17 replies to this topic

[Mini Stripey]

Been chatting with sprocket on a topic and have been advised to start a new one, forgive me but I'm totally new to forums. Ok here goes.
96 mini spi with alarm and immobiliser fitted, been stored 18 years, starts sometimes, runs sometimes for 5 minutes sometimes runs for an hour.
Runs fine if fuel pump relay is held in or dabbing earth to black purple wire from single plug ecu, replaced crank sensor, still same, swapped main relay box with another used one - same, current one spotlesson clean, removed manifold and cleaned temp sensor on bottom of manifold as sometimes running at 2500 rpm, checked all wiring harness under bonnet no faults or damage found, removed and cleaned earth strap in boot and engine to bulkhead and earth near ecu, all to to avail.... I assumed was faulty ecu not sending earth to fuel pump relay, swapped with secondhand ecu with no fobs still same...spoke with sprocket suggested stepper motor, sure enough wasn't doing what it was supposed to do, just sort of hesitating and buzzing not spinning, put second ecu on and straight away stepper motor does exact;y as it should, so I assume faulty ecu? Now starts most times on original ecu but stepper motor doesn't do anything, runs for 5 minutes and then cuts out, sometimes fuel pump relay not being activated sometimes does, but when it stops it just dies, has fuel has spark, then won't start until next day, have swapped fuel pump, relay box, crank sensor, stepper motor, injector, alarm box in dash, ecu (no fobs but did prove stepper motor works) any thoughts guys? I think it's seven days under the bonnet now and don't know where to go next, I've sourced a secondhand ecu alarm box and fobs but won't revive for a few days. Please please help if you can, willing to try anything. Many thanks in advance

[Mini Stripey]

Also tried dabbing earth from batter to earth points with jump leads and have replaced all 18 fuses

[Mini Stripey]

New ecu fob and alarm box fitted now stepper motor functions correctly.. but oh no, fuel pump relay still not pulling in.... I'm totally at a loss.....anybody please help
If I hold relay in starts and runs perfect
Anybody out there?

[viz139]

This is a long shot but a problem I had and something mentioned in a Rover Technical Bulletin concerning the issue of probing plugs. When you probe a plug from the front inserting the probe can move the contacts appart causing an open circuit or intermittent fault. Your problem may be on the Black/Purple cable from the ecu to the relay pack, can you back probe the connections at each end to see if the negitive is leaving the ecu and if its getting to the relay pack plug. The fact that you are having ecu issues may be that the whole plug was probed at some point.

[Mini Stripey]

This is a long shot but a problem I had and something mentioned in a Rover Technical Bulletin concerning the issue of probing plugs. When you probe a plug from the front inserting the probe can move the contacts appart causing an open circuit or intermittent fault. Your problem may be on the Black/Purple cable from the ecu to the relay pack, can you back probe the connections at each end to see if the negitive is leaving the ecu and if its getting to the relay pack plug. The fact that you are having ecu issues may be that the whole plug was probed at some point.

H on the road
Thank you for your reply. I don't seem to be getting any replies. I've actually spliced in to the purple black from ecu and not getting earth from ecu, I do have earth to ecu on pink grey I think so the earth is being fed to ecu but no earth from ecu 99 ties out of a 100 whenitfeels like it it will prime fuelpump on ignition to rite up and run sweet for some ties 5minutes or so. It's totally driving me crazy, if I swap to original ecu immobiliser and fobs fuel relaypulls in nearly every time but doesn't activate stepper motor, car is totally standard as it left factory, today I unraveled 90mpercent of loom and no faults it's crazy that some times does exactly as it should and 5 minutes later nothing,, is there nobody can help me ?

[Mini Stripey]

This is a long shot but a problem I had and something mentioned in a Rover Technical Bulletin concerning the issue of probing plugs. When you probe a plug from the front inserting the probe can move the contacts appart causing an open circuit or intermittent fault. Your problem may be on the Black/Purple cable from the ecu to the relay pack, can you back probe the connections at each end to see if the negitive is leaving the ecu and if its getting to the relay pack plug. The fact that you are having ecu issues may be that the whole plug was probed at some point.

I've got a lead from purple black from ecu direct to relay pub and 999 out of 100 no earth
I'm going crazy

[Sprocket]

The output from the ECU grounds the relay, the electronics inside the ECU have a common ground path so if one works, they all work unless the output its self has failed, the issue here is that the transistors usually fail closed meaning the output would be grounded permanently. It is highly unlikely that you will have three ECU's all with the same outputs failed and even then failed open, the ECU's are very robust, they make them that way.

 

The ECU is grounded at one common point on the body near the ECU. It then is spliced off to a few grounds in the wiring harness. Like I said in another post, I have experienced a similar issue to yours which turned out to be a bad terminal pin in the small wiring connector on the relay pack failing to make the connection even though the connector was seated properly. You also need to consider the 12v supply to the relay which comes from the ignition live on the white wire, the terminal pin again could be an issue, and also the terminal pin in the ECU connector.

