68 replies to this topic

[Archived1]

Youre just arguing for the sake of it now.

Politics is very devisive and often brings out both the best and the worst in people.

You picked and picked to get a rise out of people throughout this thread where we tried to keep it on point.

My views are my own and I havent torn into anyone else for theirs. Each to his/her own but dont twist my words of opinions to suit your own agenda please.

Ill leave it there and move away from the keyboard lol

Edited by Elf is a mini, 11 March 2018 - 04:21 PM.

[Icey]

You picked and picked to get a rise out of people throughout this thread where we tried to keep it on point.

I'm not trying to take it off topic, I'm interested in what people are basing their vote on, leave or remain. Yours are interesting because anyone reading your posts would assume you'd voted leave - that's why I wanted to get to the bottom of them. If doing so caused offensive then you have my sincere apologies. 

 

And I'm just following orders....
 

for the sake of the forum we should be encouraging members to post topics of interest, not shutting further discussion down whether for Leave or Remain.

[Mito]

I never voted to leave so you cant twist my words about maintaining British values. My point is that I dont care who you are, what colour you are but if you come here dont tell me I cant call a Christmas tree a Christmas tree! Its merry Christmas and not happy festivities.

There was a "story" regarding cadburys rebranding Easter eggs as gesture eggs. This of course led to a furious reaction from people who didn't stop to think for themselves as they would surely have quickly noticed that something was a miss since there was no newspaper named and it was clearly a hoax.

Even when these stories are based on some truth, you generally find it is some apologetic far left native numb skull who has come up with the idea to apologise in some way for our ancestors past indiscretions (I'm sure some would even take offence at me using that word to describe some of the abhorrent acts) as if we should in some way be held accountable for them. The far right then jump on it claiming its the immigrants calling for it and Stoke up the fire. Rinse and repeat.

If things don't change I think we one where this is heading...

[mab01uk]

 

Voting brexit to control immigration is odd in my view. More people now come to the UK then leave from OUTSIDE the EU.

 
Which is 100% controllable by our government with no EU involvement. And yet they don't change anything, why is that? The obvious answer as has been borne out by the economic stats is that immigration is a net positive.
 
So if it's not economics which is driving people to want an end to freedom of movement, what is it? Before answering, if your answer contains 'British Culture', you have to define what that means - no nebulous, wavy handed nonsense from times of old (I know Cooperman loves a good yarn about yesteryear) an actual description of what it means to be British and why a European (or any other race) doesn't fit.

the right wing media. Shameful

I ask again - who do we trust? We've already ruled out the BBC, who else should I add to the list?

 

 

The BBC recently produced a Panorama update (see link below to watch) about the problems of non-EU migration in Blackburn, Lancashire.......do we trust what it said has happened in the town over the last 10 years since the original programme was first aired in 2007? If this documentary report is true (because it was from the BBC?) it is bound to worry many people if the same was to happen with unchecked EU migration into the UK by it happening too quickly to enable people on both sides to happily mix, adapt and integrate with the existing community and 'British Culture".

 

Best to watch the complete BBC Panorama programme below (30 minutes) before commenting.

"In 2007 Panorama made a programme in Blackburn, which was becoming segregated along ethnic and religious lines. Now Panorama has returned and found a town that is even more divided. Some parts of Blackburn are almost entirely Muslim Asian, while other parts are only lived in by white residents. This kind of social segregation has been described as a national crisis, despite decades of government policy aimed at bringing people together. So why do such divisions persist? Panorama visits one town to answer that question and illustrate the impact of social segregation on local communities."

http://www.bbc.co.uk...rammes/b09pz718

Edited by mab01uk, 22 February 2018 - 08:06 PM.

[CityEPete]

I don't really get patriotism, I never have and I'm not a christian so I don't feel a need to protect Britain as a christian country, I didn't choose to be born here, nor did anyone else :-D

[mab01uk]

A vote for Italexit?

 

Italian election results: EU minister admits M5S and Lega victory 'VERY BAD' for Brussels

"The result of the Italian Election is likely to concern Brussels who will fear a coalition led by the M5S will demand major reforms to the EU. Over 50 percent of the Italian electorate have voted for eurosceptic parties with the M5S, Lega and Fratelli d’Italia all campaigning on anti-EU tickets. While their positions are varied, all have severely criticised the impact of the euro on Italy's economy."

https://www.express....ean-Union-video

Edited by mab01uk, 05 March 2018 - 11:18 PM.

