14 replies to this topic

[new_van_man]

I have finally got my gearbox back together, well almost.

The mainshaft is now in, laygear and main bearings are in.

However, I am having difficulting with the 3rd motion bearing retaining clip (c shaped bit).

I have drifted the main bearing in and the clip is flush to the casing. yet when i offer up the main bearing retainer there is a massive gap of 0.015 inches along the top of the clip. The previous shim was 0.127mm (0.005 inches). this seems to be a big gap. Is this normal? It also appears tighter at the bottom of the clip than the top but it doesn t appear that the bearing is crooked?

I have tried doing it up tight and checking and doesnt make much difference to the clearances. Is it possible that a new bearing is slightly thicker and thus a new thicker shim is required?

any help much appreciated.

p.s the end float on the laygear is about 0.0045 in (between layer gear and thrust) is this ok or should i get a larger small thrust washer here?

[Guess-Works.com]

With the bearing retainer, keep adding shims until the gap is taken up, the bracket is not designed to provide any 'thrust' load onto the bearing just retain it and the the locking plate for the reverse and lay shafts. I must admit however, if I get a gap that big, I tend to use a different retainer to try an reduce the number of shims fitted.

End float on the laygear is fine.

[new_van_man]

With the bearing retainer, keep adding shims until the gap is taken up, the bracket is not designed to provide any 'thrust' load onto the bearing just retain it and the the locking plate for the reverse and lay shafts. I must admit however, if I get a gap that big, I tend to use a different retainer to try an reduce the number of shims fitted.

End float on the laygear is fine.

Many thanks once again, guessworks to the rescue!

I was starting to panic i had done something very wrong!

[deluxe_68]

With the bearing retainer, keep adding shims until the gap is taken up, the bracket is not designed to provide any 'thrust' load onto the bearing just retain it and the the locking plate for the reverse and lay shafts. I must admit however, if I get a gap that big, I tend to use a different retainer to try an reduce the number of shims fitted.

End float on the laygear is fine.

Hi mate,
I know this is an old thread but I’m at a loss.
I have the opposite problem. I have assembled the main shaft and placed in casing. Have put both the first and third motion bearings in correctly. When I go to put the retainer on I have no shims fitted but there is a gap between the bearing and retainer. I have not measured it but it is visible. Is there a solution for this or will I need a new retainer?
Thanks Pete

[coopertaz]

have you put third motion shaft in all way to clip? if so then looks like you will

[floormanager]

 

With the bearing retainer, keep adding shims until the gap is taken up, the bracket is not designed to provide any 'thrust' load onto the bearing just retain it and the the locking plate for the reverse and lay shafts. I must admit however, if I get a gap that big, I tend to use a different retainer to try an reduce the number of shims fitted.

End float on the laygear is fine.

Hi mate,
I know this is an old thread but I’m at a loss.
I have the opposite problem. I have assembled the main shaft and placed in casing. Have put both the first and third motion bearings in correctly. When I go to put the retainer on I have no shims fitted but there is a gap between the bearing and retainer. I have not measured it but it is visible. Is there a solution for this or will I need a new retainer?
Thanks Pete

 

You presumably transferred the large clip from your old 3rd motion bearing?

[Spider]

I know this is an old thread but I’m at a loss.
I have the opposite problem. I have assembled the main shaft and placed in casing. Have put both the first and third motion bearings in correctly. When I go to put the retainer on I have no shims fitted but there is a gap between the bearing and retainer. I have not measured it but it is visible. Is there a solution for this or will I need a new retainer?
Thanks Pete

 

What Gearbox Case do you have and if you look on the diff cap, there'll be a month & year date ?
 

[deluxe_68]

have you put third motion shaft in all way to clip? if so then looks like you will

 

 

 

 

With the bearing retainer, keep adding shims until the gap is taken up, the bracket is not designed to provide any 'thrust' load onto the bearing just retain it and the the locking plate for the reverse and lay shafts. I must admit however, if I get a gap that big, I tend to use a different retainer to try an reduce the number of shims fitted.