 

If you don't already have one, I would suggest you invest in a voltage probe tester. This will allow you to probe various electrical items with either 12v or ground very easily.  https://www.ebay.co....TAAAOSweWVXeqQf They are not expensive and are an incredibly useful tool indeed, I have no idea what I did with out it !

 

If you remove the connector from the ECU and then probe the pin which is the black/ purple wire, it should have 12v on it with the ignition on position II. If you then ground this pin the fuel pump relay should pull in. If there is no 12v, the problem is not the ECU. If you ground the pin and the relay still does not pull in, the problem is not the ECU. If the relay does pull in, you need to check the terminal pin at the ECU carefully.

 

There are three terminal pins all of which could cause an issue, the white wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the ECU connector. Remove the anti back out clips (the big white one on the ECU connector and the small yellow one on the relay pack connector) and inspect the terminal pins. Any distortion or damage there could cause problems.

 

Also consider that the wiring its self could be a problem. If its the original loom, its 22 years old and trust me, they suffer ! the looms were never designed to last more than 10 years reliably. Corrosion sets in and wires can and do break inside the insulation. Places to check are right at the terminal pins where the wire is crimped and any of the numerous common spliced joints buried deep in the loom

 

Beyond this, remote diagnostics over the internet is limited.

[Sprocket]

 

This is a long shot but a problem I had and something mentioned in a Rover Technical Bulletin concerning the issue of probing plugs. When you probe a plug from the front inserting the probe can move the contacts appart causing an open circuit or intermittent fault. Your problem may be on the Black/Purple cable from the ecu to the relay pack, can you back probe the connections at each end to see if the negitive is leaving the ecu and if its getting to the relay pack plug. The fact that you are having ecu issues may be that the whole plug was probed at some point.

H on the road
Thank you for your reply. I don't seem to be getting any replies. I've actually spliced in to the purple black from ecu and not getting earth from ecu, I do have earth to ecu on pink grey I think so the earth is being fed to ecu but no earth from ecu 99 ties out of a 100 whenitfeels like it it will prime fuelpump on ignition to rite up and run sweet for some ties 5minutes or so. It's totally driving me crazy, if I swap to original ecu immobiliser and fobs fuel relaypulls in nearly every time but doesn't activate stepper motor, car is totally standard as it left factory, today I unraveled 90mpercent of loom and no faults it's crazy that some times does exactly as it should and 5 minutes later nothing,, is there nobody can help me ?

 

 

That is not the ECU ground. The ECU ground is BLACK, a fairly heavy wire and is connected to the body just behind the ECU on the triangular crossmember support bracket

 

The Pink Grey wire you refer to I don't recognise being part of the engine loom. In fact I don't recall Pink Grey in the body loom either

[Mini Stripey]

The output from the ECU grounds the relay, the electronics inside the ECU have a common ground path so if one works, they all work unless the output its self has failed, the issue here is that the transistors usually fail closed meaning the output would be grounded permanently. It is highly unlikely that you will have three ECU's all with the same outputs failed and even then failed open, the ECU's are very robust, they make them that way.
 
The ECU is grounded at one common point on the body near the ECU. It then is spliced off to a few grounds in the wiring harness. Like I said in another post, I have experienced a similar issue to yours which turned out to be a bad terminal pin in the small wiring connector on the relay pack failing to make the connection even though the connector was seated properly. You also need to consider the 12v supply to the relay which comes from the ignition live on the white wire, the terminal pin again could be an issue, and also the terminal pin in the ECU connector.
 
If you don't already have one, I would suggest you invest in a voltage probe tester. This will allow you to probe various electrical items with either 12v or ground very easily.  https://www.ebay.co....TAAAOSweWVXeqQf They are not expensive and are an incredibly useful tool indeed, I have no idea what I did with out it !
 
If you remove the connector from the ECU and then probe the pin which is the black/ purple wire, it should have 12v on it with the ignition on position II. If you then ground this pin the fuel pump relay should pull in. If there is no 12v, the problem is not the ECU. If you ground the pin and the relay still does not pull in, the problem is not the ECU. If the relay does pull in, you need to check the terminal pin at the ECU carefully.
 
There are three terminal pins all of which could cause an issue, the white wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the ECU connector. Remove the anti back out clips (the big white one on the ECU connector and the small yellow one on the relay pack connector) and inspect the terminal pins. Any distortion or damage there could cause problems.
 
Also consider that the wiring its self could be a problem. If its the original loom, its 22 years old and trust me, they suffer ! the looms were never designed to last more than 10 years reliably. Corrosion sets in and wires can and do break inside the insulation. Places to check are right at the terminal pins where the wire is crimped and any of the numerous common spliced joints buried deep in the loom
 
Beyond this, remote diagnostics over the internet is limited.

