Starter Motor Issues.
#1
Posted 04 July 2020 - 08:13 PM
#2
Posted 04 July 2020 - 08:20 PM
first off non Verto should use an inertia starter. verto used the pre engage.
pre engage has a starter relay that has been known to fail.
inertia just has the solenoid.
yes connecting a battery directly to the terminal and the case should get it to kick into life. but 12.5 is a bit low. but should do something.
I would also be counting flywheel teeth.
#3
Posted 04 July 2020 - 08:48 PM
#4
Posted 04 July 2020 - 09:31 PM
#5
Posted 04 July 2020 - 10:24 PM
The clutch isn't an absolute indicator of the starter type. Metros started out with pre-verto clutches & I can't remember if the clutches or starters changed first.
Anyway, the ring gears are can be changed and pre-verto clutches were the choice for performance modded cars. The ring gear teeth are chamfered to aid meshing with the drive pinions & as inertia motors pull the pinion towards the motor, while pre-engaged push it away from the motor, they should be chamfered on different sides. The chamfer on a pre-engaged ring should be facing the motor mounting hole.
How are you testing your motors?
The body of the motor needs to be earthed. The +ve screw terminal connection with the nut is to the solenoid, the motor itself is powered via the short link cable built in to the motor assembly. You need to energise the solenoid as well, via the large spade terminal, which moves the pinion before connecting the motor to the battery cable screw post internally.
#6
Posted 04 July 2020 - 10:59 PM
How do I tell if I have the right flywheel and starter combination. As i said its an A plus engine but the engine builder put in a pre verto with an orange diaphram. I understand you can use a pre engaged starter with the right flywheel and a pre verto???
it comes down to the number of teeth on the flywheel. inertia starters need 107 teeth ion the flywheel pre engage need 129 teeth. if you have a pre verto with 107 then you need a different starter.
on my build i have a pre verto with 129 teeth and a pre engage starter as that is the way they are when you dont have a separate ring gear.
ring gears can be changed between the flywheels to allow different set ups generally (but not always) incorrect starter and ring gear cause problems.
#7
Posted 05 July 2020 - 08:03 AM
When testing the motor i have been using a pair of jump leads direct to a battery? earthing the body of the motor. Positive to the large connection on the solenoid then a bit of wire to connect positive to the large spade terminal. This should trigger the solenoid and turn the motor. Alternatively grounding the motor and touching the positive jump lead to the lower wire of the solenoid should bipass the solenoid and turn the motor. Neither seem to work. I only have 12.5 v in my spare battery but that should be enough to get a reaction. Nada???
#8
Posted 05 July 2020 - 11:14 AM
Voltage isn't 100% reliable, until you're drawing current it's only part of an indication. Pre engaged solenoids take a bit of effort - you could put the +ve jump lead directly to the spade to test it without the motor.
#9
Posted 05 July 2020 - 03:27 PM
#10
Posted 05 July 2020 - 04:44 PM
#11
Posted 05 July 2020 - 05:38 PM
how long was it on charge? needs a good 24 hours to condition and charge it.
#12
Posted 05 July 2020 - 05:41 PM
You've not mentioned a starter relay. A pre-engaged starter is really too much load for the ignition barrel and likely also too much for the original wiring. You can test if that's the issue by running a wire from the battery terminal on the solenoid directly to the cranking spade terminal. Pliers will be handy as it's liable to get warm & be sure the car's in neutral!
It could also be frayed/poor connections on any battery and/or earth cabling.
#13
Posted 05 July 2020 - 08:59 PM
Thinking about this should I have a relay from my starter button I was assuming that the big load was through the main battery cable. The load through the switch being much less and only on for a few seconds. But should I have a relay in that starter button circuit. Perhaps that circuit has shorted out. Although that would surely smell somewhere and flatten the battery? At a loss.
#14
Posted 05 July 2020 - 11:10 PM
The biggest load is through the battery cable to the actual motor, but a pre-engaged solenoid has quite a bit more to do, in chucking the pinion in to the starter ring, than the wing mounted inertia jobby that's just a big relay really. If there's too much extra resistance, when the motor kicks in, the voltage drop can lead to the solenoid dropping out. That in turn disconnects the motor 'n the cycle starts again giving the classic chattering associated with flat batteries - but not always.
#15
Posted 06 July 2020 - 07:07 AM
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