18 replies to this topic

[minimaded]

I am in the process of building my first proper install and I need some advice before I spend some more money. The install has been evolving for the past few years and is now becoming quite serious. I will be doing a complete install thread when I get time, however at the moment I need some advice regarding my next step.

 

Currently my install consist of a Nexus 7 >>> Fiio E10 USB DAC >>> Philips DXO 300 >>> Sony XM-2200GTX >>> A pair of Fli 6x9 under the rear seat

                                                                                                                                          >>> 2 Kicker EX 1000.1 >>> 2 Alpine SWR-10D2

 

The time has come for the 6x9s to go and I want to do an active front setup with a pair of 6.5" components either mounted in custom door pockets or similar to Ruckus' install.

 

This did start out as an SPL install but I am now steering towards SQ so I have been looking at sound processors, in particular the Audison bit Ten D. I want to replace the Fiio E10 with a USB DAC with optical out and connect it to the bit Ten to reduce any interference and noise. However the bit Ten is not a cheap piece of kit and I don't want to be wasting money if I'm not going to notice the benefit in a mini.

 

I am slowly sound deadening the panels with silent coat, I have 4 bulk packs, hopefully I won't need it all, it is 50kg and soundproofing against engine noise.

 

If anyone has any experience with the bit Ten or any other sound processors, your opinion would be appreciated.

 

 

Also any recommendations for components, I have been looking at some Focal's about the £100 mark and a 4 channel amp to compliment them.

 

Thanks

Ed

 

 

 

 

 

[Gr4h4m]

I'm not sure I can see much point in a mini. They are so small the sound won't have far to travel, so getting the sound stage setup will be difficult?

Just some thoughts? I'm not expert but I do like a good sound.

[Ruckus]

Invest and get the basics right first.
The best source unit, comps, amps, sub you can afford first.

Once you have that set up the best it can be, and you understand the systems limitations THEN move to processing and time alinement.

And is it worth doing in a mini... Damn right it is!
The fact the mini is a hard environment for an audio setup makes it all the more worth the effort.
A top level audio system mini is three times the achievement than if it was in a modern euro box...

[minimaded]

Invest and get the basics right first.
The best source unit, comps, amps, sub you can afford first.

Once you have that set up the best it can be, and you understand the systems limitations THEN move to processing and time alinement.

And is it worth doing in a mini... Damn right it is!
The fact the mini is a hard environment for an audio setup makes it all the more worth the effort.
A top level audio system mini is three times the achievement than if it was in a modern euro box...

As the Nexus 7 is my source unit I need a crossover network to provide the signal for the sub, mid and high. The DXO 300 is currently doing this however it is introducing a noticeable amount of noise so I want something better and it would be nice to have an equaliser too.

 

I am happy with the subs, although, I will be swapping the sealed enclosure for a ported one, so I just need to get the components and either a 4 channel amp or two 2 channel amps, I'm struggling for space so might be easier to find homes for 2 smaller amps.

 

So if I'm going to have to buy a better active crossover, I feel that I might as well spend a bit more, which is why I was looking at the bit Ten and then the bit Ten D as it has an optical in and remote volume.

[minimaded]

I have been looking at some Vocal and Hertz components and for £100 - £150 they are about 80w RMS. Is this enough power as I am currently running the 6x9s on 125w RMS and the mid-bass is drowned out by the 2kw RMS I have on the subs.

Thanks

[Ruckus]

Ok I'm with your reasoning now.

I personally have not use or even listened to a Bit Ten D, and I doubt anyone else on this forum will have.
Your best bet is to start a thread on Talkaudio.co.uk

But basically are you just looking for an active crossover or do you want EQ as well?

Edited by Ruckus, 10 June 2013 - 06:44 AM.

[Ruckus]

Adding to that, I don't know what your budget is for the crossover/EQ, but it might be worth going for a headunit that does it all.
The Pioneer P88RS can be picked up for under £200 and does it all X over, EQ and TA!
Awesome unit.

Edited by Ruckus, 10 June 2013 - 06:48 AM.

[freshairmini]

Adding to that, I don't know what your budget is for the crossover/EQ, but it might be worth going for a headunit that does it all.
The Pioneer P88RS can be picked up for under £200 and does it all X over, EQ and TA!
Awesome unit.