The output from the ECU grounds the relay, the electronics inside the ECU have a common ground path so if one works, they all work unless the output its self has failed, the issue here is that the transistors usually fail closed meaning the output would be grounded permanently. It is highly unlikely that you will have three ECU's all with the same outputs failed and even then failed open, the ECU's are very robust, they make them that way.
 
The ECU is grounded at one common point on the body near the ECU. It then is spliced off to a few grounds in the wiring harness. Like I said in another post, I have experienced a similar issue to yours which turned out to be a bad terminal pin in the small wiring connector on the relay pack failing to make the connection even though the connector was seated properly. You also need to consider the 12v supply to the relay which comes from the ignition live on the white wire, the terminal pin again could be an issue, and also the terminal pin in the ECU connector.
 
If you don't already have one, I would suggest you invest in a voltage probe tester. This will allow you to probe various electrical items with either 12v or ground very easily.  https://www.ebay.co....TAAAOSweWVXeqQf They are not expensive and are an incredibly useful tool indeed, I have no idea what I did with out it !
 
If you remove the connector from the ECU and then probe the pin which is the black/ purple wire, it should have 12v on it with the ignition on position II. If you then ground this pin the fuel pump relay should pull in. If there is no 12v, the problem is not the ECU. If you ground the pin and the relay still does not pull in, the problem is not the ECU. If the relay does pull in, you need to check the terminal pin at the ECU carefully.
 
There are three terminal pins all of which could cause an issue, the white wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the ECU connector. Remove the anti back out clips (the big white one on the ECU connector and the small yellow one on the relay pack connector) and inspect the terminal pins. Any distortion or damage there could cause problems.
 
Also consider that the wiring its self could be a problem. If its the original loom, its 22 years old and trust me, they suffer ! the looms were never designed to last more than 10 years reliably. Corrosion sets in and wires can and do break inside the insulation. Places to check are right at the terminal pins where the wire is crimped and any of the numerous common spliced joints buried deep in the loom
 
Beyond this, remote diagnostics over the internet is limited.

Sprocket many thanks again, I will follow your post word for word tomorrow I was going to solder wires directly on the relay plug wires and solder directly to the pcb connectors on the relay to bypass the plug next, I will also check the white wire, I had already removed the yellow and white plastic things and inspected the terminals and they all look perfect. Many thanks again for your help. Wish me luck, I have found a tester that you mention so will try again tomorrow with fresh enthusiasm.. day 9
Will update on progress
Can't thank you enough

[Mini Stripey]

The output from the ECU grounds the relay, the electronics inside the ECU have a common ground path so if one works, they all work unless the output its self has failed, the issue here is that the transistors usually fail closed meaning the output would be grounded permanently. It is highly unlikely that you will have three ECU's all with the same outputs failed and even then failed open, the ECU's are very robust, they make them that way.
 
The ECU is grounded at one common point on the body near the ECU. It then is spliced off to a few grounds in the wiring harness. Like I said in another post, I have experienced a similar issue to yours which turned out to be a bad terminal pin in the small wiring connector on the relay pack failing to make the connection even though the connector was seated properly. You also need to consider the 12v supply to the relay which comes from the ignition live on the white wire, the terminal pin again could be an issue, and also the terminal pin in the ECU connector.
 
If you don't already have one, I would suggest you invest in a voltage probe tester. This will allow you to probe various electrical items with either 12v or ground very easily.  https://www.ebay.co....TAAAOSweWVXeqQf They are not expensive and are an incredibly useful tool indeed, I have no idea what I did with out it !
 
If you remove the connector from the ECU and then probe the pin which is the black/ purple wire, it should have 12v on it with the ignition on position II. If you then ground this pin the fuel pump relay should pull in. If there is no 12v, the problem is not the ECU. If you ground the pin and the relay still does not pull in, the problem is not the ECU. If the relay does pull in, you need to check the terminal pin at the ECU carefully.
 
There are three terminal pins all of which could cause an issue, the white wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the ECU connector. Remove the anti back out clips (the big white one on the ECU connector and the small yellow one on the relay pack connector) and inspect the terminal pins. Any distortion or damage there could cause problems.
 
Also consider that the wiring its self could be a problem. If its the original loom, its 22 years old and trust me, they suffer ! the looms were never designed to last more than 10 years reliably. Corrosion sets in and wires can and do break inside the insulation. Places to check are right at the terminal pins where the wire is crimped and any of the numerous common spliced joints buried deep in the loom
 
Beyond this, remote diagnostics over the internet is limited.

The output from the ECU grounds the relay, the electronics inside the ECU have a common ground path so if one works, they all work unless the output its self has failed, the issue here is that the transistors usually fail closed meaning the output would be grounded permanently. It is highly unlikely that you will have three ECU's all with the same outputs failed and even then failed open, the ECU's are very robust, they make them that way.
 
