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When Does A Car Company Become Foreign?


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#1 pusb

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Posted 16 February 2019 - 09:10 PM

After reading on twitter someone confidently proclaiming that there aren't any British car manufacturers left, I felt the need to gauge opinion on this. Ask most people in Britain today what major car companies are still British and they will tell you none. Is that true? If we look at the major players:

 

MINI - Considered now to be German despite being designed (at least partly) and built in Britain.

 

Jaguar - Foreign owned, despite being designed and built in Britain, and Jaguar Cars Ltd being a UK registered company, worldwide headquarters in Britain.

 

Land Rover - As above

 

Bentley - Similar to JLR, foreign owned designed and built in the UK, UK registered company, UK worldwide headquarters

 

Vauxhall - Foreign owned, foreign designed, some UK built, UK registered company

 

Rolls-Royce - Foreign owned, UK designed and built, UK registered company, UK headquarters.

 

 

So people tend to class these as no longer being British because the parent company is foreign.

 

But why then are we not consistent with this about car manufacturers in other countries?

 

 

For instance, people will claim that Seat is Spanish (its parent company is German),

 

Volvo is Swedish (its parent company is Chinese, the same company in fact that owns the London Taxi Company),

 

Fiat and Chrysler are Italian and American (their parent company is based in the Netherlands),

 

Saab was Swedish (its parent company was American).

 

 

So how is it that Seat is still considered to be a Spanish car manufacturer, when JLR isn't considered to be British?



#2 Curley

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Posted 16 February 2019 - 09:18 PM

Morgan is still British



#3 nicklouse

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Posted 16 February 2019 - 09:24 PM

there are no UK main car makers.  there are a few small ones but they do source some big parts from none UK makes.

 

there are none that will not be effected by leaving the single market. i expect no more new models to be made in the UK.



#4 pusb

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Posted 16 February 2019 - 09:27 PM

there are no UK main car makers.  there are a few small ones but they do source some big parts from none UK makes.

 

there are none that will not be effected by leaving the single market. i expect no more new models to be made in the UK.

 

So why then do we consider Seat to be Spainsh, Volvo to be Swedish, Fiat to be Italian etc?



#5 Ethel

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Posted 16 February 2019 - 11:54 PM

Isn't it still the same?

BMC made cars overseas, what made them British was the design, research and development being done in the UK along with other core bits of business that were still necessary for the company to operate even if they had only one production plant.

I think cars will still be made in the UK as there's a large enough domestic market for manufacturers to care about staying on the right side of local content regulations for tariffs etc.

#6 pusb

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 12:03 AM

Isn't it still the same?

BMC made cars overseas, what made them British was the design, research and development being done in the UK along with other core bits of business that were still necessary for the company to operate even if they had only one production plant.

I think cars will still be made in the UK as there's a large enough domestic market for manufacturers to care about staying on the right side of local content regulations for tariffs etc.

 

 

It is the same, that's my opinion.

 

I find it curious as to how we in Britain consider Seat to be Spanish whilst owned by VW, but Bentley to be German because its owned by VW.



#7 pusb

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 12:04 AM

Isn't it still the same?

BMC made cars overseas, what made them British was the design, research and development being done in the UK along with other core bits of business that were still necessary for the company to operate even if they had only one production plant.

I think cars will still be made in the UK as there's a large enough domestic market for manufacturers to care about staying on the right side of local content regulations for tariffs etc.

 

And your right about the design, research and development part. An because of that I wouldn't really consider Vauxhall cars to be British 



#8 nicklouse

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 12:23 AM

 

there are no UK main car makers.  there are a few small ones but they do source some big parts from none UK makes.

 

there are none that will not be effected by leaving the single market. i expect no more new models to be made in the UK.

 

So why then do we consider Seat to be Spainsh, Volvo to be Swedish, Fiat to be Italian etc?

 

do you?

 

seat lo-grade VW Audi hi-grade VW, Porsche posh VW. Bugatti .....

 

Volvo is actually Swedish with Chinese money. Mini can be non UK just like that. there is nothing keeping it in the UK. most engine parts in a MINI cross the Chanel more than 4 times. 

 

just about all cars are currently European. SUVs and trucks less so as their market is not Europe.



#9 pusb

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 12:37 AM

 

 

there are no UK main car makers.  there are a few small ones but they do source some big parts from none UK makes.

 

there are none that will not be effected by leaving the single market. i expect no more new models to be made in the UK.

 

So why then do we consider Seat to be Spainsh, Volvo to be Swedish, Fiat to be Italian etc?

