Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

Replacing Front Subframe Mounts


Best Answer whistler , 29 May 2017 - 09:26 AM

first things first.
 
NEVER jack on the floor it is not strong enough.
 
to change the pear drop undo bolts and lever body away from subframe. simples. no need to jack the car up at all. maybe drive it up some ramps to give a bit more room.

Be aware that there might be body washers being used as spacers with the teardrop mount and you might wonder what dropped on the floor when you remove the old ones. Go to the full post


  • Please log in to reply
13 replies to this topic

#1 Sovereign01

Sovereign01

    Stage One Kit Fitted

  • Noobies
  • PipPipPip
  • 76 posts
  • Location: Shropshire

Posted 28 May 2017 - 11:35 PM

Hi, it's me again!

 

My goal is to get my Mini through its MOT (most of the things that need doing are now done), one of the last things on the list was play in the front subframe mount (offside). I've managed to undo the two bolts- the upper one was a real pain in the ass because I had to move the plastic air duct and screen wash bottle to reach.

 

The problem I've got is that I don't know how to jack the car up in such a way that the weight isn't holding everything in place. This is the part I'm trying to replace:

 

http://minispares.co...|Back to search

 

Both the existing and new parts have the metal 'stud' (visible in the second product picture) I need to separate the mounting from the body by a few mm. Presumably I need to take out the bolts from both mounts (I bought a pair), what's the best way of doing this? Because I needed to repair the floor using P38 and P40 it's not strong enough to be used as a jacking point.



#2 nicklouse

nicklouse

    Moved Into The Garage

  • TMF+ Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 17,900 posts
  • Location: Not Yorkshire
  • Local Club: Anonyme Miniholiker

Posted 28 May 2017 - 11:44 PM

first things first.

 

NEVER jack on the floor it is not strong enough.

 

to change the pear drop undo bolts and lever body away from subframe. simples. no need to jack the car up at all. maybe drive it up some ramps to give a bit more room.



#3 whistler

whistler

    Camshaft & Stage Two Head

  • TMF+ Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,700 posts
  • Location: Cardiff

Posted 29 May 2017 - 09:26 AM   Best Answer

first things first.
 
NEVER jack on the floor it is not strong enough.
 
to change the pear drop undo bolts and lever body away from subframe. simples. no need to jack the car up at all. maybe drive it up some ramps to give a bit more room.

Be aware that there might be body washers being used as spacers with the teardrop mount and you might wonder what dropped on the floor when you remove the old ones.

#4 cal844

cal844

    Crazy About Mini's

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 9,482 posts
  • Location: Ballingry, Fife
  • Local Club: TFMOC

Posted 29 May 2017 - 09:29 AM

Repaired the floor with filler and fibreglass.... Why not weld it?

#5 Cooperman

Cooperman

    Uncle Cooperman, Voted Mr TMF 2011

  • TMF+ Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 23,014 posts
  • Location: Cambs.
  • Local Club: MCR, HAMOC, Chelmsford M.C.

Posted 29 May 2017 - 10:50 AM

The first thing you need to do is to get the flor properly repaired by welding in new metal. Filler/GRP is not the way to do it and will have reduced the strength of the car.

 

Only when the flor is correctly repaired should the sub-frame mount be changed.



#6 Wim Fournier

Wim Fournier

    Mini Mad

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 177 posts
  • Location: Maarssen

Posted 29 May 2017 - 12:56 PM

With filler in the floor, you won't get your Mini Motted.



#7 CityEPete

CityEPete

    Up Into Fourth

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,920 posts
  • Location: On my soapbox....

Posted 29 May 2017 - 07:26 PM

P38 and P40 :-O

#8 tiger99

tiger99

    Crazy About Mini's

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,584 posts
  • Location: Hemel Hempstead

Posted 29 May 2017 - 08:30 PM

As said, the floor is required by law to be repaired by welding. No exceptions. And even then, only continuous seam welds if part of a panel is replaced, to make it one continuous piece of metal again. Plug welds may be used instead of spots at original joints. The MOT Terters Manual is freely available on line, and will confirm what I said.

If the floor is in good order, the angle where the floor meets the bulkhead is very strong. Remember that not only is it an angle, but double flanges. A piece of 4 by 2 timber placed across the car allows you to lift it with one Jack at the centre and then put an axle stand under each end. Done that MANY times and nothing bent or broke. One snag, the exhaust is in the way. Two workarounds, remove it or add a double about 18 inches to 2 feet long, to each end of the 4 by 2, leaving a gap in the middle to clear the exhaust.