The ECU is grounded at one common point on the body near the ECU. It then is spliced off to a few grounds in the wiring harness. Like I said in another post, I have experienced a similar issue to yours which turned out to be a bad terminal pin in the small wiring connector on the relay pack failing to make the connection even though the connector was seated properly. You also need to consider the 12v supply to the relay which comes from the ignition live on the white wire, the terminal pin again could be an issue, and also the terminal pin in the ECU connector.
 
If you don't already have one, I would suggest you invest in a voltage probe tester. This will allow you to probe various electrical items with either 12v or ground very easily.  https://www.ebay.co....TAAAOSweWVXeqQf They are not expensive and are an incredibly useful tool indeed, I have no idea what I did with out it !
 
If you remove the connector from the ECU and then probe the pin which is the black/ purple wire, it should have 12v on it with the ignition on position II. If you then ground this pin the fuel pump relay should pull in. If there is no 12v, the problem is not the ECU. If you ground the pin and the relay still does not pull in, the problem is not the ECU. If the relay does pull in, you need to check the terminal pin at the ECU carefully.
 
There are three terminal pins all of which could cause an issue, the white wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the ECU connector. Remove the anti back out clips (the big white one on the ECU connector and the small yellow one on the relay pack connector) and inspect the terminal pins. Any distortion or damage there could cause problems.
 
Also consider that the wiring its self could be a problem. If its the original loom, its 22 years old and trust me, they suffer ! the looms were never designed to last more than 10 years reliably. Corrosion sets in and wires can and do break inside the insulation. Places to check are right at the terminal pins where the wire is crimped and any of the numerous common spliced joints buried deep in the loom
 
Beyond this, remote diagnostics over the internet is limited.

Sprocket many thanks again, I will follow your post word for word tomorrow I was going to solder wires directly on the relay plug wires and solder directly to the pcb connectors on the relay to bypass the plug next, I will also check the white wire, I had already removed the yellow and white plastic things and inspected the terminals and they all look perfect. Many thanks again for your help. Wish me luck, I have found a tester that you mention so will try again tomorrow with fresh enthusiasm.. day 9
Will update on progress
Can't thank you enough

Hi sprocket
not good news
With relay box connected have 12 v on white wire with ignition on, don't have 12 v from white wire but have 12v when connected to relay
Have 12 v on purple black from ecu and when grounded pulls fuel relay in strongly, inspected every pin in every plug and with a dentists pick ensured each terminal had tension
Unraveled engine loom and inspected and check earth continuity f4om earth point near ecu again all fine
Tried 2 ecus neither pull in fuel relay, immobiliser working exactly as it should.. any further suggestions? Many thanks again in advance

[Mini Stripey]

The output from the ECU grounds the relay, the electronics inside the ECU have a common ground path so if one works, they all work unless the output its self has failed, the issue here is that the transistors usually fail closed meaning the output would be grounded permanently. It is highly unlikely that you will have three ECU's all with the same outputs failed and even then failed open, the ECU's are very robust, they make them that way.
 
The ECU is grounded at one common point on the body near the ECU. It then is spliced off to a few grounds in the wiring harness. Like I said in another post, I have experienced a similar issue to yours which turned out to be a bad terminal pin in the small wiring connector on the relay pack failing to make the connection even though the connector was seated properly. You also need to consider the 12v supply to the relay which comes from the ignition live on the white wire, the terminal pin again could be an issue, and also the terminal pin in the ECU connector.

Re read your post are you saying I should get 12 v from the small relay plug from ignition?
Im getting 12v on small white wire but not large white with red
 
If you don't already have one, I would suggest you invest in a voltage probe tester. This will allow you to probe various electrical items with either 12v or ground very easily.  https://www.ebay.co....TAAAOSweWVXeqQf They are not expensive and are an incredibly useful tool indeed, I have no idea what I did with out it !
 
If you remove the connector from the ECU and then probe the pin which is the black/ purple wire, it should have 12v on it with the ignition on position II. If you then ground this pin the fuel pump relay should pull in. If there is no 12v, the problem is not the ECU. If you ground the pin and the relay still does not pull in, the problem is not the ECU. If the relay does pull in, you need to check the terminal pin at the ECU carefully.
 
There are three terminal pins all of which could cause an issue, the white wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the ECU connector. Remove the anti back out clips (the big white one on the ECU connector and the small yellow one on the relay pack connector) and inspect the terminal pins. Any distortion or damage there could cause problems.
 
Also consider that the wiring its self could be a problem. If its the original loom, its 22 years old and trust me, they suffer ! the looms were never designed to last more than 10 years reliably. Corrosion sets in and wires can and do break inside the insulation. Places to check are right at the terminal pins where the wire is crimped and any of the numerous common spliced joints buried deep in the loom
 
Beyond this, remote diagnostics over the internet is limited.

