13 replies to this topic

[Asphalt]

Hi!

Does anyboday have any experiences with the above item on a Mini? I suspect it's a tight fit? Hoe effective does it work? I'm not much concerned about oil cooling, but oil warming after starting the engine.

Second question is, how and where were those heat exchangers plumbed into the cooling system?

http://img193.images...atexchanger.jpg

Cheers,
Jan

PS: If anybody has one for offer - I'm happy to buy it!!

Edited by Asphalt, 16 August 2009 - 02:43 PM.

[Nightrain]

You'd need to modify the front subframe for clearance. The pther big disadvantage is if your already have a borderline cooling system the extra heat can push it over the edge.

[Ethel]

If you wanted warmer oil doing something to reduce the heat lost through the gearbox casing would be simpler - or you could just use thinner oil.

[Asphalt]

If you wanted warmer oil doing something to reduce the heat lost through the gearbox casing would be simpler - or you could just use thinner oil.

...and then add an oil-air heat exchanger (aka. oil cooler) if the oil get's too hot... Yes, another possibility. But why bother if you can get both in one? Active oil warming & cooling with the same device. Sounds pretty perfect to me (for a daily driver, especially in winter/cold conditions & short distances).

I've thought about almost everything - and found the oil-water heat exchanger would be best & easyest solution (if not the most common).

@Nightrain:
Yeah, I'm aware of that. I'm curretly runing a std. rad - there's much room to improve cooling if neccesary. How much does the subframe have to be modified? I guees you'll need a cutout to make room for the oil filter? Sounds doable

Cheers,
Jan

[bmcecosse]

I think these heat exchangers were pretty much useless - far too small to do anything effective. Why worry about heating up oil! By the time the water warms up - the oil will be fine and warm too anyway. BIG problem is overheating oil - you can't beat a good big oil-cooler.
Sits back and waits for howls of anguish from 'experts' who will want to fit thermostats/use synthetic oil which can run at 500 deg C etc etc etc ...........

[Asphalt]

Why worry about heating up oil! By the time the water warms up - the oil will be fine and warm too anyway.

My experience tells me the opposite... But I'm not in the mood to argue and my language skills are to bad to do that in a foreign language - so let's just accept I want a oil-water heat exchanger in my car. As I find they'r working principle good and come to the conclusion it's what my engine needs, rather than fancy big air-oil coolers and stuff...

The Metro one seems to fit with a few modifications - that's all I wanted to know. Of course they are not for extreme engines/applications. But I'm miles away from needing extreme applications. So it's just the best compromise (for me anyway). Agreed? A well reputated engine tuner over here once produced & fitted them with great success - they can't be that bad (as long as we're not talking about extreme engines/situations).

[liirge]

dont use Synthetic oils always a good 20w50 best compromise between The gearbox and Engine, now an oil cooler is completely unnecessary, but if you do insist in using one then YES do use an Oil stat, and DO worry about warming the oil as fast as possible easiest way of reducing engine ware, The Water heater and cooling thing from the metro is a good device, and worked well on the MG Metro, as it had a cooling system which was good enough to more than cope with the engine, but as stated above these devices can make a cooling system that is only just able to cope completely become inadequate, so dont go putting one on a Cooper S.

[Dan]

You need to use the early, larger oil filter head because if you use the short type the cooler will foul the block. Once that is in place, fitting the cooler is very simple and only a tiny sliver of metal needs to be removed from where the filter overhangs the subframe member. As for plumbing, tee it into the heater circuit in such a way that the heater valve cannot turn it off. It does not need to be fed cold water from the pump, water from the head is fine.

[Nightrain]

I guees you'll need a cutout to make room for the oil filter? Sounds doable

Cheers,
Jan

Yep just cut the subframe to fit, about 10mm deep iirc and curving around the filter.

[Asphalt]

Thanks Dan & Nightrain!

Now all that's left is a heat exchanger....
If someone has one to part with - please PM me!

Found this last night whilst searching for infos; it's for a Maestro (A-Series).
Apparetly Rover sold them as a kit one time, following the fitting instructions:



Cheers,
Jan

[Asphalt]

All that's missing are 5mm. I think that's perfectly doable with a smal spacer, about 5.5-6mm thick! Anything that speaks against a spacer?

Mini filter head:


Metro filter head:


The Metro's filter head is considerably longer than the Mini's equivalent... See above picture; what a waste of space Looks promising. I might get away with only a wee little bit cutting of the subframe

Cheers,
Jan

[RBAKER1275]

As stated previously you are relying on the cooling system to now regulate the oil temperature, mini cooling systems are not famous for their efficiency so asking them to do too much may end in trouble. We use these at work on a larger scale and there are arguements for and against their effectiveness. Supposedly the oil heats up quicker and helps the water up to temperature (or vice verca i cant remember) and then when the thermostat opens and the water cools it maintains the oil at a more consistant temperature. The only thingis that i thought oil should run a hotter than the water so overcooling it maybe detrimental.

[Asphalt]

Update:

As expected, a 5mm spacer is more than sufficient! It leaves about 0,5 to 1mm (depending on what gearbox, late DAM5626 need a little trimming with a file). Distance form oilfilter to subframe is baout 3-4mm which is sufficient with well maintained engine steadies.




Oil filter change is a little bit more fiddlyer than before but still quite easy to do.

And since I run the RSP's cooling sheme, I'll conect the heat exchanger to the circuit which goes through the inlet manifold.

Chers,
Jan

[Ethel]

Looks tidy

It'll be interesting to see if it does heat the oil faster.