14 replies to this topic

[minicity1275]

Quick question peeps,
I want a decent suspension set up.
Should I upgrade to fully adjustable rose jointed lower arms or fixed 1.5 degree neg camber lower arms?
I have adjustable tie bars and hi Lo's fitted already.
Thanks
Al

[carbon]

For normal road use you're better with the 1.5 degree fixed neg camber arms

[Cooperman]

If the car will only be used on the track and never on the road, then go for rose-jointed arms. If it's a road or rally car, then just fit 1.5 deg neg arms and it'll be fine, but also have adjustable tie bars so that the suspension can be set accurately.

[Artful Dodger]

if its a road car, do not use rose jointed items. silly expense for a horrible vibrations.

1.5 degree negative camber bottom arms, adjustable tie rods and the camber brackets for the rear. this will give you an ideal set up with no virbrations / horrible driving feel etc

[Joe-C]

This thread has saved me a bit of money; I was planning on getting some adjustable arms but now won't bother

[mk1coopers]

I'm not disagreeing with the above but I have fully adjustable rose jointed arms and tie bars on mine, I found no difference in noise or vibrations through the car, this either means that the earlier solid mounted subframes are quite noisy to start off with compared to the later rubber mounted style, or my car was bad to start off with! The difference without the rubbers in the lower arms is very noticeable, very crisp turn in and lots less 'wiggle' under hard braking it get's used for Hillclimbs and Sprints, and is driven to the events

Edited by mk1coopers, 27 November 2012 - 10:01 PM.

[Artful Dodger]

There is a massive difference between early and later subframes in terms of noise and vibration!

Better handling and response though!!

[tiger99]

Rose joints are not suitable for a long life on the road, however if I was fitting them it would only be on the lower arms, but definitely not the tie rods. Lateral compliance is not necessary, and can affect the steering response, but a little bit of fore and aft compliance is very useful to reduce shock loading.

In any case, the rose jointed tie rods which I have seen are a very amateurish design, like most of the modifications from their supplier, and move the pivot point backwards and outwards, which causes undesirable castor change on bump. I also have doubts about the fatigue strength of the rose joint to subframe brackets.

To do the job properly involves cutting off the existing subframe brackets and welding on new ones to get the rose joint centres exactly where the centres of the rubber bushes were.

Oh, and this is purely my personal opinion, 1.5 degrees negative is a bit too much and will spoil the handling. Of course it depends how you want it to handle. I like to keep some slight understeer, a bit less than standard, with a gentle transition to a little bit more oversteer than standard on deceleration. Half a degree negative is sufficient to do that, and only a hint of negative at the rear. But I would be very interested to know what settings actually get you from A to B quickest on the road. I suspect that the real answer would surprise all of us.

Edited by tiger99, 27 November 2012 - 11:09 PM.

[Bungle]

do you need 1.5 arms ?

1.5 arms take 1.5 degrees off what you already have, do you know what you have already ?

[Midas Mk1]

Ive got 1.5 front arms, but will be getting adjustable ones over the winter to wind the camber in abit more - handles great as it is though

[icklemini]

a usual shopping list on a road car would consist of:
Adjustable tie rods
Adjustable lower arms
Bushes to suit the tie rods and arms...
New fixings (nuts / bolts) for the arms

Longer track rod ends
KAD rear brackets

then setup...

Edited by icklemini, 28 November 2012 - 09:01 AM.

[freshairmini]

+1 for what icklemini said. I got the adjustable lower arms and tie rods. Means I can accurately adjust the suspension to what I want. Drives great now.

[racingbob]

i have adjustable bottom arms on mine
so you can get it RIGHT 1.5 camber on mine
but next time will bring it back to 1.25

[ace01]

do you need 1.5 arms ?

1.5 arms take 1.5 degrees off what you already have, do you know what you have already ?

I think this hits the nail on the head. Also MiniSpares do an adjustable bottom arm that has rubber mounts to the subframe.

[oliver122]

i looked into this for a while , and the problem with fixed is that you may have positive or negative camber already and it could also just affect one side , so by putting fixed bottom arms on you have increased the amount of negative camber but it still might not be the same for both sides