The output from the ECU grounds the relay, the electronics inside the ECU have a common ground path so if one works, they all work unless the output its self has failed, the issue here is that the transistors usually fail closed meaning the output would be grounded permanently. It is highly unlikely that you will have three ECU's all with the same outputs failed and even then failed open, the ECU's are very robust, they make them that way.
 
The ECU is grounded at one common point on the body near the ECU. It then is spliced off to a few grounds in the wiring harness. Like I said in another post, I have experienced a similar issue to yours which turned out to be a bad terminal pin in the small wiring connector on the relay pack failing to make the connection even though the connector was seated properly. You also need to consider the 12v supply to the relay which comes from the ignition live on the white wire, the terminal pin again could be an issue, and also the terminal pin in the ECU connector.
 
If you don't already have one, I would suggest you invest in a voltage probe tester. This will allow you to probe various electrical items with either 12v or ground very easily.  https://www.ebay.co....TAAAOSweWVXeqQf They are not expensive and are an incredibly useful tool indeed, I have no idea what I did with out it !
 
If you remove the connector from the ECU and then probe the pin which is the black/ purple wire, it should have 12v on it with the ignition on position II. If you then ground this pin the fuel pump relay should pull in. If there is no 12v, the problem is not the ECU. If you ground the pin and the relay still does not pull in, the problem is not the ECU. If the relay does pull in, you need to check the terminal pin at the ECU carefully.
 
There are three terminal pins all of which could cause an issue, the white wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the ECU connector. Remove the anti back out clips (the big white one on the ECU connector and the small yellow one on the relay pack connector) and inspect the terminal pins. Any distortion or damage there could cause problems.
 
Also consider that the wiring its self could be a problem. If its the original loom, its 22 years old and trust me, they suffer ! the looms were never designed to last more than 10 years reliably. Corrosion sets in and wires can and do break inside the insulation. Places to check are right at the terminal pins where the wire is crimped and any of the numerous common spliced joints buried deep in the loom
 
Beyond this, remote diagnostics over the internet is limited.

Sprocket many thanks again, I will follow your post word for word tomorrow I was going to solder wires directly on the relay plug wires and solder directly to the pcb connectors on the relay to bypass the plug next, I will also check the white wire, I had already removed the yellow and white plastic things and inspected the terminals and they all look perfect. Many thanks again for your help. Wish me luck, I have found a tester that you mention so will try again tomorrow with fresh enthusiasm.. day 9
Will update on progress
Can't thank you enough

Hi sprocket
not good news
With relay box connected have 12 v on white wire with ignition on, don't have 12 v from white wire but have 12v when connected to relay
Have 12 v on purple black from ecu and when grounded pulls fuel relay in strongly, inspected every pin in every plug and with a dentists pick ensured each terminal had tension
Unraveled engine loom and inspected and check earth continuity f4om earth point near ecu again all fine
Tried 2 ecus neither pull in fuel relay, immobiliser working exactly as it should.. any further suggestions? Many thanks again in advance

[Mini Stripey]

The output from the ECU grounds the relay, the electronics inside the ECU have a common ground path so if one works, they all work unless the output its self has failed, the issue here is that the transistors usually fail closed meaning the output would be grounded permanently. It is highly unlikely that you will have three ECU's all with the same outputs failed and even then failed open, the ECU's are very robust, they make them that way.
 
The ECU is grounded at one common point on the body near the ECU. It then is spliced off to a few grounds in the wiring harness. Like I said in another post, I have experienced a similar issue to yours which turned out to be a bad terminal pin in the small wiring connector on the relay pack failing to make the connection even though the connector was seated properly. You also need to consider the 12v supply to the relay which comes from the ignition live on the white wire, the terminal pin again could be an issue, and also the terminal pin in the ECU connector.
Re read your post are you saying I should get 12 v from the small relay plug from ignition?
Im getting 12v on small white wire but not large white with red
 
If you don't already have one, I would suggest you invest in a voltage probe tester. This will allow you to probe various electrical items with either 12v or ground very easily.  https://www.ebay.co....TAAAOSweWVXeqQf They are not expensive and are an incredibly useful tool indeed, I have no idea what I did with out it !
 
If you remove the connector from the ECU and then probe the pin which is the black/ purple wire, it should have 12v on it with the ignition on position II. If you then ground this pin the fuel pump relay should pull in. If there is no 12v, the problem is not the ECU. If you ground the pin and the relay still does not pull in, the problem is not the ECU. If the relay does pull in, you need to check the terminal pin at the ECU carefully.
 
There are three terminal pins all of which could cause an issue, the white wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the ECU connector. Remove the anti back out clips (the big white one on the ECU connector and the small yellow one on the relay pack connector) and inspect the terminal pins. Any distortion or damage there could cause problems.
 
