12 replies to this topic

[Northernpower]

I've fitted an injection fuel tank with the original fuel gauge sender from the carb tank, but it only shows part way up the gauge even though the tank is 3/4 full. Is the injection tank sender the same as the carb tank sender or if not, can the carb one be altered?

 

 

[JBW]

They are different, check on BullMotif,

 

http://bullmotifmini...100380_xnb10027

 

The original one catches on something inside at the rear, I managed to modify the carb one to fit by bending it to a similar shape, by comparing the sender arm to the picture.

With the tank empty, I was able to test it using a piece of string through the filler neck, then attached to the arm, to check its travel to make sure it wasn't catching, then had to lengthen the amount of travel as it was only showing 3/4 full when arm was at highest point, to do this I run a temporary extension wire from the feed to the sender, then earthed it to the choke cable, so I could adjust the travel whilst watching the gauge, hope that makes sense.

 

As always be aware of potential risks when dealing with fuel.

[ukcooper]

They are different injection and carb , injection is has a bent arm half way down to the float.

If you bend the arm, write it on the back of the tank so the next person knows and dose not think its a 1959 clubman copper works s :)

if you want a cheep one try the breaking section.



As always be aware of potential risks when dealing with fuel...... as been said ......

Edited by ukcooper, 20 July 2016 - 01:46 PM.

[skoughi]

I bought a replacement sender from minisport (correct one for my clubman) but I still had to spend an hour or so fitting, checking what the gauge said, removing sender and bending the float arm, refitting, checking gauge, removing sender, bending sender arm, etc etc etc. Kinda got there in the end, probably could do with another tweek, the boot and myself stank of fuel at the end and spent an age cleaning everything but can still smell a faint whiff!

[Spider]

Sorry to the OP for going OT.

 

I bought a replacement sender from minisport (correct one for my clubman) but I still had to spend an hour or so fitting, checking what the gauge said, removing sender and bending the float arm, refitting, checking gauge, removing sender, bending sender arm, etc etc etc. Kinda got there in the end, probably could do with another tweek, the boot and myself stank of fuel at the end and spent an age cleaning everything but can still smell a faint whiff!

 

Good work for going to that kind of trouble, but there is actually an adjustment on the sender itself for this.

 

There's also bottom end and top end adjustments on the factory fuel (and temp) gauges too, but first thing is to get the sender right.

 

If you look on the other side of the body from where the float wire comes out, there's slot head screw, they used to be brass, but now nylon, that's it. It's a friction device to set the relationship between the angle of the arm and the wiper of the resistor internally. You can see it poking out on the can on this sender

 

 

 

Here's a couple of pics of a conventional (loose) gauge showing the adjusters, the Central Gauge and Tripple Clock Set are the same (though I can't recall with the later Nippon sets)

 

 

and inside

 

 

the red arrows showing there the screw driver would be inserted and the blue ones the slides that move to allow for the adjustment, though, it's all done from the back.

[Northernpower]

With the tank empty, I was able to test it using a piece of string through the filler neck, then attached to the arm, to check its travel to make sure it wasn't catching, then had to lengthen the amount of travel as it was only showing 3/4 full when arm was at highest point, to do this I run a temporary extension wire from the feed to the sender, then earthed it to the choke cable, so I could adjust the travel whilst watching the gauge, hope that makes sense.

I don't quite follow what you are explaining, Would you mind putting in a little more detail.

[Northernpower]

Sorry to the OP for going OT.

 

I bought a replacement sender from minisport (correct one for my clubman) but I still had to spend an hour or so fitting, checking what the gauge said, removing sender and bending the float arm, refitting, checking gauge, removing sender, bending sender arm, etc etc etc. Kinda got there in the end, probably could do with another tweek, the boot and myself stank of fuel at the end and spent an age cleaning everything but can still smell a faint whiff!

 

Good work for going to that kind of trouble, but there is actually an adjustment on the sender itself for this.

 

There's also bottom end and top end adjustments on the factory fuel (and temp) gauges too, but first thing is to get the sender right.

 

If you look on the other side of the body from where the float wire comes out, there's slot head screw, they used to be brass, but now nylon, that's it. It's a friction device to set the relationship between the angle of the arm and the wiper of the resistor internally. You can see it poking out on the can on this sender

 

 

 

Here's a couple of pics of a conventional (loose) gauge showing the adjusters, the Central Gauge and Tripple Clock Set are the same (though I can't recall with the later Nippon sets)

 

 

and inside

 

 

the red arrows showing there the screw driver would be inserted and the blue ones the slides that move to allow for the adjustment, though, it's all done from the back.

I understand that, I'll give it a go, thanks.

[Spider]

Just before you rush in to adjust it, are you finding with a full tank, the gauge sits on 3/4's for a while, ie until the actual fuel level drops to about 3/4's?

 

If so, then adjustment may not be needed.

 

It seems from what the other guys have said, there's brackets inside the MPI fuel tank that can foul the float on a standard sender and so stop it rising to the top (to show a full tank).

Edited by Moke Spider, 20 July 2016 - 10:02 PM.

[Northernpower]

Just before you rush in to adjust it, are you finding with a full tank, the gauge sits on 3/4's for a while, ie until the actual fuel level drops to about 3/4's?
 
If so, then adjustment may not be needed.
 
It seems from what the other guys have said, there's brackets inside the MPI fuel tank that can foul the float on a standard sender and so stop it rising to the top (to show a full tank).