#9 Sovereign01

Sovereign01

    Stage One Kit Fitted

  • Noobies
  • PipPipPip
  • 76 posts
  • Location: Shropshire

Posted 31 May 2017 - 04:55 PM

 

first things first.
 
NEVER jack on the floor it is not strong enough.
 
to change the pear drop undo bolts and lever body away from subframe. simples. no need to jack the car up at all. maybe drive it up some ramps to give a bit more room.

Be aware that there might be body washers being used as spacers with the teardrop mount and you might wonder what dropped on the floor when you remove the old ones.

Apologies for the delay in replying, some more details; the parts of the floor I worked on (due to rust) were the corners adjoining the bottom of the 'A' panels, it was when I was doing this work that I found a chunk of fibreglass from where presumably the previous owner had made a similar repair. I've always known that the 'official' jacking points by the door hinges were no good- I had to use a rubber mallet to hammer down where the metal had flexed inward.

 

Hence when jacking up the front I've put the jack under the front subframe. As luck would have it I do have access to a couple of ramps I can put the car on, hopefully with the weight on the wheels instead it might make the difference. I'll need to rope in some help as I cannot generate enough force by myself using one arm on the lever and the other on the mount- I can move it enough so it spins freely about the stud, just not quite able to remove it completely. So close...

 

That would certainly explain where the mysterious washer came from that appeared when I took out the bolts since I'm sure I got all of them! :D



#10 Cooperman

Cooperman

    Uncle Cooperman, Voted Mr TMF 2011

  • TMF+ Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 23,014 posts
  • Location: Cambs.
  • Local Club: MCR, HAMOC, Chelmsford M.C.

Posted 31 May 2017 - 07:00 PM

Sorry to have to say it, but it sounds like you have the usual rust issues with front floor and inner sills.

This requires detailed investigation followed by rectification by welding in replacement panel as necessary.

The car may be structurally unsound at present - a fairly normal situation for un-restored classic cars.

#11 tiger99

tiger99

    Crazy About Mini's

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,584 posts
  • Location: Hemel Hempstead

Posted 01 June 2017 - 11:46 AM

The things by the door hinges are NOT jacking points! Many a Mini has sustained severe floor damage when someone, often a tyre fitter, uses them as such. They are slinging shoes, for moving a bare shell around the factory. If the car is fully assembled with engine etc they are far too weak to support it. Best removed during restoration work so they can't be abused in the future.

The actual jacking points are in the sills near the seat crossmember and in a car that is in good order they are solid and reliable. Some people don't believe that and insist on taking them out, but along with the hidden part of the slinging shoe reinforcements inside the sills they do add stiffness and structural integrity.

The teardrop mounts where the large washers could have been used are at the very front corners of the car. Someone may also have added them to the toeboard area as a worthless bodge.

I have to concur with Coopernan that the car at the moment may have serious structural problems, and should not be driven until repaired properly. But please post as many pictures as possible and we will try to help.


Edited by Cooperman, 02 June 2017 - 11:19 AM.


#12 Cooperman

Cooperman

    Uncle Cooperman, Voted Mr TMF 2011

  • TMF+ Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 23,014 posts
  • Location: Cambs.
  • Local Club: MCR, HAMOC, Chelmsford M.C.

Posted 02 June 2017 - 11:21 AM

Oh, the joys of classic car ownership  :D .

 

Welding and painting, then welding and painting some more!



#13 tiger99

tiger99

    Crazy About Mini's

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,584 posts
  • Location: Hemel Hempstead

Posted 02 June 2017 - 02:42 PM

And then, eventually, the joys of driving it for a few more years, which is something to think about when up to your neck in rust!



#14 Sovereign01

Sovereign01

    Stage One Kit Fitted

  • Noobies
  • PipPipPip
  • 76 posts
  • Location: Shropshire

Posted 02 June 2017 - 05:15 PM

I managed to replace the mounts in the end, as suggested I took a tyre lever to separate the body and subframe by a few mm- the driver side was much more difficult due to having to move the air duct and washer bottle (being an '89) and still only having enough room to use an offset ring spanner instead of a full size socket for the upper bolt.

 

The washer bottle leaks between the motor/pump and the bottle itself when moved- hopefully one of these will help: http://minispares.co...c/BAU2043A.aspx

 

I do have some pictures which I'm in the process of uploading, though not from the car itself (I'll take those later). Comparison of the old and new mounts:

 

20170601_113630.jpg

20170601_113621.jpg

20170601_113616.jpg

 

The jug of blue liquid in the background is the screenwash I decanted from the washer bottle.


Edited by Sovereign01, 02 June 2017 - 05:56 PM.





1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users