Also consider that the wiring its self could be a problem. If its the original loom, its 22 years old and trust me, they suffer ! the looms were never designed to last more than 10 years reliably. Corrosion sets in and wires can and do break inside the insulation. Places to check are right at the terminal pins where the wire is crimped and any of the numerous common spliced joints buried deep in the loom
 
Beyond this, remote diagnostics over the internet is limited.

The output from the ECU grounds the relay, the electronics inside the ECU have a common ground path so if one works, they all work unless the output its self has failed, the issue here is that the transistors usually fail closed meaning the output would be grounded permanently. It is highly unlikely that you will have three ECU's all with the same outputs failed and even then failed open, the ECU's are very robust, they make them that way.
 
The ECU is grounded at one common point on the body near the ECU. It then is spliced off to a few grounds in the wiring harness. Like I said in another post, I have experienced a similar issue to yours which turned out to be a bad terminal pin in the small wiring connector on the relay pack failing to make the connection even though the connector was seated properly. You also need to consider the 12v supply to the relay which comes from the ignition live on the white wire, the terminal pin again could be an issue, and also the terminal pin in the ECU connector.
 
If you don't already have one, I would suggest you invest in a voltage probe tester. This will allow you to probe various electrical items with either 12v or ground very easily.  https://www.ebay.co....TAAAOSweWVXeqQf They are not expensive and are an incredibly useful tool indeed, I have no idea what I did with out it !
 
If you remove the connector from the ECU and then probe the pin which is the black/ purple wire, it should have 12v on it with the ignition on position II. If you then ground this pin the fuel pump relay should pull in. If there is no 12v, the problem is not the ECU. If you ground the pin and the relay still does not pull in, the problem is not the ECU. If the relay does pull in, you need to check the terminal pin at the ECU carefully.
 
There are three terminal pins all of which could cause an issue, the white wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the ECU connector. Remove the anti back out clips (the big white one on the ECU connector and the small yellow one on the relay pack connector) and inspect the terminal pins. Any distortion or damage there could cause problems.
 
Also consider that the wiring its self could be a problem. If its the original loom, its 22 years old and trust me, they suffer ! the looms were never designed to last more than 10 years reliably. Corrosion sets in and wires can and do break inside the insulation. Places to check are right at the terminal pins where the wire is crimped and any of the numerous common spliced joints buried deep in the loom
 
Beyond this, remote diagnostics over the internet is limited.

Sprocket many thanks again, I will follow your post word for word tomorrow I was going to solder wires directly on the relay plug wires and solder directly to the pcb connectors on the relay to bypass the plug next, I will also check the white wire, I had already removed the yellow and white plastic things and inspected the terminals and they all look perfect. Many thanks again for your help. Wish me luck, I have found a tester that you mention so will try again tomorrow with fresh enthusiasm.. day 9
Will update on progress
Can't thank you enough

Hi sprocket
not good news
With relay box connected have 12 v on white wire with ignition on, don't have 12 v from white wire but have 12v when connected to relay
Have 12 v on purple black from ecu and when grounded pulls fuel relay in strongly, inspected every pin in every plug and with a dentists pick ensured each terminal had tension
Unraveled engine loom and inspected and check earth continuity f4om earth point near ecu again all fine
Tried 2 ecus neither pull in fuel relay, immobiliser working exactly as it should.. any further suggestions? Many thanks again in advance

Tried to stat fifty times nothing
Try again start runs perfect? what the hell

[Mini Stripey]

The output from the ECU grounds the relay, the electronics inside the ECU have a common ground path so if one works, they all work unless the output its self has failed, the issue here is that the transistors usually fail closed meaning the output would be grounded permanently. It is highly unlikely that you will have three ECU's all with the same outputs failed and even then failed open, the ECU's are very robust, they make them that way.
 
The ECU is grounded at one common point on the body near the ECU. It then is spliced off to a few grounds in the wiring harness. Like I said in another post, I have experienced a similar issue to yours which turned out to be a bad terminal pin in the small wiring connector on the relay pack failing to make the connection even though the connector was seated properly. You also need to consider the 12v supply to the relay which comes from the ignition live on the white wire, the terminal pin again could be an issue, and also the terminal pin in the ECU connector.
Re read your post are you saying I should get 12 v from the small relay plug from ignition?
Im getting 12v on small white wire but not large white with red
 
If you don't already have one, I would suggest you invest in a voltage probe tester. This will allow you to probe various electrical items with either 12v or ground very easily.  https://www.ebay.co....TAAAOSweWVXeqQf They are not expensive and are an incredibly useful tool indeed, I have no idea what I did with out it !
 
