21 replies to this topic

[DUF2]

This may seem a stupid question, but that has never stopped me in the past!
LED lights are supposed to be cool running and consume less electricity than a standard halogen lamp. So why do LED headlight & spotlight bulbs require a fan on the back of the bulb?

If they require a fan surely there must be inefficiencies due to wasted heat! The halogen lamp does not need cooling. If the fan is recirculating the air within the light bowl, how and where does this unwanted heat disappate to? Will the headlight bowl require cooling slots to allow heat to escape a fresh cool air to be drawn in, also with the possibility of drawing road spray into the lamp?

I have tried HID lighting in the past, but have noticed a nice bright light but usually poor beam patterns.
One of the things I noticed, is the filament location is not the same as for a standard halogen bulb, so hence the beam is not focused correctly.
As example take an H7 bulb, the filament is say 30mm from the mounting flange, with an HID equivalent the filament could be say 40mm from the flange, so the light source is not at the correct position within the lens/reflector for the optimum beam pattern hence folks being dazzled by HID lights.

Does anyone know if the filaments (or whatever they are called on an LED light) have been positioned in the same place as on a halogen bulb?
One H4 LED lamp I have seen has a little baffle on the lamp shroud which is presumably to provide the correct cut off on the dipped beam. Now I'm guessing here but I presume these lamps are for LHD vehicles, also that these lamps will as a result have the beam cut off in the wrong place for a RHD vehicle!  image.jpeg   18.26K   1 downloads

Here is a pic showing the baffle I'm talking about.
Looking forward to you comments, Thanks

Edited by DUF2, 08 February 2018 - 05:58 PM.

[Icey]

The light from an LED is generated in a very small area (the 'junction'), so as the luminosity increases, taking the power demands with it - the heat generated has to removed before it reaches the breakdown temperatures (~125deg). If it isn't cooled properly you'll cut the life to a fraction of what it should be (years down to months or days). Modern headlights have cooling channels built in.

 

Even with active cooling, an LED will still use a fraction of what a filament bulb does.

 

And lastly, power consumption of both is irrelevant in a car. You're looking at ~100watts being drawn from a power source generating many kilowatts. It's a drop in the ocean.

[DUF2]

Has anyone on this forum tried LED replacement bulbs?

[Spider]

Like HID replacement 'bulbs' I'm not certain that swapping out Halogens for LEDs is legal - best look in to that aspect first.

 

The other thing is that as Icey pointed out, due to the way the light comes from these, they need a different reflector to be properly effective and this also goes to that I've mentioned above.

 

I have seen complete replacement LED Headlights for not too much money. If legal, these would be a much better approach.

[DUF2]

Moke thanks for your reply.
Yes you can buy LED replacement headlights but they would look ******* in my '65 Elf. The car has had the headlights replaced recently with standard H4 bulbs. My Leon has LED lights & I know how good they are. I also have an HID H4 kit in my garage, but it is only the dipped beam that is HID. The main beam is just a halogen bulb tagged onto the side of the bulb.
I will probably replace the standard bulbs with higher output Phillips or Osram bulbs.
The car also has driving lights which have H3 bulbs. I was querying the LED bulbs as if they worked I might try them in the spots, however I don't think the fan on the back of an LED bulb will fit within the lamp bowl.
I know there are limitations with the beam pattern on an HID bulb due to the light source being in a different location from the mounting flange which then causes problems with the focusing of the beam.
I was hoping someone would respond and say this is not a problem with LED conversion bulbs or state the beam focusing problem is still there with the LED conversion.

[lawrence]

Led replacement headlights are the way to go if you want more light. The ones I have fitted at a flat beam and mot compliant in the uk. Like you say they do suit only specific car style and yours going by your profile if not so much

You are also comparing the elf to a new car, it's never going to be as good.

Fit some nightbreakers or something and a set of spots for your high beam if light is an issue. That was the route I took prior to led lights.

