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Popping Out Of Fourth And Now Crunching Into 2Nd.


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#31 Shooter63

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Posted 26 April 2019 - 06:42 AM

What does the "W" mean above? Thanks.


It was forged into the baulk ring

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#32 alex-95

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Posted 12 May 2019 - 07:15 PM

So following up on this, I ordered another set of baulkrings from another supplier, long story short I received 2 new ones and 4 used ones, 1 new one and 2 used ones were in my opinion usable. I rebuilt the gearbox adding a shim to the main double roller bearing to space the gears out a bit. Got everything fitted and back in the car, it doesn't crunch in any gears anymore but does slip out of fourth  :mmkay:. The gearbox is now back apart and I'm deciding what to do next. I'm pretty sure it's not the gear selector at fault as I had the same selector when the 998 was in and that didn't slip out of gear. I think it could be the synchro hub at fault. Unfortunately 4th gear has taken a bit of a battering from slipping out so need to swap that and I think my new selector fork is badly worn as well.

 

I've stripped my last spare gearbox (5th one), it seems to go into gears better than the one that slips out of 4th so was planning on rebuilding this gearbox instead for a minute. First problem is that the idler bearing has disintegrated, 1. knackering the idler gear shim faces on the G/Box and transfer case and 2. the rollers and cage have gone into the gearbox (see photos). I can't see any marks on the gears though. Second problem is that I think the moly faces are non existent.

 

LJLE6zI.jpg?1

 

EhpHeta.jpg

 

 

 

 

So basically are these gears usable or not? regarding the moly surface and also the teeth(3rd and 4th teeth look ok, 1st and 2nd teeth don't to me) I've got 3 weekends to rebuild a gearbox so that I can get to Beaulieu mini day.

 

4th - no moly surface?

tl002Tv.jpg

 

X9gLUD1.jpg

g0hx4QI.jpg

 

3rd - moly face looks ok to me 

3ONSrCe.jpg

 

 

 2nd

r5A9Gkx.jpg

ygkztmu.jpg

35nBRU4.jpg

 

1st

AXZvMND.jpg

X9gLUD1.jpg

AXZvMND.jpg

 

Reverse looks like a paper weight to me?

 

nHkBGxW.jpg

fsfkMCw.jpg

 

 

I've got 2 more 4th gears but a slight bit of rust has formed on the internal bearing surface, Would these be ok to use or would this shorted the life of the bearing?

uiYlS3e.jpg

zL0W8EF.jpg

 

 

 

Cheers Alex

 

I'm not sure if this will help but I have it on good authority that the only baulk rings to use are either the John Guess ones, minispares evo ones or if you can find either NOS or good used 3 synchro W ones

Shooter

I spoke to John guess at a show and he had some good baulkrings, he also had some similar to the ones I purchased from southlakeland minis. He also had a bag of mini spares ones with him.

 

 

 



#33 alex-95

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Posted 13 May 2019 - 02:12 PM

Bump

#34 Spider

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Posted 13 May 2019 - 07:13 PM

Alex, none of those gears look any good to me. The 1st motion shaft is karput from the damage to the bearing surface. It's clearly had a dreadful life that particular box and it wouldn't surprise me if there was water in the Oil at some point.

 

In regards to your box still jumping out of Top, it's likely that the dogs on the 1st Motion shaft have rounded off, in which case, it will never hold gear. I've noticed they only need to jump out half a dozen times on load before this occurs. I can't recall if you posted photos of that previously. Knowing these late gearboxes, it's likely that there wasn't enough overshoot in the shift rod / fork in the first place which lead to this problem first occuring.



#35 alex-95

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Posted 13 May 2019 - 07:38 PM

Alex, none of those gears look any good to me. The 1st motion shaft is karput from the damage to the bearing surface. It's clearly had a dreadful life that particular box and it wouldn't surprise me if there was water in the Oil at some point.

 

In regards to your box still jumping out of Top, it's likely that the dogs on the 1st Motion shaft have rounded off, in which case, it will never hold gear. I've noticed they only need to jump out half a dozen times on load before this occurs. I can't recall if you posted photos of that previously. Knowing these late gearboxes, it's likely that there wasn't enough overshoot in the shift rod / fork in the first place which lead to this problem first occuring.

Cheers mate, didn't think they would be but worth asking. Yeah definitely had a hard life, I can't understand how the idler bearing got that bad :lol: must have been making quite a noise. The bullrings on the other hand look very good, will double check them but look way better than the new ones I've been sent.

 

I think they were sharpish, just not now >_<

 

I'm not sure whether to chance another second hand box or get a new gear, from minispares...



#36 Spider

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Posted 14 May 2019 - 07:51 AM

I may have been lucky over the years but most used boxes I've bought while in need of an overhaul and sometimes the small odd repair, the gears and all the expensive bits have been quite usable.



#37 alex-95

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Posted 14 May 2019 - 06:09 PM

I may have been lucky over the years but most used boxes I've bought while in need of an overhaul and sometimes the small odd repair, the gears and all the expensive bits have been quite usable.

Think I'm just unlucky  :lol:. There are some usable parts over the 6 i've got and haven't spent much on the spares really £25 each for 3 of them, £32 for a complete 998 engine and gearbox. going to try my luck on another second hand and then if that's no good I'll buy new gears.



#38 alex-95

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Posted 11 June 2019 - 06:59 PM

some baulk rings  that I saw at one of the traders at Beaulieu mini cooper day at the weekend

9DZn382.jpg

dUL8Uq7.jpg

 



#39 Rorf

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Posted 12 June 2019 - 03:32 PM

Those bulk rings look shot.

 

Unless you tried them on a new gear cone and the gap is more than 1mm.

 

The original steel bulk rings had a flatter thread profile verses the cheap sintered type with a pointy thread profile.


Edited by Rorf, 12 June 2019 - 03:39 PM.


#40 Spider

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Posted 12 June 2019 - 08:25 PM

Those bulk rings look shot.

 

Unless you tried them on a new gear cone and the gap is more than 1mm.

 

The original steel bulk rings had a flatter thread profile verses the cheap sintered type with a pointy thread profile.

 

I agree with Rorf here. The grooves are not deep enough for my liking. They may work fine with a light Oil but the usual 20W50 will give slow shifts.



#41 alex-95

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Posted 12 June 2019 - 08:39 PM

 

Those bulk rings look shot.

 

Unless you tried them on a new gear cone and the gap is more than 1mm.

 

The original steel bulk rings had a flatter thread profile verses the cheap sintered type with a pointy thread profile.

 

I agree with Rorf here. The grooves are not deep enough for my liking. They may work fine with a light Oil but the usual 20W50 will give slow shifts.

 

Yeah the grooves weren't very deep at all, I think they had them for sale at £8.50, there are photos of their 'genuine' ones on previous posts in this thread.

 

While I'm thinking about it, I rebuilt the gearbox once more, different synchro hub and selector fork and also changed the clearance between the selector levers (between the top hat bit and the washer). It stopped the G/Box from slipping out of 4th but crunches into 2nd gear again. I think it could be the baulkring (even though it measured and looked good but could it be the selector levers not having enough clearance?  So is there certain amount of clearance to be had in the selector levers? I measured the height of the pivot bush and then the lever assembly there was 0.45mm difference to begin with, measuring a spare one I have there was a 0.25mm gap, I swapped parts around to get about 0.1mm of difference (but could be less if the washer squishes), it moved freely so think it's ok but may need more clearance?






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