If you remove the connector from the ECU and then probe the pin which is the black/ purple wire, it should have 12v on it with the ignition on position II. If you then ground this pin the fuel pump relay should pull in. If there is no 12v, the problem is not the ECU. If you ground the pin and the relay still does not pull in, the problem is not the ECU. If the relay does pull in, you need to check the terminal pin at the ECU carefully.
 
There are three terminal pins all of which could cause an issue, the white wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the ECU connector. Remove the anti back out clips (the big white one on the ECU connector and the small yellow one on the relay pack connector) and inspect the terminal pins. Any distortion or damage there could cause problems.
 
Also consider that the wiring its self could be a problem. If its the original loom, its 22 years old and trust me, they suffer ! the looms were never designed to last more than 10 years reliably. Corrosion sets in and wires can and do break inside the insulation. Places to check are right at the terminal pins where the wire is crimped and any of the numerous common spliced joints buried deep in the loom
 
Beyond this, remote diagnostics over the internet is limited.

The output from the ECU grounds the relay, the electronics inside the ECU have a common ground path so if one works, they all work unless the output its self has failed, the issue here is that the transistors usually fail closed meaning the output would be grounded permanently. It is highly unlikely that you will have three ECU's all with the same outputs failed and even then failed open, the ECU's are very robust, they make them that way.
 
The ECU is grounded at one common point on the body near the ECU. It then is spliced off to a few grounds in the wiring harness. Like I said in another post, I have experienced a similar issue to yours which turned out to be a bad terminal pin in the small wiring connector on the relay pack failing to make the connection even though the connector was seated properly. You also need to consider the 12v supply to the relay which comes from the ignition live on the white wire, the terminal pin again could be an issue, and also the terminal pin in the ECU connector.
 
If you don't already have one, I would suggest you invest in a voltage probe tester. This will allow you to probe various electrical items with either 12v or ground very easily.  https://www.ebay.co....TAAAOSweWVXeqQf They are not expensive and are an incredibly useful tool indeed, I have no idea what I did with out it !
 
If you remove the connector from the ECU and then probe the pin which is the black/ purple wire, it should have 12v on it with the ignition on position II. If you then ground this pin the fuel pump relay should pull in. If there is no 12v, the problem is not the ECU. If you ground the pin and the relay still does not pull in, the problem is not the ECU. If the relay does pull in, you need to check the terminal pin at the ECU carefully.
 
There are three terminal pins all of which could cause an issue, the white wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the ECU connector. Remove the anti back out clips (the big white one on the ECU connector and the small yellow one on the relay pack connector) and inspect the terminal pins. Any distortion or damage there could cause problems.
 
Also consider that the wiring its self could be a problem. If its the original loom, its 22 years old and trust me, they suffer ! the looms were never designed to last more than 10 years reliably. Corrosion sets in and wires can and do break inside the insulation. Places to check are right at the terminal pins where the wire is crimped and any of the numerous common spliced joints buried deep in the loom
 
Beyond this, remote diagnostics over the internet is limited.

Sprocket many thanks again, I will follow your post word for word tomorrow I was going to solder wires directly on the relay plug wires and solder directly to the pcb connectors on the relay to bypass the plug next, I will also check the white wire, I had already removed the yellow and white plastic things and inspected the terminals and they all look perfect. Many thanks again for your help. Wish me luck, I have found a tester that you mention so will try again tomorrow with fresh enthusiasm.. day 9
Will update on progress
Can't thank you enough

Hi sprocket
not good news
With relay box connected have 12 v on white wire with ignition on, don't have 12 v from white wire but have 12v when connected to relay
Have 12 v on purple black from ecu and when grounded pulls fuel relay in strongly, inspected every pin in every plug and with a dentists pick ensured each terminal had tension
Unraveled engine loom and inspected and check earth continuity f4om earth point near ecu again all fine
Tried 2 ecus neither pull in fuel relay, immobiliser working exactly as it should.. any further suggestions? Many thanks again in advance

Tried to stat fifty times nothing
Try again start runs perfect? what the hell

The output from the ECU grounds the relay, the electronics inside the ECU have a common ground path so if one works, they all work unless the output its self has failed, the issue here is that the transistors usually fail closed meaning the output would be grounded permanently. It is highly unlikely that you will have three ECU's all with the same outputs failed and even then failed open, the ECU's are very robust, they make them that way.
 
The ECU is grounded at one common point on the body near the ECU. It then is spliced off to a few grounds in the wiring harness. Like I said in another post, I have experienced a similar issue to yours which turned out to be a bad terminal pin in the small wiring connector on the relay pack failing to make the connection even though the connector was seated properly. You also need to consider the 12v supply to the relay which comes from the ignition live on the white wire, the terminal pin again could be an issue, and also the terminal pin in the ECU connector.
Re read your post are you saying I should get 12 v from the small relay plug from ignition?
Im getting 12v on small white wire but not large white with red
 
If you don't already have one, I would suggest you invest in a voltage probe tester. This will allow you to probe various electrical items with either 12v or ground very easily.  https://www.ebay.co....TAAAOSweWVXeqQf They are not expensive and are an incredibly useful tool indeed, I have no idea what I did with out it !
 
