4 replies to this topic

[Ibexx]

I've had some problems with fueling on the last track-days I've been. The Mini doesn't like the combination of 4th gear and high RPM. This is where it needs the most fuel, so I'm thinking this is the problem.

I think my Weber 45 in combination with a Facet Red Top, a Filter King and 8mm fuel lines should work well. I've read about the solid state pumps that are usualy mounted on the rear subframe. The thing is my fuel lines are inside the car and I don't really want to go outside the car and then back inside again. I have an alloy tank that is mounted on the boot floor. There is some room under it where the spare wheel used to be, so it could be gravity fed. However, I've read that the Red Top should be verticaly mounted and there not enough room for that.

So the questions are:
Is the Facet Red Top (still) the best pump?
If so, what's the best place to mount it?

[Cooperman]

I use two Facit road pumps on my rally car and never have any problems. The advantage of having two pumps piped in parallel is that you have a system which will still pump if one fails. I switch the second pump on at the start of a stage or test when max fuel will be required. The pumps are wired separately and so there is added system redundancy for more reliability. The two pumps together give more available flow than a single red-top and are probably easier to mount. My lines run inside, but I mount them side by side under the rear seat horizontal panel as I don't like fuel pumps in the same area as the battery and fuel tanks. My tank outlet goes out of the boot floor to the pumps, then forward into the car through the heel board, all with rubber grommets bonded in position to prevent chafing. I use copper fuel pipes as much as possible with 1/4" fuel hose and proper fuel hose clips throughout. Bear-in-mind that a 1310 cc rALLY 'S' will do as little as 10 mpg on some stages and I've neer had any fuel starvation, even when I've forgotten to switch the second pump on (navigator's job!).
I hope this helps.

[Ibexx]

Thanks Cooperman!

So which pumps do you use? The solid state ones? There are quite a few different ones available. I really like the idea of heaving a backup pump. Under the rear seat panel seems like a good place, but I might put them in a box under the rear seat inside the car as I don't like fuel under the car.

I've calculated my fuel consumption at 8 MPG so it needs quite a bit

[Cooperman]

I use the SS502 Facit pumps which come complete with screw-in filters. They can deliver about 18 gallons/per hour, so with both switched on I could, in theory, empty both my 5.5 gallon tanks, that's 11 gallons in total, in about 20 minutes. That would, at an average speed of 90 mph, be 11 gallons in 30 miles (just about 3 mpg!).
Under FIA/MSA regulations you cannot have fuel pumps inside the car. In fact, the fuel lines passing through the occupied area must be "continuous metal or approved metal-braided pipe with no joins and this pipe must be protected". I use 1/4" copper fuel pipe from just behind the rear heelboard, along the centre tunnel, through the transverse box section, along the tunnel and up the bulkhead to exit to the left of centre just below the front bulkhead crossmember, at which point I have a pressure regulator and feed to the twin 1.5" SU's. Pipeis fixed with P-clips and covered with an aluminium capping pop-rivetted in place.
At the rear, I mount the pumps under the rear seat panel with parallel piping into and out of the pumps using metal, not plastic, Tee-pieces. They are bolted directly through the panel with no anti-vibration rubbers (they have both been fitted for over 10 years on my 'S' with non problems and some very arduous use). The flexible fuel pipes and Tee-pieces are located with P-clips top prevent vibration causing failure.
One is wired from the ignition and the other from a separate feed, via a separate fuse which is just for that pump, to a separate switch/warning light and power feed to the pump. The pumps have separate earth connections and even the earth terminations are separate. A bit 'belt & braces' perhaps, but it's a competition car after all.
I do hope you find this helpful.

[Ibexx]

That's very helpful indeed. I've just ordered the two pumps and the rest of the things you've mentioned. I'll be building it exactly like you have written.

Thank you very much!