23 replies to this topic

[Poppet2]

Was there any difference in the last classic mini they built?
Was it less noisier, where there alliminium pedals, was it more comfortable due to better suspension, did the five speed gear box really make a difference?

I am asking as I am thinking of buying a final year classic mini.

[hazpalmer14]

In terms of the last one off the line to the first one off the line there are some large differences. At the point of the last one coming off the line BMW were already in involved and they had to evolve the mini to get through new leglisation coming in. So the later year minis were MPI, the 5 speed box was an aftermarket thing. They did have a 2.7 diff so gives a quieter drive at motorway speeds, there were also things like drivers air bag and side impact protection in terms of door bars fitted. The quality in terms of how the shells were prepped and painted etc does mean they suffer from rust a little more then say a 70's mini for example. Like I said they were MPI engines, so means they are a bit more reliable verses a car with a carb and points.

[Boycie]

They were more refined, as above but if you've never owned a Mini before, it will seem noisy and slow- especially if you're used to modern cars.

Even the late ones with their long difs are not motorway cruisers as such.

[THE ANORAK]

there were so many changes to the mini over the years and not all of them were for the better, but then that's largely down to opinion.

 

are the later ones more comfortable?... well no, because the 13inch wheels spoil the ride. but they do have more creature comforts. if you went for one of the late minis with 12inch wheels you could get the best of both worlds.

 

less rust ??... well no, because the factory were cost cutting and used cheap steel. I've seen late minis rust at a shocking rate. in my opinion the best minis for avoiding rust are those with fixed rear side windows. the hinged windows seem to let the water in to the rear bins.

 

5 speed gearbox was overrated and not standard.

 

you have to decide what's important to you. for me its disc brakes with servo and 12inch wheels, rear seatbelts for the kids and carb engine, not injection. this limits me to a production period of about 5 years from 1987 onwards.

 

work out what's important to you and go from there.

Edited by THE ANORAK, 08 April 2017 - 11:04 AM.

[Boycie]

you have to decide what's important to you. for me its disc brakes with servo and 12inch wheels, rear seatbelts for the kids and carb engine, not injection. this limits me to a production period of about 5 years from 1987 onwards.

 

That's the 'sweet spot' for me, too.  My mainstream Coop fits the bill quite nicely, but the early 10" wheel cars do look so... right!

[Poppet2]

there were so many changes to the mini over the years and not all of them were for the better, but then that's largely down to opinion.
 
are the later ones more comfortable?... well no, because the 13inch wheels spoil the ride. but they do have more creature comforts. if you went for one of the late minis with 12inch wheels you could get the best of both worlds.
 
less rust ??... well no, because the factory were cost cutting and used cheap steel. I've seen late minis rust at a shocking rate. in my opinion the best minis for avoiding rust are those with fixed rear side windows. the hinged windows seem to let the water in to the rear bins.
 
5 speed gearbox was overrated and not standard.
 
you have to decide what's important to you. for me its disc brakes with servo and 12inch wheels, rear seatbelts for the kids and carb engine, not injection. this limits me to a production period of about 5 years from 1987 onwards.
 
work out what's important to you and go from there.

What difference does the injection engine make compared to the other engines?

[THE ANORAK]

I'm not an injection expert but it gives you the benefits of a modern engine. no choke to play with, better fuel economy, better emissions etc, but then again all this is down to opinion.

 

the reason i stay away from them is the fact its all more complicated. a carb is a simple mechanism that i understand (just)

 

the injections were in two types. single point or spi, and multi point or mpi. the mpi came in in 1996 (i think). the down side to an mpi is the lack of space in the engine bay. its all very very tight and makes simple things very hard.

 

one other important point about the mpi engines is that they are all the same. by that i mean there is no difference between the cooper set up and the non cooper set up. the only difference is the trim and paint.

Edited by THE ANORAK, 08 April 2017 - 11:19 AM.