If you remove the connector from the ECU and then probe the pin which is the black/ purple wire, it should have 12v on it with the ignition on position II. If you then ground this pin the fuel pump relay should pull in. If there is no 12v, the problem is not the ECU. If you ground the pin and the relay still does not pull in, the problem is not the ECU. If the relay does pull in, you need to check the terminal pin at the ECU carefully.
 
There are three terminal pins all of which could cause an issue, the white wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the ECU connector. Remove the anti back out clips (the big white one on the ECU connector and the small yellow one on the relay pack connector) and inspect the terminal pins. Any distortion or damage there could cause problems.
 
Also consider that the wiring its self could be a problem. If its the original loom, its 22 years old and trust me, they suffer ! the looms were never designed to last more than 10 years reliably. Corrosion sets in and wires can and do break inside the insulation. Places to check are right at the terminal pins where the wire is crimped and any of the numerous common spliced joints buried deep in the loom
 
Beyond this, remote diagnostics over the internet is limited.

The output from the ECU grounds the relay, the electronics inside the ECU have a common ground path so if one works, they all work unless the output its self has failed, the issue here is that the transistors usually fail closed meaning the output would be grounded permanently. It is highly unlikely that you will have three ECU's all with the same outputs failed and even then failed open, the ECU's are very robust, they make them that way.
 
The ECU is grounded at one common point on the body near the ECU. It then is spliced off to a few grounds in the wiring harness. Like I said in another post, I have experienced a similar issue to yours which turned out to be a bad terminal pin in the small wiring connector on the relay pack failing to make the connection even though the connector was seated properly. You also need to consider the 12v supply to the relay which comes from the ignition live on the white wire, the terminal pin again could be an issue, and also the terminal pin in the ECU connector.
 
If you don't already have one, I would suggest you invest in a voltage probe tester. This will allow you to probe various electrical items with either 12v or ground very easily.  https://www.ebay.co....TAAAOSweWVXeqQf They are not expensive and are an incredibly useful tool indeed, I have no idea what I did with out it !
 
If you remove the connector from the ECU and then probe the pin which is the black/ purple wire, it should have 12v on it with the ignition on position II. If you then ground this pin the fuel pump relay should pull in. If there is no 12v, the problem is not the ECU. If you ground the pin and the relay still does not pull in, the problem is not the ECU. If the relay does pull in, you need to check the terminal pin at the ECU carefully.
 
There are three terminal pins all of which could cause an issue, the white wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the small relay pack connector, the black purple wire on the ECU connector. Remove the anti back out clips (the big white one on the ECU connector and the small yellow one on the relay pack connector) and inspect the terminal pins. Any distortion or damage there could cause problems.
 
Also consider that the wiring its self could be a problem. If its the original loom, its 22 years old and trust me, they suffer ! the looms were never designed to last more than 10 years reliably. Corrosion sets in and wires can and do break inside the insulation. Places to check are right at the terminal pins where the wire is crimped and any of the numerous common spliced joints buried deep in the loom
 
Beyond this, remote diagnostics over the internet is limited.

Sprocket many thanks again, I will follow your post word for word tomorrow I was going to solder wires directly on the relay plug wires and solder directly to the pcb connectors on the relay to bypass the plug next, I will also check the white wire, I had already removed the yellow and white plastic things and inspected the terminals and they all look perfect. Many thanks again for your help. Wish me luck, I have found a tester that you mention so will try again tomorrow with fresh enthusiasm.. day 9
Will update on progress
Can't thank you enough

Hi sprocket
not good news
With relay box connected have 12 v on white wire with ignition on, don't have 12 v from white wire but have 12v when connected to relay
Have 12 v on purple black from ecu and when grounded pulls fuel relay in strongly, inspected every pin in every plug and with a dentists pick ensured each terminal had tension
Unraveled engine loom and inspected and check earth continuity f4om earth point near ecu again all fine
Tried 2 ecus neither pull in fuel relay, immobiliser working exactly as it should.. any further suggestions? Many thanks again in advance

Tried to stat fifty times nothing
Try again start runs perfect? what the hell

Now starting and running ok apart from fast tick over as stepper motor not working on old ecu

[Sprocket]

There is no need to quote every comment in every conversation, it makes the topics messy.

 

Unfortunately, i am unable to give you any more advice without looking at the car myself and going through everything methodically. I am at a loss as to why you are having these problems and sometimes find it difficult to understand exactly what it is you have done and how you have done it. I really need to see the car.

 

Maybe someone else can chirp in here and suggest something I may have missed?..........................

[Mini Stripey]

Thanks sprocket
I'm new to forums
Where are you based and what are your rates