a rolling road. Do you know anyone in Poland with rolling road?

And what about back in Germany? (K-town?)

Decide this and then workout how to get car to that place.

Even if it involves a trailer.

#5 Sprocket

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 08:38 PM

The only advice i would give, and take it how you wish, is to find an ECU more user friendly. If you wish to discuss this further, send me a private message.

#6 Sprocket

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 08:44 PM

Also bearing in mind there is a big difference to engine tuners and engine calibrators. What you need to find is an engine calibrator as there is much much more to it than just the fuel and ignition map, which is why most complaints revolve around poor cold running, acceleration, over run and everything other than cruise and full throttle.

#7 carbon

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Posted 18 April 2017 - 09:51 PM

The 1.5 inch carb will work fine on a mildly tuned 1293. But it will need a different needle, AAM should be a safe starting point with red spring.

 

The 998 dizzy will also work on a 1293, and chances are the advance curve won't be too far out. But check the amount of mechanical advance (number is stamped on the distributor advance plate inside the dizzy, you will probably need to take the base plate out to read this). Total mechanical advance at the crank is this number x 2. You can then work out amount of static advance needed to give suitable total advance.

 

For example if number on advance plate is 10, the total mechancal dizzy advance is 20 degrees at the crank. If your engine can safely take 30 degrees max advance at the crank then the static advance you need will be 10 degrees at the crank.



#8 Ann-Wilson

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 05:34 AM

At moment i have not found a rolling road in poland.

The carb and dizzy option just to get back to uk is possible....if the mpi tank and pump is ok? Anyone?..is the pressure ok from the in line tank?

I shall try once more to contact sc. Was going to buy the lambda sensor with plus..but am worried about just checking more money at something i am struggling to set up...:(

#9 Northernpower

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 06:17 AM

The mpi pump will provide too much pressure for a carb, you'll need to fit a pressure regulating valve to reduce it. I'm surprised you can't find a rolling road in Germany; the SC tuning software is freely available from them, I'd be tempted to look for a rolling road in Germany.

#10 Allrounder

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 06:47 AM

If your trying to set it up without a lambda then I'm not surprised your having trouble with it. Wideband Lambda is a good investment.

Be awhile but when was setting mine up there was a self learn option in the old program but will need the lambda. I know the program (sx tune) has been updated since so I'm not sure it's still in there.

#11 Sprocket

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 06:48 AM

At moment i have not found a rolling road in poland.

The carb and dizzy option just to get back to uk is possible....if the mpi tank and pump is ok? Anyone?..is the pressure ok from the in line tank?

I shall try once more to contact sc. Was going to buy the lambda sensor with plus..but am worried about just checking more money at something i am struggling to set up... :(

 This is what bugs me about SC, they sell the world with their package, but all you get is as good as a carb! You NEED some sort of wideband controller with ANY after market ECU. But before you go an buy anything, see if you can contact someone at http://www.digitun.pl [email protected] and explain your problem. Tell them you got their contact details from me, Sprocket, from the VEMS community forum.

 

I have successfully moved someone from the SC system onto VEMS, and they now no longer wish to set the car on fire

 

As said above however, you can still run the same fuel pump and tank with a carb, but you will need to install a different fuel pressure regulator. A Malpassi 3.5psi unit is what you need, commonly used by the Mini Turbo guys. Available from many places, and Minispares FPR012, which is always handy. Original part ADU6754


Edited by Sprocket, 19 April 2017 - 06:50 AM.


#12 Sprocket

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 07:04 AM

Not knowing where you are in Poland, You could also try Valdas in Lithuania, Highly recommended, well worth the travel if possible. Again Mention me, Sprocket from the VEMS community forum [email protected]



#13 Dusky

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 10:12 AM

Bit off topic, can you adjust the map yourself? I've seen ECU'S where that is possible, I've seen on the fly adjustments been made between 2 racing sessions 30 minutes apart.

#14 Ann-Wilson

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 08:35 PM

Thanks team, have actually made contact with some polish tuners...who have a connection to a guy who maps the mega squirt system. I am thinking this must in the same ball park....they did say they would need a lambda sensor as mentioned above...and asked for specs ( see if they could source one for me???) sounds helpful. Is there a big difference between these things?

On the other side i tried a map from someone with a similar engine setup
..somewhat better the car will tick over by itself now when warm :-) hope car does not catch fire:-S

Sc said they could help me remotely as well so at least i have options now. I shall also contact the polish tuners you mentioned Sprocket:-) Thanks for the help. Stupid thing is now....in 2 years the mini
Will be 30 years old and i could get an h plate in germany ( historic status) wonder if the carb and dizzy will need to go back on for that?

#15 Northernpower

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 08:41 PM

Thanks team, have actually made contact with some polish tuners...who have a connection to a guy who maps the mega squirt system. I am thinking this must in the same ball park....they did say they would need a lambda sensor as mentioned above...and asked for specs ( see if they could source one for me???) sounds helpful. Is there a big difference between these things?

On the other side i tried a map from someone with a similar engine setup
..somewhat better the car will tick over by itself now when warm :-) hope car does not catch fire:-S

Sc said they could help me remotely as well so at least i have options now. I shall also contact the polish tuners you mentioned Sprocket:-) Thanks for the help. Stupid thing is now....in 2 years the mini
Will be 30 years old and i could get an h plate in germany ( historic status) wonder if the carb and dizzy will need to go back on for that?

SC do a lambda sensor kit which plugs directly into their ECU, I'd email them about it.




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