13 replies to this topic

[Minigman]

i'm a bit confused - so nothing new there then!

 

I need to replace the wheel bearings on my 998 Cooper front hubs (same as drum brakes).

 

Can i fit the Timken taper ones or are they just for disc hubs?

Edited by Minigman, 03 October 2020 - 10:32 AM.

[johnv]

We had a long discussion about this last year on the mk1 forum. The outcome was that any front bearing would fit, so yes, you can fit S tapers

[nicklouse]

The dimensions are the same for either of the ball or taper roller bearings. They are also the same as used on the Metro but that used just the ball bearing type in 99.9% of the applications but one used ball inner and taper rollers outer.

[Minigman]

Thanks chaps.

 

I wish they were listed as drum too, it would make things less confusing.

[mini-mad-mark]

I might be talking pish here but I thought the 998 (and 997) cooper used the smaller CV joint same as a drum mini (had drums but never a cooper so can't comment for definite only from what it says on the minispares website)  - the S/GT/late disc CV shaft is a larger diameter isn't it?

 

So an S bearing (taper or otherwise) won't be correct as the ID will be bigger than the CV shaft..? 

[Spider]

I might be talking pish here but I thought the 998 (and 997) cooper used the smaller CV joint same as a drum mini (had drums but never a cooper so can't comment for definite only from what it says on the minispares website)  - the S/GT/late disc CV shaft is a larger diameter isn't it?

 

So an S bearing (taper or otherwise) won't be correct as the ID will be bigger than the CV shaft..? 

 

The 'Tube' on the Drive Flange that the Bearings are mounted on is the same size as the Disc Brake CV.

 

As Nick mentioned, dimensionally, they are 100% interchangeable.

 

The last few years they made Mokes here, all Mokes, including those with Drum Brakes were fitted with Tapered Rollers

[mini-mad-mark]

Ah the shaft (tube) on the drive flange..... Think I fell into that mistake before.

 

Been  a while (5 years) since I took the drum brakes off the project (and the ohter two cars have discs)

 

There you go I did say I might be talking pish and I was!

[timmy850]

I've got Tinken tapered bearings on my drum setup. No problems at all since I swapped to them!

 

Here's a refresher on the CV joints 

 Screen Shot 2019-06-07 at 8.56.25 PM.png   473.56K   6 downloads

 

And the drums have the additional diameter on the flange so that its the same as the disc CV

 image.axd-2.jpg   23.42K   7 downloads

[Miki Leyland]

I asked this very question directly to Minispares (I have drums all around) and I was told that the drum hub was not prepared for the extra torque needed for tappered bearings.

[nicklouse]

I asked this very question directly to Minispares (I have drums all around) and I was told that the drum hub was not prepared for the extra torque needed for tappered bearings.

That does not make any sense.

[Spider]

 

I asked this very question directly to Minispares (I have drums all around) and I was told that the drum hub was not prepared for the extra torque needed for tappered bearings.

That does not make any sense.

 

 

I think what's being said here is that with the size of the nut and thread on the CV, you can't torque them up tight enough.

 

That's a fair observation, however, I disagree that with the drum brake arrangement, that it's an issue.

 

The reason I say this is the live (spinning) parts of the bearing assembly are mounted in quite different ways.

 

On the Disc Brake arrangement, the Drive Flange has a small foundation footprint on the CV and so can (and does) tend to lean over with side forces on the wheel. In order to try and hold that as square as possible, the assembly needs to be clamped as tight as possible.

 

On the other hand, with Drum Brakes, as the Drive Flange is one piece with the inner Bearing Mount, the issue of the assembly leaning over with side forces is just about nil, so the clamping force needed can be much less.

 

I posted an in depth description of this issue here, towards the end of post #1;-

 

http://www.theminifo...wheel-bearings/

 

I've mentioned it here before, but our locally produced Mokes, from late 1979 / early 1980 were all factory fitted with Tapered Roller Bearings, Front and Rear.

He's a page from the 1984 parts fiche;-

 

 

 

in which you can see that from Moke B/N 106383 onwards, the replacement bearing assembly is the Tapered Rollers

[nicklouse]

Nice clarification. A d taking it further. The drum assy is actually better than the disc assy. 

[gav]

 

 

I asked this very question directly to Minispares (I have drums all around) and I was told that the drum hub was not prepared for the extra torque needed for tappered bearings.

That does not make any sense.

 

 

I think what's being said here is that with the size of the nut and thread on the CV, you can't torque them up tight enough.

 

That's correct, we've seen several drum brake CV's shear the threads off entirely with taper bearings fitted when people torque them to 150lbft, we don't recommend them from a liability point of view. It would be interesting to see what torque figure Moke give...

Edited by gav, 08 October 2020 - 02:42 PM.

[Spider]

 

That's correct, we've seen several drum brake CV's shear the threads off entirely with taper bearings fitted when people torque them to 150lbft, we don't recommend them from a liability point of view. It would be interesting to see what torque figure Moke give...

 

 

The figure remained the same for the type of CV - 60 ft/lb and on to the next slot.  Yes, I can see these letting go well before one got anywhere near the 150 ft/lb !

And totally understand Mini Spares position.