Jump to content


Photo

R1 Sump Baffle


  • Please log in to reply
24 replies to this topic

#1 YIANO

YIANO

    Mini Mad

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 210 posts

Posted 16 July 2008 - 03:19 AM

yeah i know its not a build topic but before i install my r1 engine in my promo subframe should i buy a sump baffle kit ?
my mini is for road use only
whos using one and who isnt?

#2 dave_b80

dave_b80

    Stage One Kit Fitted

  • Noobies
  • PipPipPip
  • 66 posts

Posted 16 July 2008 - 06:54 AM

yeah i know its not a build topic but before i install my r1 engine in my promo subframe should i buy a sump baffle kit ?
my mini is for road use only
whos using one and who isnt?


ive not got mine on the road yet but ive got a sump baffle for my r1 lump. to be honnest i thought it was pretty much the norm to fit them when using a bike engine in a car / kit car / single seater ect.

dave

#3 Basky

Basky

    Mini Mad

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 265 posts

Posted 16 July 2008 - 09:22 AM

yeah i know its not a build topic but before i install my r1 engine in my promo subframe should i buy a sump baffle kit ?
my mini is for road use only
whos using one and who isnt?


Hi there YIANO

Personaly i wouldnt bother. i dont have a baffle but ur still going to get alot of noise from the exhaust! i would just buy a lot of DYNO mat like i have :D Im telling you myn would float now lol

Myn is for road & track

Good luck with the build ul enjoy it

#4 dave_b80

dave_b80

    Stage One Kit Fitted

  • Noobies
  • PipPipPip
  • 66 posts

Posted 16 July 2008 - 10:05 AM

yeah i know its not a build topic but before i install my r1 engine in my promo subframe should i buy a sump baffle kit ?
my mini is for road use only
whos using one and who isnt?


Hi there YIANO

Personaly i wouldnt bother. i dont have a baffle but ur still going to get alot of noise from the exhaust! i would just buy a lot of DYNO mat like i have :D Im telling you myn would float now lol

Myn is for road & track

Good luck with the build ul enjoy it


sump baffle as in to prevent oil surge in the engine when cornering or braking!!!!!

dave

#5 luke6040

luke6040

    Speeding Along Now

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 449 posts
  • Local Club: na

Posted 16 July 2008 - 05:21 PM

http://www.fluke-mot...products_id=169 for 35 squid you may aswell???
Unless they have a down side?

#6 roofless

roofless

    Sticker Pimp

  • Traders
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,215 posts
  • Local Club: central minis

Posted 16 July 2008 - 06:23 PM

I'm getting one sorted for the new engine. :lol:

The guy that helped me with the bodykit on roofless from a company abbreviated as DARC http://www.dissaccid...l/exotic.paint/

were not only the approved zeemax fitting centre, but also high end pro level sidecar racers, and in their opinion the engine was on a fast road to destruction without the baffled sump. These guys really knew a lot about the R1 engines and I hold them in high respect, others had told me you'll be fine without it, but my recent experiences suggest the boys from DARC may have been right.

I'm not taking the same chance twice. :P

#7 alexcrosse

alexcrosse

    Up Into Fourth

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,786 posts

Posted 16 July 2008 - 08:03 PM

so why did yours blow up?

#8 Pro-motive

Pro-motive

    Just On Tickover

  • Noobies
  • Pip
  • 6 posts

Posted 16 July 2008 - 10:25 PM

The reason most kit cars use a baffled sump is the engine is the opposite way round to the original layout in the bike, our kit keeps the engine as original so it shouldn't be necessary. If the bike can cope with tilting 45 degree's or so each way when cornering hard without oil starvation you'd think it would be ok in the front of a mini. Where as in a rear wheel drive kit car its to prevent surge when doing hard accels/braking etc.

But then its up to you if you think its needed.

Phil

#9 gizmo

gizmo

    Mini Mad

  • Noobies
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 132 posts

Posted 16 July 2008 - 11:06 PM

the problem being that a bike leans into corners, but when in a car its stays verticle, and a nice tight set of "s' turns will definatly cause oil surge. get a baffel and install it, its cheep insurance to save your engine.

