5 replies to this topic

[Mite]

Was wondering if someone could clarify a possible misunderstanding on my part as while aware the Mini’s engine bay is notoriously a very tight squeeze, am rather perplexed by the following that suggests an end-on gearbox mated to an A-Series was feasible.

 

- On the Austin Memories article about the Minki, it was mentioned a Maestro A-Series and Volkswagen-sourced gearbox was attempted in the Mini though was too tight with the A-Series 4-cylinder engine being roughly equivalent to a K-Series three and a half cylinder engine in length.

 

- It is then mentioned the subframe was 4-inches too narrow to accept the 4-cylinder K-Series engine and gearbox (possibly the PSA MA/Rover R65), leading to 3-cylinder version being created (as each K-Series cylinder was around 4-inches) that reputedly used the same Volkswagen-sourced gearbox from the Maestro (unless Minki I also used the PSA MA/Rover R65 gearbox).  

 

- The later Minki 2 had its wheelbase and width increased by 50mm / 2-inches in order to fit the 1.4 4-cylinder K-Series and PSA MA/Rover R65 gearbox from the Metro/100.

 

For those who have done K-Series Mini conversions and other engine replacements/swaps, would it have been theoretically possible for an A-Series mated to PSA MA/Rover R65 gearbox or some other compact / earlier equivalent gearbox to viably fit into the Mini’s engine bay without needing to have its wheelbase and width increased to around 50mm like on the Minki 2?

 

 

[nicklouse]

A maestro set up was fitted by Watson’s in Wakefield for the fastest Mini race back in the 99ish. 

[mab01uk]

Some video footage (21 minutes) from the 'Fastest Mini in the World 1994'. Scrutineering, Qualifying. Peter Baldwin, Martin Short, Bill Sollis, Rik Boon and many more....
https://www.facebook...58603144187600/

Unusual Maestro A-Series (end on gearbox) Mini Conversion below KAR 356C Graham Smith (Watsons) @ approx 18.40 in video.

 

[Mite]

The Maestro end-on A-Series Mini conversion racer is interesting, though since the combination was said to have been too tight a fit to be viable for production what would it have taken to make an end-on A-Series Mini a viable production possibility as with the images of the two K-Series Minki (3-cylinder) and Minki 2 (4-cylinder) prototypes below?

 

Would a more compact gearbox compared to the Volkswagen Golf-sourced Maestro gearbox have been enough within the existing Mini's engine bay or would the Mini have still needed to have had its width and wheelbase slightly increased?

 

As far as alternative end-on gearboxes are concerned besides the PSA MG/Rover R65 gearbox, it is not clear whether the 4/5-speed gearbox in the mk1-to-mk2 Volkswagen Polo for example was the same as the Volkswagen Golf-sourced Maestro gearbox or a more compact design that when paired with an A-Series could easily slot into the Mini's engine bay without issue. 

 

Edited by Mite, 13 August 2020 - 12:47 AM.

[mab01uk]

The Maestro end-on A-Series Mini conversion racer is interesting, though since the combination was said to have been too tight a fit to be viable for production what would it have taken to make an end-on A-Series Mini a viable production possibility as with the images of the two K-Series Minki (3-cylinder) and Minki 2 (4-cylinder) prototypes below?

 

Even if a suitable end on gearbox had been available it would have been too late to financially make the change based on the life thought to have been left for the Mini in production at that time with falling sales. The Metro with larger engine bay made the change to end on gearbox with minor changes but ironically (as it turned out) Rover thought the Metro had more life left in production than the Mini, although to be fair sales volumes at the time were much higher for the Metro/Rover 100 as a return on the investment costs.

 

In my opinion the best thing that could of happened for the Mini gearbox, was if BL had invested some of the millions of pounds spent on developing the A+ engine for minimal gains for the Metro, had instead been directed into adding a 5th gear to the existing Mini gearbox in sump.....others had already achieved this in limited low volume aftermarket versions......with BL's input a reliable 5-speed was easily achievable to serve the Metro and Mini from 1980 onwards.....a missed opportunity.
 

[Mite]

 

The Maestro end-on A-Series Mini conversion racer is interesting, though since the combination was said to have been too tight a fit to be viable for production what would it have taken to make an end-on A-Series Mini a viable production possibility as with the images of the two K-Series Minki (3-cylinder) and Minki 2 (4-cylinder) prototypes below?

 

Even if a suitable end on gearbox had been available it would have been too late to financially make the change based on the life thought to have been left for the Mini in production at that time with falling sales. The Metro with larger engine bay made the change to end on gearbox with minor changes but ironically (as it turned out) Rover thought the Metro had more life left in production than the Mini, although to be fair sales volumes at the time were much higher for the Metro/Rover 100 as a return on the investment costs.

 

In my opinion the best thing that could of happened for the Mini gearbox, was if BL had invested some of the millions of pounds spent on developing the A+ engine for minimal gains for the Metro, had instead been directed into adding a 5th gear to the existing Mini gearbox in sump.....others had already achieved this in limited low volume aftermarket versions......with BL's input a reliable 5-speed was easily achievable to serve the Metro and Mini from 1980 onwards.....a missed opportunity.
 

 

 

As much as would also find the idea of an in-sump 5-speed manual and 5-speed AP automatic gearbox to be very appealing in better circumstances, it would be pretty much delaying the inevitable trend towards an end-on gearbox range of cars whereas the A+ had a much wider usage compared to the 5-speed manual and 5-speed AP automatic in-sump prototype gearboxes beyond the Mini, Metro and Allegro.

 

The Project Ant aka Barrel Car prototype might possibly have had enough room for an end-on gearbox to be viable, know some accounts say it featured the 84-inch Minivan/Estate wheelbase (whereas others say it either retained the existing wheelbase or was slightly enlarged by 2-inches) and even if a bit more width was required the later Minki 2 prototype's 50mm increase in width would have likely have been enough to allow for end-on gearbox to be a straightforward fit in the engine bay. 

 

Assuming the Audi 50 / mk1-mk2 Volkswagen Polo featured a more compact end-on gearbox, it is possible it could have slotted into the Mini's (and even the Metro's) engine bay like with the Volkswagen Golf-sourced gearbox used in the Maestro/Montego.

Edited by Mite, 15 August 2020 - 03:59 PM.