End float on the laygear is fine.

Hi mate,
I know this is an old thread but I’m at a loss.
I have the opposite problem. I have assembled the main shaft and placed in casing. Have put both the first and third motion bearings in correctly. When I go to put the retainer on I have no shims fitted but there is a gap between the bearing and retainer. I have not measured it but it is visible. Is there a solution for this or will I need a new retainer?
Thanks Pete

 

You presumably transferred the large clip from your old 3rd motion bearing?

 

Yes, I transfered clip from old bearing and have installed it all the way in. 

[deluxe_68]

 

I know this is an old thread but I’m at a loss.
I have the opposite problem. I have assembled the main shaft and placed in casing. Have put both the first and third motion bearings in correctly. When I go to put the retainer on I have no shims fitted but there is a gap between the bearing and retainer. I have not measured it but it is visible. Is there a solution for this or will I need a new retainer?
Thanks Pete

 

What Gearbox Case do you have and if you look on the diff cap, there'll be a month & year date ?
 

 

It is a 22G1128 4 syncro box, 22/5473 is the only other numbers on it.

Cheers Pete

[Spider]

 

 

I know this is an old thread but I’m at a loss.
I have the opposite problem. I have assembled the main shaft and placed in casing. Have put both the first and third motion bearings in correctly. When I go to put the retainer on I have no shims fitted but there is a gap between the bearing and retainer. I have not measured it but it is visible. Is there a solution for this or will I need a new retainer?
Thanks Pete

 

What Gearbox Case do you have and if you look on the diff cap, there'll be a month & year date ?

 

 

It is a 22G1128 4 syncro box, 22/5473 is the only other numbers on it.

Cheers Pete

 

Hey Pete,

 

All things being equal, the only reason for this is the bearing itself. I've found there's some small variation between the RHP Bearings. I haven't looked at the non-RHP Bearings, so I'm unsure how consistent these maybe.

Having the Bearing so deep seated, if due to the circlip groove being in a less than ideal place, can lead to other issues such as the Selector Forks wearing prematurely, and that'll show up on the Speed Drive side of the Forks and also wearing or burning out of 3rd gear Baulk Ring, as well as the Bearing itself possibly spinning in the case. Other than swapping the Bearing for one that will locate in a better position, you can have a spacer machined up to fit between the Circlip and the Case. I've had to do this myself with quite a few rebuilds.
 

[deluxe_68]

 

 

 

I know this is an old thread but I’m at a loss.
I have the opposite problem. I have assembled the main shaft and placed in casing. Have put both the first and third motion bearings in correctly. When I go to put the retainer on I have no shims fitted but there is a gap between the bearing and retainer. I have not measured it but it is visible. Is there a solution for this or will I need a new retainer?
Thanks Pete

 

What Gearbox Case do you have and if you look on the diff cap, there'll be a month & year date ?

 

 

It is a 22G1128 4 syncro box, 22/5473 is the only other numbers on it.

Cheers Pete

 

Hey Pete,

 

All things being equal, the only reason for this is the bearing itself. I've found there's some small variation between the RHP Bearings. I haven't looked at the non-RHP Bearings, so I'm unsure how consistent these maybe.

Having the Bearing so deep seated, if due to the circlip groove being in a less than ideal place, can lead to other issues such as the Selector Forks wearing prematurely, and that'll show up on the Speed Drive side of the Forks and also wearing or burning out of 3rd gear Baulk Ring, as well as the Bearing itself possibly spinning in the case. Other than swapping the Bearing for one that will locate in a better position, you can have a spacer machined up to fit between the Circlip and the Case. I've had to do this myself with quite a few rebuilds.
 

 

Hi Spider,

Thanks for that, the bearings I was supplied are SCH brand. I may need to source different ones. Who did you use to have a spacer machined? As they may be my best bet as well as they would know what I need.

