29 replies to this topic

[jamiestevenbell]

Hi guys I'm having a think about my rollcage, I brought it in good condition second hand, its a 6 point rollcentre jobbie with door bars but I had to remove the stickers to repaint it, would i able to use it in the mod prod class for sprinting? Cheers

[keefr22]

I'd guess that maybe depends on the Scrutineer on the day. But you could always contact Rollcentre & ask if they could supply some new stickers - I had one of their cages in my hillclimb Porsche 924 a few years back, & they were always very helpful when I contacted them for advice on fitting & stuff...

[miniweights]

If it's an MSA recognised event, then you should have a sticker and certificate if the scrutineer asks for it. I had the same problem with my Safety Devices cage. I had to find the serial number and send it with a photograph of the cage to Safety Devices, oh and £25. But it doesn't end there, you then have to apply for a cage certificate, another £25 from the MSA if you don't have one. By the way, they don't accept copies.

Tony

[keefr22]

I'd forgotten all about the damn certificates, I'd better get one sorted too....

[jamiestevenbell]

I have been in touch with roll centre and they seem very help full I have just got to send some pics of the cage over then they will confirm the age of the cage and sort the paperwork

[miniweights]

Great news!


Hey keefr22, I make lists now, so I don't forget stuff. I think it could be an age related thing

Tony

Edited by miniweights, 17 April 2013 - 11:12 AM.

[keefr22]

I make lists now, so I don't forget stuff. I think it could be an age related thing

I don't doubt it's age related Tony - I do the same but then forget what I've done with the list...!!

Keith

[JustSteve]

I don't doubt it's age related Tony - I do the same but then forget what I've done with the list...!!

Keith

made me laugh because i do the exact same thing!

I tend to take pictures when i strip down something new too, to check what goes where for the rebuild... EVERY time i delete them without realising!

[tom1]

Hi I am building a hill climb mini at the moment. I have got new stickers from the rollcentre and a Identity / supply / Serial No sticker, is this enough or will I need more ( at this rate I may just give up) Thanks Tom

[miniweights]

It's probably best to contact Rollcentre and explain your situation, here's a link to contact Rollcentre

Here's some information Safety Devices give. It may help.

MSA/FIA homologated roll cages: do they all have to be made from 45mm tubing now?
The short answer is no.
Let's use one of our most popular roll cages as an example: the Rover/Austin/British Leyland Classic Mini roll cage N000 (or just N as it was originally called) was made with 38mm tubing and was homologated with such. When you order a N000 roll cage from a Safety Devices Approved Dealer today, the cage will be made at our factory from 38mm tubing, and it will still be a homologated design. You will be able to compete in MSA/FIA events, despite the new rules stating that homologated cages must be made of 45mm tubing.
However, if Safety Devices designed a completely new roll cage for the Classic Mini today, the tubing would need to be made from 45mm tubing.

Notes on homologation
Don't forget that you'll need to produce a genuine homologation certificate to race scrutineers, who will not accept photocopies. Only the MSA can issue genuine homologation certificates. Order directly from the MSA, phone 01753 765000. Certificates cost about £25 and might take up to 2 weeks to reach you by post. The certificate number will generally be listed on our website on your roll cage's page - use the Roll Cage Selector to find your cage.
Homologated roll cages should also display their own, unique homologation sticker. These stickers should never be painted over and will self-destruct if removed to prevent fraudulent use. If you need to replace your Safety Devices homologation sticker, we will need to see photographs of your roll cage. If your cage does not have a homologation sticker, it may have been removed, or the cage might not be homologated.
Look for the unique serial numbers on the footplates of the main hoop behind the driver's or passenger's side and email clear photos to us for verification together with general photos of the roll cage so that we can see its current structure. If the roll cage has been painted over the years, you may need to scrub the paint off the footplates with a wire brush to reveal the serial numbers. You may also need to use a torch to see the serial numbers. Be aware - a cage with a Safety Devices sticker on it does not necessarily mean it’s a Safety Devices cage.


If you don't have an homologation certificate for your particular cage, then you will need to buy one from the MSA, but check first with Rollcentre, you may already have everything required.

Whatever you do, don't give up! It's really not that bad

Tony

Edited by miniweights, 25 April 2013 - 05:30 PM.

[keefr22]

I'm still confused by the requirement for certificates. I've recently joined the Uphill Racers forum, & as my son & I have had entries accepted for the Epynt hillclimb in June (unfortunately in my Ibiza as the Mini won't be ready) I asked the following;


"We are preparing a classic Mini Clubman, but that won't be ready so intend to use my Seat Ibiza Cupra. This used to be my son's car, & he did one sprint at Llandow in it. On that occcasion he wasn't asked to produce a certificate for the cage. It's a 6 point bolt in Sparco with an FIA homologation sticker showing the serial number but the model number box wasn't filled in when we bought it. We intend running in modprod.

Would anyone know whether we will require to produce a certificate for the cage? "

First reply I had, the poster said this;

"I think it's ok so long as it conforms to the drawings in the blue book, however if it's a road car a cage is not mandatory any way. But if one is fitted it may have to conform to the blue book, if it's an FIA one I doubt it will trouble our speed scrutineers."

If I get any different replies I'll let you know!

Keith

PS the Ibiza, while road legal doesn't conform with standard production class regs (fully stripped interior, lowered suspension etc., so does need a cage

[miniweights]

Hi Keith, I have never been asked to produce a cage certificate. To be honest I don't think there would be enough time to check everything. It's probably a case of glancing at the homologation sticker for most scrutineers. Personally though, going by what Safety Devices has advised me, I would feel better having a certificate just in case a scrutineer asked to see it. I would be very dissapointed if I couldn't compete on the day, not to mention all the travelling and expence.

I have emailed the MSA, so I will post their reply when/if I receive one.

Tony

Edited by miniweights, 26 April 2013 - 11:25 AM.

[keefr22]

I'd be interested to see what they say Tony, so I hope they reply! I don't know whether they'd actually stop you competing on the day though, unless it was for something totally unsafe. When my son did the sprint at Llandow there were a couple of non-compliances on the car, the scrute just said 'fix them before your next event'! (which will be the Epynt hillclimb in June - 3 years on!!) My mate has been hillclimbing a Formula Libre Imp for years, & he says the same, he was unknowingly running non compliant seat belts for quite a while before a scrute picked him up - again he was just told to change them before the next event.

I do know what you mean though, it's always the worry that you'll end up with a scrute having a bad day & be sent home...!!

Keith

[miniweights]

Received a reply from the MSA today, and it looks like it's good news  Can't think why Safety Devices would say a certificate is required

 

Here's my email and the reply:

 

Hi there,

 

Can you please clarify whether a roll cage homologation certificate is required when competing in stage rallies, hill climbs and sprints, and any other events using MSA regulations?

 

Many thanks

Tony

 

Tony,

 

ROPS certificates will be required where the cage does not meet the basic requirements of the Blue Book section (K) and individual discipline regs.

 

For cages that do meet these requirements, no additional certification is required.

 

Regards,

 

Joe Hickerton

Technical Administrator

The Royal Automobile Club Motor Sports Association Limited

+44(0)1753 765000

www.msauk.org

[miniweights]

I've just been reading the blue book K section. It seems the 38mm Safety Devices cage at least will need a certificate as it does not meet the basic requirements which include cages needing to be a minimum bar diameter of 45mm. At least that's the way I see it.