9 replies to this topic

[ClubmanDazzer]

Hi
I've got an 82 Mini that I would like to try out road rallying in such as the HRCR Clubmans series. I know it's probably a bit outclassed in this age group but I hope to get an older car roadworthy later on next year.
I'm a bit confused by the regs for cat 4 and exactly what I need to do to meet specs. I can't see any FIA papers even listed for later Minis. Anyone know what the score is or of any drivers running a newer rally Mini?
Cheers
Darryl

[rally1380]

Hi Darryl.

 

I compete with a cat 2 mini.....so i have it easy with no need for papers.

 

 

From the HRCT website........

 

Category 4 includes Historic rally cars  registered and homologated in Groups A, N and B between 1st January 1982 and 31st December 1985  excluding any cars that were regulated out by the FIA in period from rallies for safety reasons. Cars in Category 4 must comply with their Homologation forms and Appendix J of the 1985 FIA Yellow Book.

 

 

Someone somewhere will have FIA papers for the later spec cars.....maybe even someone on here (Rob Jones maybe?).  If all else fails, give Paul Loveridge a shout....he's the HRCR tech person, is seriously into minis, so might be able to sort you out.  If that all fails and you are still stuck, try contacting Minisport as i'm sure they will have had the papers at some point or will be able to point you in the right direction.

 

And if all that still falls short......i'll ask my local scrutineer for you.

 

Best of luck, and will probably see you out on an event or two.  They are superb fun and a fairly cheap way into motorsport. 

[Cooperman]

I think if I wanted to road rally in the '82 to '85 age group I wouldn't choose a Mini. A Pug 205 GTi might be a better bet, or a VW Golf GTi or something of similar age, size and performance.

You will really struggle in a Mini of that era.

I once built a 1990 Mini Cooper 1275 for endurance rallying and it seemed fin, on paper that is. Then I came to do a 300 mile event against more modern cars and I have never had to drive so hard for so long to try to be competitive against more modern cars.

A historic Mini is fine against other older classic cars of the same era, like a Lotus or GT Cortina, Volvo 122S, VW Beetle, etc., but it is a 56 year-old design and will struggle against modern cars with long travel suspension, big vented brakes, fantastic OHC engines and good gearboxes.

[rally1380]

I think if I wanted to road rally in the '82 to '85 age group I wouldn't choose a Mini. A Pug 205 GTi might be a better bet, or a VW Golf GTi or something of similar age, size and performance.

You will really struggle in a Mini of that era.

I once built a 1990 Mini Cooper 1275 for endurance rallying and it seemed fin, on paper that is. Then I came to do a 300 mile event against more modern cars and I have never had to drive so hard for so long to try to be competitive against more modern cars.

A historic Mini is fine against other older classic cars of the same era, like a Lotus or GT Cortina, Volvo 122S, VW Beetle, etc., but it is a 56 year-old design and will struggle against modern cars with long travel suspension, big vented brakes, fantastic OHC engines and good gearboxes.

 

But this is for the HRCR style 'road rally' so a lot of the gains can be had on regularity sections - so power of car is really second fiddle.

 

If it was a 'proper' road rally I would agree......unless you pedal a mini really quickly (I've still not got that quite right) you will struggle in the lanes against a 205 or a golf.

 

But on tight, twisty tests like they have on the HRCR events.....I reckon a mini is still a half decent weapon of choice.......after all, I didn't do to badly on the recent Vale of Clwyd Classic and spanked a few 'modern' historics......upset a few 911's and mk2 escorts too     

 

 

If totally new to rallying and wanting to learn the 'craft', I think there is no better car than the mini to get out there and have a bash. 

 

1 - they are very simple cars in terms of mechanicals so very little to go wrong as long as it is well built and maintained  

 

2 - if you do break it you can easily get the parts (not so with a 205) 

 

3 - Electrics are simple, cheap (ish) and easy (ish) to fix (again, not so with a French hatch back!) 

 

4 - You will get support - I've had loads of folks cheering me on when I compete....not because they know me, but because they like the fact I drive a mini (it's a great feeling).

 

5 - You have superb websites like TMF to ask experts questions and more often than not get a friendly response.

 

 

I do agree with Cooperman that there are better, more modern and more powerful cars to go out and compete in (I've bought one!), but I do enjoy using my mini the most. 

[Rob Jones]

Hi Darryl.

 

I compete with a cat 2 mini.....so i have it easy with no need for papers.

 

 

From the HRCT website........

 

Category 4 includes Historic rally cars  registered and homologated in Groups A, N and B between 1st January 1982 and 31st December 1985  excluding any cars that were regulated out by the FIA in period from rallies for safety reasons. Cars in Category 4 must comply with their Homologation forms and Appendix J of the 1985 FIA Yellow Book.

 

 

Someone somewhere will have FIA papers for the later spec cars.....maybe even someone on here (Rob Jones maybe?).  If all else fails, give Paul Loveridge a shout....he's the HRCR tech person, is seriously into minis, so might be able to sort you out.  If that all fails and you are still stuck, try contacting Minisport as i'm sure they will have had the papers at some point or will be able to point you in the right direction.

 

And if all that still falls short......i'll ask my local scrutineer for you.

 

Best of luck, and will probably see you out on an event or two.  They are superb fun and a fairly cheap way into motorsport. 

As far as I am aware, the Mini during this period was not homologated in Group N/A or B. It wasn't until 1993/4 that the Rover Mini gained homologation in N/A. Your best bet is contact Paul Loveridge, as Dave suggests

Edited by Rob Jones, 21 October 2015 - 01:15 PM.

[ClubmanDazzer]

Thanks chaps. As Rob says, I'm wondering if it was ever homologated in this era. I will try and contact Paul to clear things up once and for all. Appreciate the advice.

[rally1380]

Does the car 'have' to be homologated??

 

I've seen all sorts of cars being used that I doubt very much ever had an FIA homogation paper.....Nissan Sunny for one.

[keefr22]

Does the car 'have' to be homologated??

 

I've seen all sorts of cars being used that I doubt very much ever had an FIA homogation paper.....Nissan Sunny for one.

 

Pretty sure the Sunny GTi-R was Dave - Nissan Motorsport used them...Don't recall whether they were 'in date' for Cat 4 though, & can't check now, on the way out for a flu jab...!! 

[rally1380]

 

Does the car 'have' to be homologated??

 

I've seen all sorts of cars being used that I doubt very much ever had an FIA homogation paper.....Nissan Sunny for one.

 

Pretty sure the Sunny GTi-R was Dave - Nissan Motorsport used them...Don't recall whether they were 'in date' for Cat 4 though, & can't check now, on the way out for a flu jab...!! 

 

 

Ok...maybe Nissan did get one for the GTi-R but i'm taking grannies shopping trolley sort of Sunny....fully standard with a beige interior.

[keefr22]

Ah sorry, get you now Dave. My late dad had a 1300 one of those - horrific thing, certainly wouldn't want to rally one!!