[Cooperman]

Now one can see why the Eurocrats are so reluctant to see the UK make a success of 'escaping' from their clutches. Others may well wish to follow. Italy and Greece are likely candidates and even the Netherlands has 'ominous rumblings'.

The problem is not the concept of a 'Common Market', which the UK voters voted or in 1975, but the stifling and worrying move to what the EU leaders have openly referred to as 'ever closer union'; i.e. Federalism. They cannot see that the reason the UK voted to leave was because when Cameron had the temerity to ask what many of the other members would have like to ask - for structural changes - he was snubbed in a very public way. It didn't have to be like that, but that was the choice of the un-elected rulers of the EU.

But now the Germans are worried that Trump's proposed duties on foreign cars will hit their big car makers just when they have realised that import tarrifs with the UK will also reduce sales.

[jomaoliveira79]

First I would like to say I'm portuguese and live in Portugal so I have an outside view of the situation and my opinion is that if you were not UK (a former empire ruling country and industrial revolution center) you were better remaining in the EU, but your country (and people) is what it is and therefore to be honest you are better on your own. Your society is unable to accept living on a more federalized UE which is the way things will go in the future.

Edited by jomaoliveira79, 06 March 2018 - 11:44 AM.

[Retroman]

Cooperman has it exactly on song, with very wise words, many of which I was going to use.

Having just found this thread my take is as follows.

I look forward to a vote to go back to the expensive chains of the EU in 2060, but predict that by then the EU will be like me, dead.

 

Thankfully common sense has prevailed, maybe it will be a bit rough for a while but at least we had the choice, unlike when WE had to bail the banks out, and Greece too. The flat earth society have been overruled democratically by the 6^th largest economy in the world. Seen from the pro-EU point of view, the EU elites have been proved right in their belief that the people should never be consulted. It is because of this reluctant capitulation to democracy that the whole edifice is tumbling down. Optimism is now on the horizon…

If the EU is so wonderful why do we have to pay more and more to be part of it…?

Why have many areas of the EU got massive massive unemployment  ?

When we joined the common market it was for free trade and peace, simples. The EU conveniently forgets the Bosnian war.

We did not join for increasingly more controlling financial, legal and or political reasons. It was never explained that the EU was planning where it is now, and why have we not had a vote before?

It is not democratic to have 1 vote in 43 years. I am in my 50’s and have never had a chance to vote.

The EU are obsessed with control freakery and agreements for everything…non of this is productive but restrictive, it merely creates jobs for pen-pushing arse polishing out of touch impractical nosey parkers creating hassle for those of us living in the real world, trying to make a living. One of the fathers of free trade was Richard Cobden….who had a big interest in Sabden. European vision is limited…. Why is it called the single market now?…it has 28 countries, 500 million people …which is great, but short sighted, the rest of the world has over 7 billion people with an increasing market. Why is the Eu so obsessed about individual countries sorting trade deals ? its financially stifling. And who dreamed up tying free trade to free movement of people?, whats the big deal about showing your passport and changing money?, its not done every day, passport control is easier and quicker than trying to speak to your own bank.

   The UK joined the common market in 1973… why has the EU only got a small number of ratified trade agreements with other countries…? It may take the UK 5 years to come to trade agreements with various nations but the EU have had well over 40 years….what the hell have they been doing?

   When we joined we had a big British car industry, huge numbers of fishermen, a British steel industry, many thousands of miners, a significant ship building workforce and a hell of a lot more farmers too….

  How can it be that some UK farmers are currently paid as little as 6 pence for a litre of milk when hundreds of thousands of litres of poor quality milk comes across the channel…? And why were farmers forced to pour milk away with the quota system? there was an alleged milk lake in the EU...we now have a UK shortage. Why were dairy farmers made to pay a super-levy to the Eu for delivering their own milk, in their own bottles, to their own customers?

   Tax avoidance….the EU make all sorts of noises about stamping it out…but a lot of it goes through the Netherlands, Luxemburg and Ireland, without this electronic tax avoidance business where would EU trade figures be…?? Perhaps Junker (one of the EU heads) could help as ex leader of Luxemburg? Was it not Junker who was voted in as the only candidate…? Euro democracy in action.

Despite us not being a part of the euro, we still had to cough up 6 billion to bail Greece out did we not?