 

But does that head unit allow for an android device to be plugged in for music (like ipod) and take a digital signal? As that seems like what the OP wanted as well, hence the USB DAC/Bit 10 combo

Edited by freshairmini, 10 June 2013 - 12:08 PM.

[Ruckus]

Adding to that, I don't know what your budget is for the crossover/EQ, but it might be worth going for a headunit that does it all.
The Pioneer P88RS can be picked up for under £200 and does it all X over, EQ and TA!
Awesome unit.

 
But does that head unit allow for an android device to be plugged in for music (like ipod) and take a digital signal? As that seems like what the OP wanted as well, hence the USB DAC/Bit 10 combo

Oh yes LOL I missed that!
I'll get me coat!

[minimaded]

The digital input isn't a big deal, but as the bit Ten D supported it I thought I might as well use it and I chose the Ten D over the Ten as it comes with the remote control. I have had a look at the Pioneer P88RS

 and it is a cheaper alternative that will do what I want so it is an option.

 

After looking at the components and 4 channel amps I don't think this months money is going to stretch to the processor too.

 

So for the time being my main question is regarding the components, as this is something that I have no experience in it would be awesome if you could recommend me a set, preferably new. My biggest concern is the power output, as I mostly listen whilst driving I don't want to buy a set that I wish would go a little bit louder, I would rather spend a bit more and have a bit of power spare. I do however appreciate that power and quality is a compromise.

 

If it means spending £250 for a set I am happy if I will only have to buy once.

 

Thought I would add that I mostly listen to trap, drum and bass, hip hop, hence the pair of 10s, but I do also listen to rock and metal and a bit of classical.

 

Thanks

[freshairmini]

Its dificult to recommend speakers as a "great sound" to one person might be meh and not worth the money to another.

 

For me though I listened to some Focal K2 series speakers and the equivialent Hertz (HSK I think) ones and both liked them. Best to get down to yur nearest audio shop and have a listen.

[minimaded]

Okay then, hopefully I will listen to some components the weekend.

I have another question which I have been unable to find an answer, when setting the gains on my sub amps, using ohms law the output should be set at 31.6v ac with a 1 ohm load at 1000w, however using an oscilloscope I can see that the amp will go to 40v before clipping, but that would be 1600w rms.

So which do I set it to?

When I was running a single type r 12 I set the amp to clipping using a -10dB test tone but the surround came unstuck from the cone and as I was listening to a lot of decaf I was clipping the amp a lot, I didn't realise at the time.

So I am now using a 0dB test tone as I can't afford to damage any more subs, but the two 10s don't seem as loud as the single 12.

Thanks

[freshairmini]

Just set it just before when the occiloscope shows clipping. The amp could have more watts than its rated for so the workings out could be wrong. Or I could be wrong. lol.

 

When I tried to learn how the gains worked and working out what voltage it was supposed to be set to I found it quite complicated, and when you have an oscilloscope very over complicated as using the oscope is far easier than working it out! (as long as the oscope is working fine)

 

Luckily for me tho a friend is an electronic engineer and has an oscope so i'll be using that for sure! Dont want to break my sub/speakers

[minimaded]

I have done advanced electronics at college so I'm familiar with an oscilloscope but I cant find a definitive answer regarding setting amp gains, and I would rather not learn from experience.

 

Over exertion killed the type r 12, the spider also came loose, the technician said I did a good job of destroying it. The box did have a slight leak which probably contributed to the problem, but that is a lesson I learnt from.

 

The 10s are fairly loud, they will leave your ears ringing after 10 mins in the mini but the bass doesn't seem as well developed outside the car, the was a mini at L2B this year with two kicker 12s in a band pass box on about 600w and you could feel the bass outside the car, so even with the 10s in a sealed box, I expected more from 2000w.

 

I will be forfeiting the luxury of a spare wheel for a ported box to see if a can get a bit more air moving.

 

Just emailed Kicker to see if they can provide an answer.

 

Here are a few pictures of it at the moment, it is still at the prototyping stage so is far from finished.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[minimaded]

No response from Kicker yet, but I have had another read though the user manual and it states to increase the gain until distortion is heard and then back it off a little. So to me that means stick the scope on the amps and adjust them till they clip and ignore the voltage.

 

Will give it a try this morning.

 

Edited by minimaded, 16 June 2013 - 08:05 AM.