14 replies to this topic

[Trissy B]

Hi. Ive been doing a little digging into what Motorsport is going on in the south and it turns out it's quite a bit! Autotests, Autosolo and Sprint.

There's a few options I'm considering but for the moment at least I'm thinking of upgrading the engine in my current 1971 mini whilst keeping it street legal. I would predominantly want to fit in the 1400 Autosolo class but also have the option of sprinting for a bit of fun (Goodwood is only down the road and they hold a few a year).

Been reading the MSA regs in the various areas. it mentions a lot things like " you need such and such unless the car falls in period a-e".

Question is, where is period a-e defined? Can't find it!!!

[nicklouse]

period defined cars are things such as this

Period Defined Vehicles (Non-Rally)

A – (Veteran) Cars built before 1 Jan 1905.

B – (Edwardian) Cars built between 1 Jan 1905 and

31 Dec 1918.

C – (Vintage) Cars built between 1 Jan 1919 and

31 Dec 1930.

D – (Post Vintage Thoroughbred) Cars built between

1 Jan 1931 and 31 Dec 1946.

E – Cars built between 1 Jan 1947 and 31 Dec 1961

(up to 31 Dec 1960 for single seater and two seater

racing cars).

F – Cars built between 1 Jan 1962 and 31 Dec 1965

(from 1 Jan 1961 for single seater and two seater

racing cars and up to 31 Dec 1966 for Formula 2).

G – Cars built between 1 Jan 1966 (1 Jan 1964 for

Formula 3) and 31 Dec 1971 that are no longer

eligible for current Competition.

H – Cars built between 1 Jan 1972 and 31 Dec 1976

that are no longer eligible for current Competition.

 

but as to what you are asking it may be better if you give the particular section paragraph etc...

[Trissy B]

Hi Nick, thank you - where does it say that? Anyway... "A-E" does not relate to me then!

 

For Example: in S

10. All Sprint & Hill Climb vehicles must comply with the following, as a minimum: Safety
10.1.1. Roll-over Safety Bars K.1 to 1.8, except for cars of Periods A – E.

 

As I have a one piece fiberglass flip front, I assume I would be in a "Modified Series Production Cars" class because of that.

[nicklouse]

Hi Nick, thank you - where does it say that? Anyway... "A-E" does not relate to me then!

 

For Example: in S

10. All Sprint & Hill Climb vehicles must comply with the following, as a minimum: Safety
10.1.1. Roll-over Safety Bars K.1 to 1.8, except for cars of Periods A – E.

 

As I have a one piece fiberglass flip front, I assume I would be in a "Modified Series Production Cars" class because of that.

ahhh you have now learnt the first part of reading the Blue Book. Keep going until the end of the paragraph.

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[Allrounder]

As I have a one piece fiberglass flip front, I assume I would be in a "Modified Series Production Cars" class because of that.[/quote]

I'd say so. That's the problem with crossing over from one discipline to another with a slightly modified car.

Your doing the right thing though reading and following the blue book but I'd also be looks at s/r of particular events you want to do.

[nicklouse]

one thing i would say is build to one set of regs in your head. then build to another set of regs in your head then see what the difference is Ok on paper is easier. then it is easy to see where things dont quite match and maybe the 1380 would be better as say a 1293....

 

but as a starting car dont spend too much just do what you must and then go and have fun. so cage. FHR device, harness and Helmet and fire proofs and timing strut.

[Trissy B]

I'm signed up for an autosolo at brands hatch next month and I noticed the regs are a bit more strict than the blue book (which is very broad in autosolo). Seems like the flipfront again might put me from class A historic into E special!

I haven't got to the end of the cages section but am I right in thinking a rear cage is all that's required for sprinting? but a full one is recommended?

Your totally right Nick and I will probably give it a go next year with the minimum stuff then decide if I want to build anything fancier.

[rally1380]

I haven't got to the end of the cages section but am I right in thinking a rear cage is all that's required for sprinting? but a full one is recommended?.

A roll cage is not mandatory for sprinting as far as I'm aware....but I bet that does depend on class structure.

A mate of mine sprints and hill climbs his totally standard clio sport trophy....he just changes tyres and away he goes.... No cage.

[ace01]

A cage is not required in the normal production classes, but a fibreglass front will certainly put the car into another class.

[Cooperman]

It would be advisable to re-fit a steel front as a GRP one will lack structural integrity and, although a full cage will ameliorate the risk a bit, it is wise to have a strong car for all competition. It will be cost-effective to do this in overall terms.

Any classic Mini needs to be in the Historic class as modern cars are hard to beat.

I tried with a 1990 Cooper when endurance rallying started - that's up to 1400 cc with a standard engine & gearbox - but it was a real uphill struggle to be even moderately competitive, so I sold it and bough a Rover 214Si. It was cheaper than using a classic and cost a fraction of what a Mini is worth. I was also able to win in the Rover which was a bonus.

Good luck with your start in motor-sport. 

[nicklouse]

But for Hillclimbing and sprinting you want the car as light as possible so anything steel that can be replaced with something lighter is done.

 

it all comes down to what you are doing and what is permissible.

[rally1380]

But for Hillclimbing and sprinting you want the car as light as possible so anything steel that can be replaced with something lighter is done.

it all comes down to what you are doing and what is permissible.

I agree, but also disagree to an extent and think what cooperman has to say is also right.

I suppose what's really matters is what class you want to run in.... If that class allows grp flip front and making the car feather lite then game on. If however it is more prudent to refit the front to allow the OP to run in a class that the mini would be more competitive in then I think the few kilo's added with a steel front would be a good call and save weight elsewhere instead.

It really does depend on which class the OP wants to run in and if they are savy with that class choice. I know not everyone is a pot hunter, but it is nice to go home with an award every now and then.

Edited by rally1380, 31 August 2018 - 07:48 PM.

[Trissy B]

Comments are all interesting advice, thanks.

The fact is that I do have a fibreglass front and it's unlikely I'll be changing it anytime soon.

I think the principal will be to start out with what I have in autosolo and whatever class I end up in. End of next year or so I can always make a longer term desicion to refit a steel front.

To complete in the occasional sprint now, apart from the personal stuff (kit and license), I would only need a strut, 4point harness and cage to put on. I think.

Question is, is a rear cage and diagonal the minimum requirement for modified production class? The regs are still as clear as mud to me!

[Trissy B]

Another question; if the grp removable front was replaced with a removable steel one, would that then fit in the roadgoing production class?

[nicklouse]

Another question; if the grp removable front was replaced with a removable steel one, would that then fit in the roadgoing production class?

 maybe. it could be possible but it depends on other things as well get along to a meeting and talk to a scrutineer. (also the meet could well have some of their own classes that you could fit into).

 

cage Yes please note the min tube specs and materials. there are many cages that are not suitable available.

 

note i would run a diagonal and a front cage with door bars and if you need to use a FHR system then a harness bar is needed as there are no suitable mountings on the Mini.