Thanks Pete

[floormanager]

I recently built the same box and has to make a thicker shim as the retainer was too far away from the box!!
have you put third motion shaft in all way to clip? if so then looks like you will

With the bearing retainer, keep adding shims until the gap is taken up, the bracket is not designed to provide any 'thrust' load onto the bearing just retain it and the the locking plate for the reverse and lay shafts. I must admit however, if I get a gap that big, I tend to use a different retainer to try an reduce the number of shims fitted.

End float on the laygear is fine.

Hi mate,
I know this is an old thread but I’m at a loss.
I have the opposite problem. I have assembled the main shaft and placed in casing. Have put both the first and third motion bearings in correctly. When I go to put the retainer on I have no shims fitted but there is a gap between the bearing and retainer. I have not measured it but it is visible. Is there a solution for this or will I need a new retainer?
Thanks Pete

You presumably transferred the large clip from your old 3rd motion bearing?

Yes, I transfered clip from old bearing and have installed it all the way in.

[Spider]

 

 

 

 

I know this is an old thread but I’m at a loss.
I have the opposite problem. I have assembled the main shaft and placed in casing. Have put both the first and third motion bearings in correctly. When I go to put the retainer on I have no shims fitted but there is a gap between the bearing and retainer. I have not measured it but it is visible. Is there a solution for this or will I need a new retainer?
Thanks Pete

 

What Gearbox Case do you have and if you look on the diff cap, there'll be a month & year date ?

 

 

It is a 22G1128 4 syncro box, 22/5473 is the only other numbers on it.

Cheers Pete

 

Hey Pete,

 

All things being equal, the only reason for this is the bearing itself. I've found there's some small variation between the RHP Bearings. I haven't looked at the non-RHP Bearings, so I'm unsure how consistent these maybe.

Having the Bearing so deep seated, if due to the circlip groove being in a less than ideal place, can lead to other issues such as the Selector Forks wearing prematurely, and that'll show up on the Speed Drive side of the Forks and also wearing or burning out of 3rd gear Baulk Ring, as well as the Bearing itself possibly spinning in the case. Other than swapping the Bearing for one that will locate in a better position, you can have a spacer machined up to fit between the Circlip and the Case. I've had to do this myself with quite a few rebuilds.
 

 

 

Hi Spider,

Thanks for that, the bearings I was supplied are SCH brand. I may need to source different ones. Who did you use to have a spacer machined? As they may be my best bet as well as they would know what I need.

Thanks Pete

 

 

Cheers Pete,

 

OK, gotya on the 'SCH' Bearings - sadly, that isn't the actual manufacturer. Who that is is fairly obscure, you'd think if they were proud of their product, they'd want the whole world to know about them.

You might find this of interest;-

https://www.theminif...aring-question/

 

I actually had some SCH Bearings among my stash which I removed and quarantined about 2 years back. I've not fitted any and have not first hand experience of them but they just don't 'small' right somehow.

 

RHP supplied the factory these bearings from 1959 to 2000 (and likely for a while there after).

 

The spacers I fitted I made myself. I turned some steel tube to the right ID and OD, parted off a piece a little longer than I needed, then ground it to the final thickness's that I was after in each job.

[deluxe_68]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Cheers Pete,

 

OK, gotya on the 'SCH' Bearings - sadly, that isn't the actual manufacturer. Who that is is fairly obscure, you'd think if they were proud of their product, they'd want the whole world to know about them.

You might find this of interest;-

https://www.theminif...aring-question/

 

I actually had some SCH Bearings among my stash which I removed and quarantined about 2 years back. I've not fitted any and have not first hand experience of them but they just don't 'small' right somehow.

 

RHP supplied the factory these bearings from 1959 to 2000 (and likely for a while there after).

 

The spacers I fitted I made myself. I turned some steel tube to the right ID and OD, parted off a piece a little longer than I needed, then ground it to the final thickness's that I was after in each job.

 

 Spider,

Thanks again for the reply. I read the other thread you linked. Very interesting read. Will order some RHP bearings tomorrow from a different supplier and see if that makes any difference. Also thank for the info about spacer. Will look ay getting something made if I need it as I don't have a lathe.

Cheers Pete

[floormanager]

Please let us know how you get on with RHP.