[mab01uk]

Lots of info on the later Minis and the original brochures which may be of help in the links below:-

Mini Mpi 1997 Brochure & Prices

http://www.theminifo...rochure-prices/

 

October 1st 1996 - Rover Press Release

http://www.roblightb...-documents.html

 

Mike Theaker on the Development of the Twin Point Injection system for the Mini.

http://www.turbomini...ts/493117-1.pdf

 

Launch preview at BMH Gaydon, of the upgraded Mini MPI (Multi Point Injection) range for 1997 with drivers airbag, seatbelt pre-tensioners, door side impact bars and front mounted radiator. Despite Rover's original plan to end Mini production in 1997 due to new European safety and emmisions legislation, BMW's new investment in the Mini and John Cooper's insistence on this last update finally got the MPI into production in 1996, extending the Mini's life by 4 more years until the launch of the New MINI in 2001.

Edited by mab01uk, 08 April 2017 - 11:41 AM.

[THE ANORAK]

take a look at this. now this may not be important to you on a day to day basis but it shows the level of "progress" the mini went through.
 
an old "early" mini engine...


 
mid production 998 carb engine...



Cooper Carb engine with brake servo...


 
Spi or single point fuel injection engine. getting a bit crowded now. note the washer bottle has gone (moved to the boot)...


 
Mpi engine bay !!!!!   thats progress for you !!! all this is going to get in your way every time you do something...


 
 
apart from the engine bay the rest of the car just about stayed the same throughout production. yes the trim changed, yes the switches changes but the basic nuts and bolts of the car are very much the same
 
one thing i forgot to say about the Mpi minis.... airbag and side impact bars. may be important to you.

Edited by THE ANORAK, 08 April 2017 - 11:48 AM.

[ukcooper]

last ones had 13" wheel what ruined it, looked better but drove crap. nope have not read it all thro.

[xrocketengineer]

And if you get one for the Japanese market you get air conditioning too... plus many more snakes in the pit.

 

 

[Ethel]

The injection cars were done to keep up with emissions standards, but they  mean less routine maintenance. Compared to most other original spec Minis, better torque delivery also allowed them to pull lower final drives making them a bit more civilised. Many enthusiasts prefer carb'ed engines as they're easier to tune and maintain.

 

Owning a Mini will make you more knowledgeable about engineering, you'll realise that gear ratios are more important than the number of gears. Minis are nippy because they are light, they don't need that much power to keep up with traffic so they don't have as high a, licence threatening, top speed. If your speed range is less , you don't need as many gears to cover it, apart from the general advantages low weight gives you to get moving and accelerate without stirring about in your gearbox.

[blackbelt1990]

I always found that my SPi was a bit thurstier than my carb mini.

[surfblue]

And if you get one for the Japanese market you get air conditioning too... plus many more snakes in the pit.

 

 

That is a really impressive visual explanation of how far the Mini came in its 41 years, the earliest models approaching their 58th birthday this year.

I have driven virtually every age of mini (except a MK2?) I have a Mk1 at the minute, 850 cc of raw power. I drove mid 80s Minis when I passed my test and had a SPI and my wife an MPI when they were both new and current. The most recent was a 1998 Cooper Sportspack and it was lovely simply due to its styling, walnut dash, leather, arches, spotlights etc, my '63 Mark 1 is very "pure" and has a lovely simplicity about it but if Im thinking about what I enjoyed driving the most it was my '87 A+ engined 1000 and Im wondering if it's rose tinted glasses because I was young and had no responsibilities and could just tear about in cars with my mates when I liked?

They are all special in their own ways for different reason but I know which one I'd rather have to get the spanners out to fix.....

[hennasxi]

Hardly any have 5 speed 'Jack Knight' gearboxes or other aftermarket ones, probably less than 50.  All were 4 speed manuals up to the end, unless you go for an auto of course, but they were 4 speed as well.   MPi's are generally much easier to live with, and I have found them very reliable.  They are a bit quieter too as they have front mounted radiator with electric fan, better bulk head insulation and higher gearing.  I also prefer the seats in an MPi on a long journey too. The later air-con fitted cars for Jap market late 1996 were a SPi but with MPi features like a coil pack and air bag etc, but still with a side mounted rad, so different again to the one in the photo posted !