#10 YIANO

YIANO

    Mini Mad

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 210 posts

Posted 16 July 2008 - 11:35 PM

hmmm.. well i dont think that a road mini could ever generate the kind of lateral g while cornering that would require an oil sump baffle ,thats not to say for track use it may be needed .also the sump is fairly shallow on the r1 and the oil pick up is also quite central so id be surprised for oil starvation due to surge to occur while under normal driving conditions in a road going mini.
Also judging by the design of many cnc machined baffle plates out there id guess oil is slow to return to the bottom of the sump which could lead to anoying oil light issues
in any case im still in two minds about this .my mini wont see any track action its purely a road car so i think ill leave it out...maybe !

Edited by YIANO, 16 July 2008 - 11:39 PM.


#11 supermotolee

supermotolee

    One Carb Or Two?

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,120 posts

Posted 18 July 2008 - 08:10 AM

have you seen the sump gasket in an r1? its almost baffled anyway... however i did fit one i got off ebay and slightly overfil the oil so when its running i can see the oil in the sight just what i read from sites, worked so far,

roofless your engine never seemed in the best of health did it?

#12 roofless

roofless

    Sticker Pimp

  • Traders
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,215 posts
  • Local Club: central minis

Posted 18 July 2008 - 04:43 PM

have you seen the sump gasket in an r1? its almost baffled anyway... however i did fit one i got off ebay and slightly overfil the oil so when its running i can see the oil in the sight just what i read from sites, worked so far,

roofless your engine never seemed in the best of health did it?


it always seemed problematic, one thing and then another - I wasnt trying to scare anyone with this, with my engine it does genuinely appear to be failure due to oil surge, could be many reasons, but too many good people who know what they're talking about have suggested a baffle should go high on the list. at 35 quid it may have saved my engine, it may not - I'll say it again, based upon my experiences I highly recommend it.

never did get to grips with where 5th and sixth gear suddenly just appeared from, and started working again for no apparent reason, or why they didnt work in the first place? and then the clutch issues which again just seemed to rectify themselves, it stuck twice but has been well behaved since.

one things for sure - its terminal this time - maybe a carb variant would be better ?

#13 roofless

roofless

    Sticker Pimp

  • Traders
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,215 posts
  • Local Club: central minis

Posted 18 July 2008 - 04:48 PM

hmmm.. well i dont think that a road mini could ever generate the kind of lateral g while cornering that would require an oil sump baffle ,thats not to say for track use it may be needed .also the sump is fairly shallow on the r1 and the oil pick up is also quite central so id be surprised for oil starvation due to surge to occur while under normal driving conditions in a road going mini.
Also judging by the design of many cnc machined baffle plates out there id guess oil is slow to return to the bottom of the sump which could lead to anoying oil light issues
in any case im still in two minds about this .my mini wont see any track action its purely a road car so i think ill leave it out...maybe !


when we were 'testing' the car after it stalled on 2 occasions we found it stalled when you did a sharp turn at moderate speed - in a car park - in hindsight this may have been obvious signs of oil surge - unfortunatley it started to settle down so I gave it a good spanking down the dual carriage-way. all was fine till i braked hard and this time it went poof.

its based upon this description that 4 people have all now said oil surge straight away - could have been many factors that led to this, but obvious one for all I have spoken to so far seems to be lack of a baffle.

#14 R1mini

R1mini

    One Carb Or Two?

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,365 posts

Posted 18 July 2008 - 05:02 PM

Did you overfill the oil? this is what's done if no baffle is fitted.

Internally I think they are only minor detailed differences between injection and carb R1 engines and probably wouldn't of helped in this scenario

Cheers
David

#15 roofless

roofless

    Sticker Pimp

  • Traders
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,215 posts
  • Local Club: central minis

Posted 18 July 2008 - 05:33 PM

Did you overfill the oil? this is what's done if no baffle is fitted.

Internally I think they are only minor detailed differences between injection and carb R1 engines and probably wouldn't of helped in this scenario

Cheers
David


yeah - took everyone's advice and just slightly over-filled her. hey ho, whats done is done - only realbenefit out of all this is we can strip the gearbox and see what the heck was going on in there, and also fit the barnett clutch to the new one - its all going to benefit in the long run.

I had an engine lined up as a spare but the guy is dicking me around now - anyone got a spare 5PW ??




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

Mini Spares