13 replies to this topic

[josheylane]

Hi Guys,

 

i have searched other threads and still struggling to diagnose where my water leak is coming from....

 

My steps so far....I used to have cover sills but had those cut off with the old inner and outer sills put new one in. (which i thought my problem was over as the water is leaking from the crossmember).

 

 

However it is still leaking from the crossmember ????? i have attached some photos to hopefully help with finding the problem....

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•  photo 5.JPG   72.91K   41 downloads

[Dan]

  Well your checkstrap seals are worthless for one thing, that is a very common source of massive leaks.  What is the condition of the bodywork under the rear windows and around the roof gutter?

[sonikk4]

If you have new inner and outer sills i doubt the cross member is the issue here. The inner sills you used were they the full length sills or the repair sills that wrap around the cross member??

 

Have you physically taken the carpets out of the car then got somebody to spray water over the car especially around the door shuts and up into the front wheel arch to the rear of it?? 

 

Is the door check strap seal as Dan mentioned there and in good order (the pictures don't look good)

 

Does the water appear when the car is parked up outside or when the car is on the road?? Is the flitch panel especially around the fresh air vent in good condition and not perforated with rust.

 

Does your Heater matrix leak at all??

 

Have you had a look at the rear inner arches especially at the top, if they are holed water can and will work its way down and onto the floor. 

[josheylane]

Have more photos :), easier that way should help with explaining.

 

I believe that the inner sills where full length.  

 

The water seems to appear when both stood still and driving. But when driving more seems to come through. 

 

I have replaced the heater matrix so shouldn't be that. 

 

So frustrating water leaks!!!!!!   

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•  photo 1.JPG   60.96K   44 downloads
•  photo 2.JPG   68.46K   23 downloads
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•  photo 4.JPG   30.35K   19 downloads

[josheylane]

  Well your checkstrap seals are worthless for one thing, that is a very common source of massive leaks.  What is the condition of the bodywork under the rear windows and around the roof gutter?

 

The door check straps look in bad nick but feel dry could you explain how the water could get from there to the crossmember? 

[sonikk4]

The door check strap seals as Dan has mentioned if they are badly compressed or perished will allow water to track down inside the door post then out into the footwell.

 

However looking at your pictures you have pin prick holes in your inner sill section within the companion bin area as you can see water tracking down.

 

This in turn will drain out of the companion bins into the flutes in the floor and then will track along them eventually going under the crossmember.

 

Seal these up first then see what happens. Also replace the door check strap seals as well.

 

And just to add here the inner sills have not been replaced inside the companion bins so not full length and possibly they were the inner sill repair sections like these

http://www.minispare...|Back to search

 

Now this in turn can also cause water leaks from within the crossmember as there is now potentially a gap in the inner sill face where it goes over the end of the crossmember. If there is any perforated metal caused by rust in this area (highly likely as this is also the area where the jacking is situated and its mounting bracket) like this picture below

[josheylane]

The door check strap seals as Dan has mentioned if they are badly compressed or perished will allow water to track down inside the door post then out into the footwell.

 

However looking at your pictures you have pin prick holes in your inner sill section within the companion bin area as you can see water tracking down.

 

This in turn will drain out of the companion bins into the flutes in the floor and then will track along them eventually going under the crossmember.

 

Seal these up first then see what happens. Also replace the door check strap seals as well.

 

And just to add here the inner sills have not been replaced inside the companion bins so not full length and possibly they were the inner sill repair sections like these

http://www.minispare...|Back to search

 

Now this in turn can also cause water leaks from within the crossmember as there is now potentially a gap in the inner sill face where it goes over the end of the crossmember. If there is any perforated metal caused by rust in this area (highly likely as this is also the area where the jacking is situated and its mounting bracket) like this picture below

 

 

Ok, If these are my next steps:

 

- Replace Check Strap Seals. 

 

- Look at sealing up companion bins. (How would you do this?)

 

- Also when i took my car into the garage I said that i wanted the full inner and outer sills replaced. Would it be worth my contacting him and         asking him why he hasn't done it ? and see what he can offer? 

 

Does that sound alright sorry for all the questions just want to stop this ridiculous leak!

[sonikk4]

Not a problem for the questions. Can you take a picture of the inner sill from the companion bin to the front foot well please. this will confirm one way or another what they have done.

 

The holes where the water is coming through really need to be welded up but you could apply a bit of seam sealer once its dry. Also talking of pictures can you take a couple of the new outer sill as well please. there appears to be a small amount of seam welding going on in the companion bin area and not any plug welds or spot welds. It does not look quite right.

 

Hopefully then we can get an idea of what has been done.

[Dan]

  You'd be amazed the distance water can travel inside the various box sections that make up the car.  What you can do to track it is apply small dabs of differently coloured poster paints at various points around the body on a dry day and then start carefully hosing different areas.  After a while you will start to see the colours emerge where the leaks are tracking to, and the colours will mix to show you what different sources of water end up where.  Water coming down the doorframe can easily end up in the sill, which is why the sill has drains.  As above, if there is some perforation at the end of the cross member it will run through into there too.  The channels in the floor are the lowest point so ultimately everything ends up there but how it got there can be quite circuitous.  Capillary action will draw water along seams, until it reaches an opening that it can flow through.  Check strap seals really are a prime candidate, painting them is not good.  However I think that from the later photos the source of your water is coming from the companion bins as Sonikk says.  The rear quarters tend to rot out under the seals of rear opening windows, and water can come down from the roof gutter easily.  The front of the roof gutter on your car is starting to look like it might be a problem, there is a chunk of foam rubber inside here that is stuffed into the top of the door post at the factory and which causes all sorts of rust.

[josheylane]

Hi Guys, I have pulled up all the sound stuff that the garage had put down and i am not very happy. Seems that they have done the passenger side inner sill, but only patched up the drivers side. I rang him up and he has said that because someone had already patched up the inner sill it would be difficult to put a new one in. :/ Anyway i have attached new images which should make more sense. Also seem to have water leaking from the corner where the arch and inner sills meet on both sides? 

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•  photo 1.JPG   72.91K   16 downloads
•  photo 2.JPG   76.02K   13 downloads
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•  photo 2.JPG   38.58K   8 downloads
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[sonikk4]

So inner sill patched and not replaced as requested. that's not good then. I cannot really tell from your pictures whether the outer sills are oversills or short sills. i would be taking it back to them and get it sorted properly.

[josheylane]

So inner sill patched and not replaced as requested. that's not good then. I cannot really tell from your pictures whether the outer sills are oversills or short sills. i would be taking it back to them and get it sorted properly.

 

I think the outside are outer sills I think i will try take a better picture tomorrow with hopefully better weather :)

[josheylane]

 Picture of the outer sills

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•  photo-1.JPG   43.4K   22 downloads

Edited by josheylane, 29 May 2013 - 02:47 PM.

[sonikk4]

It does look like a short sill ie the correct one but there also appears to be a lot of underseal of some form or another on there. If there has been a lot of patching on the inner sills then there is every possibility there have been a few pin prick holes that have been missed.

 

This is quite common and can be easily overlooked and that may account for the water coming in at the back.

 

I would suggest taking it back to the garage that did the work and ask them to sort it out. As for the inner sill issue did they say they replaced the inner sill or just patched the areas. if he said he replaced the sill i would take him to task over the patches. All because there was a patch there to start with is not an excuse to add another patch. The area should have been cut out and a new section of inner sill butt welded in place.

 

My worry would be all they have done is weld over the rust so in a few months it will come back through. Also if the rust is far enough down past the new sill what has been done externally, has it been filled then covered over with underseal??