 

do you?

 

seat lo-grade VW Audi hi-grade VW, Porsche posh VW. Bugatti .....

 

Volvo is actually Swedish with Chinese money. Mini can be non UK just like that. there is nothing keeping it in the UK. most engine parts in a MINI cross the Chanel more than 4 times. 

 

just about all cars are currently European. SUVs and trucks less so as their market is not Europe.

 

 

I consider Seat as Spanish as much as MINI to be British, but I am on about the general consensus of society.

 

Volvo is a Swedish as London Taxi's are British. Do you consider The London Taxi Company to be a British car manufacturer? 



#10 mab01uk

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 09:54 AM

Speak to any non car enthusiast and most don't know or care where there car was made or designed, if they are aware of the national heritage of the brand then they are often many years out of date on who actually owns it today.

 

I was recently talking to an Audi owner of many years who was just about to buy a new one but was totally unaware that VW, Audi, Seat, Skoda, Porsche and Bugatti are all part of the same group of companies and share many of their vehicle platforms, engines and components across the whole range.

 

Car Mechanics magazine recently compared the spare parts prices from VW, Audi, Skoda and Seat dealers finding that very often the same part in a different branded box varies in price depending what dealership you are buying it from. eg. Audi customers often pay more for exactly the same part which is available cheaper from the Seat or Skoda parts department down the road.......

The magazine produced a useful table cross referencing many of the part numbers so a home mechanic could more easily source some of his more expensive Audi parts cheaper from the local Seat or Skoda Dealership. :lol:

They have since done similar research on several other car brands which share components across platforms and components. (eg. Some BMW parts common to the MINI are cheaper from the MINI parts price list. Some Mercedes car parts are common and cheaper in the Mercedes Commercial Van parts listings, etc).


Edited by mab01uk, 17 February 2019 - 09:55 AM.


#11 Ethel

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 10:15 AM

You could flip the question and ask why it matters, if it does.



#12 Carlos W

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 11:23 AM

Seats are full of parts which have mulitiple VAG labels on.

The seat belts have VW Audi Skoda and seat badges on, its the same as many other components.

Many cars in the range are similar across the manufactureres

#13 nicklouse

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 12:35 PM

Seats are full of parts which have mulitiple VAG labels on.

The seat belts have VW Audi Skoda and seat badges on, its the same as many other components.

Many cars in the range are similar across the manufactureres

and as can also be often seen you will find parts common over different makes aswell, the Lower arms on my Suzuki are the same as the ones on some Vauxhall cars.

 

as has been touched above why do we still have Vauxhall when the same car was a Opel in Ireland. Simples the people would not consider a German car before a British car back in the 70s



#14 humph

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 01:58 PM


 

Car Mechanics magazine recently compared the spare parts prices from VW, Audi, Skoda and Seat dealers finding that very often the same part in a different branded box varies in price depending what dealership you are buying it from. eg. Audi customers often pay more for exactly the same part which is available cheaper from the Seat or Skoda parts department down the road.......

The magazine produced a useful table cross referencing many of the part numbers so a home mechanic could more easily source some of his more expensive Audi parts cheaper from the local Seat or Skoda Dealership. :lol:

 

When I ran a Skoda as a daily a few years back I always struggled to get the car booked in for service work at the dealer, the reason was that the workshop was always full of Audis getting serivced at Skoda prices.  Oddly I never had a single issue with that Skoda, but the VWs I've had with the same engines have been problematic.Oh and the Skoda dealers customoer service was great, the VW dealers have been very very poor and very arrogant.


Edited by humph, 17 February 2019 - 01:59 PM.


#15 Curley

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Posted 17 February 2019 - 10:12 PM

 

 

Car Mechanics magazine recently compared the spare parts prices from VW, Audi, Skoda and Seat dealers finding that very often the same part in a different branded box varies in price depending what dealership you are buying it from. eg. Audi customers often pay more for exactly the same part which is available cheaper from the Seat or Skoda parts department down the road.......

The magazine produced a useful table cross referencing many of the part numbers so a home mechanic could more easily source some of his more expensive Audi parts cheaper from the local Seat or Skoda Dealership. :lol:

 

When I ran a Skoda as a daily a few years back I always struggled to get the car booked in for service work at the dealer, the reason was that the workshop was always full of Audis getting serivced at Skoda prices.  Oddly I never had a single issue with that Skoda, but the VWs I've had with the same engines have been problematic.Oh and the Skoda dealers customoer service was great, the VW dealers have been very very poor and very arrogant.

 

That's because your Skoda is Czech - lol






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