[imack]

I fitted these philips zes h4 led bulbs about a year ago in my mini. They have a reversable heatsink instead of a fan ans leds that try to replicate the positions of the dipped and main beam filaments. Give a perfect cut of in my very old lucas h4 headlamps.

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•  reversible-heat-sink-g7-700x700.jpg   27.58K   2 downloads

[Northernpower]

I fitted these philips zes h4 led bulbs about a year ago in my mini. They have a reversable heatsink instead of a fan ans leds that try to replicate the positions of the dipped and main beam filaments. Give a perfect cut of in my very old lucas h4 headlamps.

They look interesting, are they any brighter and where did you get them from?

[Spider]

Here's some advise from Osram on this subject;-

 

(On HID conversions)

 

",,,,,These conversion sets include xenon lamps whose bases have been adapted to fit the lampholders of halogen lamps. This is prohibited, and that is not the only snag, for there are good reasons for this prohibition: The xenon lamp no longer matches the optical features of the headlamp.,,,,"

 

(and on LED conversions)

 

",,,,,the LED devices even operate with a supply voltage of 12 volts. Installing them is quick and simple. But anyone who attempts this feat will soon notice that, cool as their headlamps may look from outside the car, hardly any light comes out of them.,,,,,"

 

https://www.carlight...can-it-be-done/

 

 

and from one of our local Motoring Organisations;-

 

https://www.racq.com...fely/headlights

 

while this relates to Aust, we largely follow what's happening in Europe in regards to regulations

[Ethel]

I just don't get the obsession with brighter headlights (mainstream motor press etc.). It just seems the same as the simplistic view that  more gears, holes 'n grooves in brakes and bigger rims with wider tyres is always better. Even sealed beams are adequate most of the time and you can see more than far enough with a reasonable set of halogens. It's what your headlights don't light up that's the problem* and brighter, sharper beams make seeing in the shadows fore of a challenge for your eyeballs.

 

*that and the numpties who have the dip adjusters wound as high as possible and use main beam where street lights make them irrelevant    

[r3k1355]

Like HID replacement 'bulbs' I'm not certain that swapping out Halogens for LEDs is legal - best look in to that aspect first.

 

I read some clickbait earlier in the week saying HID conversion bulbs were now an MOT failure, I assume LED bulbs will be too.

 

Previously you were kinda ok if the beam pattern was correct, some testers would moan if light washers and auto-levellers were not present.

Edited by r3k1355, 27 February 2018 - 11:38 AM.

[r3k1355]

 

I fitted these philips zes h4 led bulbs about a year ago in my mini. They have a reversable heatsink instead of a fan ans leds that try to replicate the positions of the dipped and main beam filaments. Give a perfect cut of in my very old lucas h4 headlamps.

They look interesting, are they any brighter and where did you get them from?

 

 

Horizon sell them I believe

 

http://www.horizonle...ights-headlamps

[warning634]

I replaced my entire headlight for some 7" LED units and they are fantastic!

[Spider]

 

Like HID replacement 'bulbs' I'm not certain that swapping out Halogens for LEDs is legal - best look in to that aspect first.

 

I read some clickbait earlier in the week saying HID conversion bulbs were now an MOT failure, I assume LED bulbs will be too.

 

Previously you were kinda ok if the beam pattern was correct, some testers would moan if light washers and auto-levellers were not present.

 

 

It is a defectable item in these parts too.

 

I ** think ** some of the last Minis had HID from the factory, but they had washers and self levelers.

[Northernpower]

 

 

I fitted these philips zes h4 led bulbs about a year ago in my mini. They have a reversable heatsink instead of a fan ans leds that try to replicate the positions of the dipped and main beam filaments. Give a perfect cut of in my very old lucas h4 headlamps.

They look interesting, are they any brighter and where did you get them from?

 

 

Horizon sell them I believe

 

http://www.horizonle...ights-headlamps

 

Wow, they're not cheap