Its made think about it as well. Until I remove the sender I won't know if its adjustment or its fowling something in the tank.

[skoughi]

Sorry to the OP for going OT.

 

I bought a replacement sender from minisport (correct one for my clubman) but I still had to spend an hour or so fitting, checking what the gauge said, removing sender and bending the float arm, refitting, checking gauge, removing sender, bending sender arm, etc etc etc. Kinda got there in the end, probably could do with another tweek, the boot and myself stank of fuel at the end and spent an age cleaning everything but can still smell a faint whiff!

 

Good work for going to that kind of trouble, but there is actually an adjustment on the sender itself for this.

 

There's also bottom end and top end adjustments on the factory fuel (and temp) gauges too, but first thing is to get the sender right.

 

If you look on the other side of the body from where the float wire comes out, there's slot head screw, they used to be brass, but now nylon, that's it. It's a friction device to set the relationship between the angle of the arm and the wiper of the resistor internally. You can see it poking out on the can on this sender

 

 

 

Here's a couple of pics of a conventional (loose) gauge showing the adjusters, the Central Gauge and Tripple Clock Set are the same (though I can't recall with the later Nippon sets)

 

 

and inside

 

 

the red arrows showing there the screw driver would be inserted and the blue ones the slides that move to allow for the adjustment, though, it's all done from the back.

Aye I noticed it and even went to the bother of opening up the box to check that the arm was lining up with the resistor at the top and bottom positions, which it was. It seemed that the float wire was slightly out of shape because whilst I had approx a quarter of a tank of fuel the float was just touching the fuel and the gauge was showing empty, so I had to bend it a few times to get the float wire at an angle that I felt it should have been. I could've sent it back and waited about a week for a replacement but thought sod it I'll bend it!

[Spider]

Aye I noticed it and even went to the bother of opening up the box to check that the arm was lining up with the resistor at the top and bottom positions, which it was. It seemed that the float wire was slightly out of shape because whilst I had approx a quarter of a tank of fuel the float was just touching the fuel and the gauge was showing empty, so I had to bend it a few times to get the float wire at an angle that I felt it should have been. I could've sent it back and waited about a week for a replacement but thought sod it I'll bend it!

 

 

In that case, that's where you'd adjust the gauge.

 

Sorry, I was probably a bit light on some detail in my post, I was only showing that adjustment is possible.

 

I start off with the sender and adjust them so at full I have 16 ohms and empty 290 ohms, adjusting this on the sender as I've suggested.

 

Once that's squared away, I then use that sender on the gauge and adjust the gauge, starting with the sender in the full position then tweak the gauge to show full, then same at empty, finally checking (and tweaking) at full again. It usually takes about 2 goes at it all, but can get there.

[JBW]

 

With the tank empty, I was able to test it using a piece of string through the filler neck, then attached to the arm, to check its travel to make sure it wasn't catching, then had to lengthen the amount of travel as it was only showing 3/4 full when arm was at highest point, to do this I run a temporary extension wire from the feed to the sender, then earthed it to the choke cable, so I could adjust the travel whilst watching the gauge, hope that makes sense.

I don't quite follow what you are explaining, Would you mind putting in a little more detail.

 

 

Sorry to try & make it clearer, I had to check the sender was not catching on anything (injection pump ?) in the tank, so having adjusted the arm to a similar shape to the correct injection sender, so by using a piece of string through the filler neck & attached to the float I was able to check that it was not catching on anything as it had originally.

Then I realised that it would only go to 3/4 full, my car has the Nippon gauges which as far as I know are not adjustable, so I had to adjust the sender, hence extending  the live feed that goes to the sender, I could sit in the car with the sender to adjust its travel, earthing the sender to the choke cable. The adjustment meant modifying the casing of the sender to allow longer travel

 

My car is a 93 carb  one & I think they by that time they all had the injection tank fitted, the previous owner had replaced the sender, but with the straight type sender, all the parts suppliers I checked said it was the correct sender, but I found previous posts on TMF, which helped me to sort it

[Northernpower]

 

 

With the tank empty, I was able to test it using a piece of string through the filler neck, then attached to the arm, to check its travel to make sure it wasn't catching, then had to lengthen the amount of travel as it was only showing 3/4 full when arm was at highest point, to do this I run a temporary extension wire from the feed to the sender, then earthed it to the choke cable, so I could adjust the travel whilst watching the gauge, hope that makes sense.

I don't quite follow what you are explaining, Would you mind putting in a little more detail.

 

 

Sorry to try & make it clearer, I had to check the sender was not catching on anything (injection pump ?) in the tank, so having adjusted the arm to a similar shape to the correct injection sender, so by using a piece of string through the filler neck & attached to the float I was able to check that it was not catching on anything as it had originally.

Then I realised that it would only go to 3/4 full, my car has the Nippon gauges which as far as I know are not adjustable, so I had to adjust the sender, hence extending  the live feed that goes to the sender, I could sit in the car with the sender to adjust its travel, earthing the sender to the choke cable. The adjustment meant modifying the casing of the sender to allow longer travel

 

My car is a 93 carb  one & I think they by that time they all had the injection tank fitted, the previous owner had replaced the sender, but with the straight type sender, all the parts suppliers I checked said it was the correct sender, but I found previous posts on TMF, which helped me to sort it

 

That's great I now fully understand what you meant.