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70S And 80S Endangered Cars........


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#1 mab01uk

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Posted 31 July 2016 - 07:23 PM

"Motors such as the Austin Metro, Morris Marina and Ford Sierra, that once dominated Britain's streets and driveways until relatively recently are now on the verge of extinction.

That's according to classic car insurance specialist ClassicLine, which has kickstarted a campaign to save a number of cars that were once responsible for transporting a nation.

The insurer has reviewed data to identify which mainstream models from the 1970s and 80s are on the verge of disappearing - comparing the number registered on the road today with how many were originally produced and how they have declined over the last decade."

http://www.thisismon...0s-extinct.html

 

 



#2 MrBounce

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Posted 31 July 2016 - 09:25 PM

Hardly surprising as most cars are seen as disposable modes of transport. Only an enthusiast would be interested in saving one, which is where we come in. There just aren't many people who get misty eyed about a Hillman Avenger.

My Midas has door mirrors from a Renault 14. I have no idea how many are left on the road in Britain, but I was extremely lucky to buy my missing one on ebay from a British seller who was breaking a rotten one. I havent seen one on ebay since, and I bought the mirror in 2012.

Edit: there are 20 - more than I expected!

Edited by MrBounce, 01 August 2016 - 06:42 AM.


#3 Cooperman

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Posted 02 August 2016 - 03:49 PM

Whilst there was a lot of dross, there were some excellent and possibly under-rated cars.

One car I owned and loved was the 1977 Granada Ghia 3.0 Coupe. I wish I had it now. The original BMW 7-series was also superb, but few exist now.

The Morris Marina was a very poor car and it's not surprising so few exist, but the Rover SD1 was basically good although it suffered from poor paint quality.

I still fancy a Sierra XR4x4.



#4 greenwheels

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Posted 02 August 2016 - 04:04 PM

Why do people decry the poor old Marina? I had one and it was a superb car for my young family. It was no race car, but it was reliable, easy to maintain, and did everything I wanted of it. I preferred it much more than the Ford offerings of the time. Mine was a 1300 A series, My mate had an 1800 which had stiffer suspension and was superb. A friend has just added an estate to his classic car fleet and it is an excellent car. There is more chance of seeing a Marina at a Classic Car show than a Cortina.    Long live the Marina/Ital.



#5 Cooperman

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Posted 02 August 2016 - 09:38 PM

I was invited to the launch of the Marina. I was invited to take an extended drive in a 1.8 and did around 20 miles in it. It was simply horrible compared to my 1-year old Ford Cortina 1600E. I then invited the sales guy to try my 1600E after which he said that there was little point in him trying to persuade me to buy a Marina.

Later I had the dubious pleasure of rallying in a Marina 1.8TC. We were the only crew ever to get a Marina into the top 10 of a Motoring news national Rally. The basic issue was the suspension & steering which was similar to the Minor 1000. 

It was quite simply a nasty, badly engineered car.

Sorry if that offends any Marina enthusiasts, but it is the truth.



#6 jamesmpi

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Posted 04 August 2016 - 08:31 PM


I still fancy a Sierra XR4x4.


Right up your street Cooperman
http://www.ebay.co.u...tm/282121923036

#7 Shooter63

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Posted 04 August 2016 - 08:53 PM

I've got to agree with cooperman here morris marina's were crap , in fact all the bmc/Leyland cars of that era where pretty rubbish even the sd1 was poor, the build quality ( loose term) was non existent. Roots cars were just as bad, fords not a lot better. When I think of it most companies seemed to make better cars in the sixties.

Shooter

#8 Cooperman

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Posted 05 August 2016 - 01:42 PM

 

I still fancy a Sierra XR4x4.


Right up your street Cooperman
http://www.ebay.co.u...tm/282121923036

 

What a great car and at a sensible price too. A true future classic and it would be nice to drive.

 

On the subject of BLMC/ARG/Rover, or whatever they were calling themselves at the time, I had a 1973 XJ6, pre BLMC, which was superb. I then had a 1977 XJ4.2C and whilst is was well-designed, the build quality and component quality was very poor. In fact, it was my experience of this which induced me to buy a new BMW 732 in early 1980 and I've had BMW's ever since.

 

The paint on the SD1 range was very badly done and we had a company Rover SD1 2.6 which required a complete re-paint at 8-months old as the gold metallic paint was coming off in great patches. The Sd1 was not a patch on the 1960's P6 range and the 3.5 V8 P6 I once owned was a very nice car.

 

Another car let down by the detailed engineering and build was the Maxi. That was a fine concept and it went well with a modern overhead-cam alloy engine, but the gear-change (cable operated) was dreadful and the rest of the build quality far from ideal.

 

The good BLMC cars of the 70's included the Triumph 2500, the Dolomite Sprint, and the XJS. The worst were probably the Marina and the Allegro (All-agro ;D ).

 

Could it all have been saved? Now there is a question to ponder. Very poor top management, mediocre middle-management, stupid trades unions, poorly designed old-technology products and serious loss-making badly equipped manufacturing plants of which there were too many probably had the entire operation doomed from about 1972. As a supplier to them, as well as to Ford and GM, it was obvious that they were going no-where compared to the big boys who had rationalised product ranges and good manufacturing technology. Then along came the Japs!!

Very sad really.



#9 MrBounce

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Posted 05 August 2016 - 04:20 PM

I always had the impression that BL etc were technologically about a decade behind their main rivals when it came to new models. Look at the Metro for example. It was about 2 to 3 years too late, still used 1950s engine/gearbox combos and the build quality was not the best.

The basic designs were generally quite good - it's just that there were so many budget constraints and so much political infighting that most of the good ideas were shelved. I also think that the "power" wielded by Issigonis in the 60s meant that many half decent designers had their suggestions binned for fear of upsetting the boss. By the time of the early 70s the money problems were well in place and Issigonis was gone by then.