   The EU is unknowingly (?) trying to destroy what has taken many hundreds of years to create…countries with borders, different languages, cultures and currencies. Each individual country has a different economy running at a different speed and rate, each has different industries, different strengths and weaknesses. Each goes through different economic cycles with different tax and public spending policies, and on top differing political beliefs and objectives…they can NEVER all be made to work the same way simultaneously, it is fundamentally unsustainable, ask the Ottomans, Romans…and maybe the Germans too. The whole EU is trying the same armed with undemocratic paperwork.

   The EU is trying to recreate the existing economy; the international need for goods, services and labour are all there, with or without the EU, this is much more relevant in today’s internet age. All the EU does is makes it more complicated, in an undemocratic unaccounted manner, and takes a slice of how many billions from 4 or 5 countries ?…including the UK, and we pay over 10% of the EU’s “income”. Have the EU accounts ever been audited…?   Why not?

Another is the unlevel playing field as we in the UK apply the letter of the law, it does not work that way in the rest of the EU.

The EU or ‘single market’ is supposed to protect consumers with high quality standards on all goods, including imports…why then is Britain flooded with cheap, nasty, poor quality and dangerous products produced in the far east…? Some of them made using child labour too.

Environmental protection is another big EU noise…they have made regulations so tight that car companies are fudging emission tests on cars. Catalytic converters are another phalacy to increase fuel consumption, and create metal pollution. Many modern cars only have a life of about 8 years, which is poor, and bad for the environment for many reasons, yet many perfectly good classic cars have been consigned to the scrap heap unnecessarily, to bolster new car production, and where did the £2000 come from for each one scrapped ? EU money…, no such thing.

Oh yes EU money, but the money in the EU comes from the 4 or 5 biggest economies, as the EU actually has no money. But is happy to interfere in how our rebate is spent and give the impression it is giving money to the UK, which is blatantly untrue, and only believed by those who think gullible is not in the dictionary.

How can Britain be stronger with only 1 vote in 28..?

Surely we are better off representing our own interests around the world  ?

Since 1973 the UK has paid over £378,800,000,000 into the EU project, £23,368,000 per DAY !! That averages to over 8.5 billion per year, our 2016 contribution was over £13 billion so its actually increasing....until 2019.

 

Believe in some of what you see, and non of what you hear, stick a fork in there ass turn them over they’re done.

The Beurocrap gravy train has been derailed.

[Retroman]

Mmm 3 1/2 days and no replies....

 

Another £124,657,534 to prop the Eu up since the post above (at last years rate)

 

Amazing.

[Homersimpson]

Retroman, I dont think you have had any responses because your post summed it all up.

 

The EU can't let this go well for the UK as if it does others will follow and the whole gravy train comes crashing down.

 

Whilst Is suspect things will be difficult for the next 10-15 years after that we will be back in a good strong position and the masters of our own destiny.

 

Unfortunately those on the remain side can't accept that the vote from the majority was leave, looking back it seems that the remain campaign didn't really try before the election because they though they couldn't lose and are now kicking themselves for not trying harder and moaning about the public being mislead by the leave campaign.  

[Retroman]

Thanks Homer you are correct, its the usual Eu scenario stuck between a rock and a hard place when they should not be there at all, acting like a dinosaur on tranquilizers.

I think give it 5 years we will be fine, it will be a lot less traumatic than the banking crisis that still reverberates from 10 years ago, which was unseen and caused by pretty much the same expert crew who predicted the end of the world with both the euro and eu vote. They don't live in the real world.

 The remain campaign could not ultimately bring anything positive about an undemocratic 43 year old smoke and mirrors experiment that has no benefits to the man on the street, whilst making him pay for it.

[Cooperman]

What has most amazed me is unwillingness of many of the remain camp to accept the democratic vote.
At a general election if the winning party had a majority by 4% would the opposition parties demand another election on the basis that the voters had got it wrong? Of course not.
Even 'commie' Corbyn has accepted that we are leaving.
The remainers need to understand how democracy works. The party/individual/proposal or whatever which receives the majority is the winner. Simples!

[Mito]

Corbyn has always been against the EU. Hence labours lacklustre remain campaign.

Here's to years of being America's female dog...

Edited by Mito, 12 March 2018 - 08:36 PM.

[Archived1]

Tories will mess brexit up by trying to further line their golden nests. The EU sees may for the Joke she is.

I don’t know the answers but I can say with ease that it’s currently a right royal shambles!