My Dad didn't have a car in the 80s so he hired cars when needed (quite regularly due to 2 kids at boarding school). Despite living behind an Austin Rover dealer, it was rare that we hired one of their cars. Instead we popped to the local Ford dealer, borrowing numerous Escorts, Sierras and on one occasion, even a Transit minibus when the car we'd been allocated was broken into. The "bad" hire cars were as follows: A Vauxhall Chevette with a heater stuck on hot (in July!), an Escort which leaked in heavy rain (ruining Mum's coat in the footwell), a Sierra with a leaky exhaust which made us all feel sick and, worst of all, a Morris Ital which gave my Dad such horrible backache he needed to seek medical help.

That said, we had some marvellous cars. An early Sierra diesel with the Peugeot 2.3 engine which we got an indicated (& probably rather optimistic) 116 mph out of, a Turbo Technics development Sierra diesel (not set up properly but quick with SO much torque), the first of the 1.4 Escort Mk4s which was a very well put together car despite being beige, numerous Sierra estates, hatchbacks and Sapphires and, when we had to get a Vauxhall, a 1992 Carlton 2 litre estate which was simply excellent at mile-munching.

They were of course, mainly basic models we hired. However it showed why Ford were streets ahead of anything that AR had to offer. They could play the fleet market perfectly with well engineered, if basic models that did exactly what was asked of them. When you use a hammer, you don't want the head to fly off. Fords simply did the job asked of them. Austin Rover had no clue by comparison.

Edited by MrBounce, 05 August 2016 - 04:23 PM.


#10 Cooperman

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Posted 05 August 2016 - 07:51 PM

In this country Ford and Vauxhall competed with each other. Ford had the Fiesta, Escort, Cortina and Granada plus the Capri for those wanting a coupe. Against this Vauxhall had the Cheveley, Viva, Cavalier and Senator (Royale), plus the Manta as a Capri rival.
BLMC seemed happier to compete with themselves, eg Rover SD1 v Triumph 2000/2500. They simply had no concept of product range rationalisation or target market.
The trades unions would not allow plant closures either and the Labour Gov't supported them with public cash supporting the huge losses.
Then along came the Japanese cars and the end of BLMC/ARG/ROVER became inevitable really.

#11 JBW

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Posted 07 August 2016 - 08:06 AM

I was invited to the launch of the Marina. I was invited to take an extended drive in a 1.8 and did around 20 miles in it. It was simply horrible compared to my 1-year old Ford Cortina 1600E. I then invited the sales guy to try my 1600E after which he said that there was little point in him trying to persuade me to buy a Marina.

Later I had the dubious pleasure of rallying in a Marina 1.8TC. We were the only crew ever to get a Marina into the top 10 of a Motoring news national Rally. The basic issue was the suspension & steering which was similar to the Minor 1000. 

It was quite simply a nasty, badly engineered car.

Sorry if that offends any Marina enthusiasts, but it is the truth.

 

I heard that Brian Culcheth, had rolled a Marina on his way down to Bagshot (they used to test there), that was from a family friend who was the gofer for the competition's dept.

Never heard  any more about it, so don't know if its true or not, but the Marina was not highly regarded in rallying circles. 



#12 mab01uk

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Posted 07 August 2016 - 10:14 AM

BLMC seemed happier to compete with themselves, eg Rover SD1 v Triumph 2000/2500. They simply had no concept of product range rationalisation or target market.
 

 

Another example was Triumph developing a completely new V8 engine for the Stag when Rover (in the same BL Group!) already had their excellent alloy V8 engine (originally from Buick). The Triumph V8 proved unreliable and their was later an aftermarket company doing good business transplanting Rover V8's into Stags for owners........

 

(Of course today parts have been developed to make the Stag V8 reliable and as a classic car it is now worth more with its original engine)



#13 Cooperman

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Posted 07 August 2016 - 07:47 PM


I was invited to the launch of the Marina. I was invited to take an extended drive in a 1.8 and did around 20 miles in it. It was simply horrible compared to my 1-year old Ford Cortina 1600E. I then invited the sales guy to try my 1600E after which he said that there was little point in him trying to persuade me to buy a Marina.
Later I had the dubious pleasure of rallying in a Marina 1.8TC. We were the only crew ever to get a Marina into the top 10 of a Motoring news national Rally. The basic issue was the suspension & steering which was similar to the Minor 1000. 
It was quite simply a nasty, badly engineered car.
Sorry if that offends any Marina enthusiasts, but it is the truth.

 
I heard that Brian Culcheth, had rolled a Marina on his way down to Bagshot (they used to test there), that was from a family friend who was the gofer for the competition's dept.
Never heard  any more about it, so don't know if its true or not, but the Marina was not highly regarded in rallying circles. 

Brian is an old friend of mine and I do believe that story is true.

#14 pusb

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Posted 08 August 2016 - 04:17 PM

Whilst there was a lot of dross, there were some excellent and possibly under-rated cars.

One car I owned and loved was the 1977 Granada Ghia 3.0 Coupe. I wish I had it now. The original BMW 7-series was also superb, but few exist now.

The Morris Marina was a very poor car and it's not surprising so few exist, but the Rover SD1 was basically good although it suffered from poor paint quality.

I still fancy a Sierra XR4x4.

 

My Grandad had a Morris Marina. My Dad always said the reason it was considered such a poor car was because it was just meant as a stop gap for BL. When it first come out in the early 70's it's competition wasn't particularly any more advanced, however by the late 70's car design had moved on a lot and the Marina seemed very dated. Basically it should only have been in production for 4-5 years.

 

I wasn't around then so I might be talking complete rubbish!






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