11 replies to this topic

[Compdoc]

I purchased a 12 volt water solenoid valve, to control the flow of water to my heated inlet manifold. The specification of the valve requires a pressure of 3psi to open, after being energised.

My problem is that I am not sure that the cooling system ever reaches that sort of pressure, especially when the coolant is cold.

I have searched the forum but can find no information on this subject, although I have found the specification of the Bosch 0392020034 water pump, that KAD use in their electric water pump kit and it flows around 85 l/min, similar to the standard mini pump flow of 80 l/min, (I assume these are max figures), although the output pressure of the Bosch is shown as 0.1 bar, i.e. 1.4psi.

I suppose that pumping coolant around a closed loop system does not necessarily require a high pressure. although the pressure may increase somewhat when travelling through a smaller diameter hose.

As I use waterless coolant, I can't even rely on a bit of extra pressure when the coolant gets hot, but by then, I don't need the valve operating anyway.

Am I talking complete rubbish here? I would appreciate any input on this please.

 

 

[lordcakes]

Won't your pressure be limited by the radiator cap? That should be (depending on your car) somewhere between 7 and 15 psi so there should be enough pressure to activate your valve.

[Compdoc]

Won't your pressure be limited by the radiator cap? That should be (depending on your car) somewhere between 7 and 15 psi so there should be enough pressure to activate your valve.

Well, that sounds reasonable, but the waterless coolant I am using doesn't boil like water so you can remove the rad cap when hot with little pressure release. That's why I really need some pressure from the pump.

[lordcakes]

Won't your pressure be limited by the radiator cap? That should be (depending on your car) somewhere between 7 and 15 psi so there should be enough pressure to activate your valve.

Well, that sounds reasonable, but the waterless coolant I am using doesn't boil like water so you can remove the rad cap when hot with little pressure release. That's why I really need some pressure from the pump.

I suppose the pump doesn't create pressure, it just moves the water around. The pressure comes from expansion of the water which of course you haven't got. Sorry I can't suggest anything else.

[Spider]

In considering that Pressure needed to open the valve, is that 3 PSI above Atmospheric or is it a 3 PSI Differential across the Valve ?

If it's the former, then that should be no issue, however, if it's the latter, you may want to find another valve to use as the differential pressure is unlikely to be as high as 1/2 a PSI.

[Compdoc]

I think it operates at 3psi above atmosphere. I took the valve apart and there is a nitrile disk washer with a thin coil spring on top and the solenoid on top of that.  When operated, the solenoid lifts and relies on the spring to keep the valve closed. I assume that 3psi water pressure is required to overcome the tension in the coil spring. I may be able to change the spring or remove it all together. It looks like a bit of experimentation is in order.

CBS sell a solenoid operated heater valve, but their price is £48.00 + shipping. The valve I have, is used in the old style solar panels and costs £8.50.

Thanks Lordcakes & Spider for your input.

 

[nicklouse]

 

Won't your pressure be limited by the radiator cap? That should be (depending on your car) somewhere between 7 and 15 psi so there should be enough pressure to activate your valve.

Well, that sounds reasonable, but the waterless coolant I am using doesn't boil like water so you can remove the rad cap when hot with little pressure release. That's why I really need some pressure from the pump.

 

Arrrh waterless *******. Sorry but it is one of the worse things to use in a Mini. It is OK in most modern cars as they have a cooling system that is over speced.

 

the waterless coolant I have seen is basically glycol. glycol ability to transfer heat is not good. Running over 50% water glycol mix coolant pushes the Minis ability to cool its self to the limit.

 

also my water pump maker states waterless coolant will reduce the life of the pump due to reduced flow/greater viscosity.

 

I would rethink your plans.

[Compdoc]

 

 

Won't your pressure be limited by the radiator cap? That should be (depending on your car) somewhere between 7 and 15 psi so there should be enough pressure to activate your valve.

Well, that sounds reasonable, but the waterless coolant I am using doesn't boil like water so you can remove the rad cap when hot with little pressure release. That's why I really need some pressure from the pump.

 

Arrrh waterless *******. Sorry but it is one of the worse things to use in a Mini. It is OK in most modern cars as they have a cooling system that is over speced.

 

the waterless coolant I have seen is basically glycol. glycol ability to transfer heat is not good. Running over 50% water glycol mix coolant pushes the Minis ability to cool its self to the limit.

 

also my water pump maker states waterless coolant will reduce the life of the pump due to reduced flow/greater viscosity.

 

I would rethink your plans.

 

I started using Evans waterless coolant about 10 years ago in my BMW E46 daily driver, when the header tank exploded, (as most of them do, sooner or later). It's still running on the same coolant with no problems. But I take your point that the Mini is a different animal regarding keeping cool. I have tried to bring the Mini into the 21st century with a large radiator and a quite expensive electric fan which seems to dissipate heat remarkably quickly. I am using the Evans Classic Cool 180, which as the name suggests, is designed for classic cars and doesn't boil until the temperature reaches 180 degrees, which is much higher than the standard product. This is a road car, so I am hoping this will keep the temperature in the sweet spot and not over cool it.

I know that waterless coolant is not cheap, but I'd be interested to know if the general consensus is that it's not good for a road going  A-series engine.

[Spider]

I know that waterless coolant is not cheap, but I'd be interested to know if the general consensus is that it's not good for a road going  A-series engine.

 

Everyone I know of who have tried it found that the engines run much hotter.

Overheating isn't if the coolant boils or not, it's generally when the coolant is above 110 deg C.
 

[Ethel]

The valve pressure should be simple enough to figure out. If it's differential pressure it would very likely require installing a particular way round. If it's atmospheric then expect there to be something stopping pressure equalisation, like a sealed piston chamber - similar to a gas filled shock absorber.

 

Engine cooling's first job is to control pre combustion chamber temperature to eliminate pre ignition. It's all about heat capacity & temperature differentials. Use a coolant with a lower heat capacity & you need a bigger temperature differential to take the heat away at the same rate. Expect to need a lower rated thermostat, possibly a bigger radiator & faster pump - but there'll always be a physical limit inbuilt in what the head is made of & the shape 'n size of the water jacket.

[MiniMadRacer]

Must admit I have always used water (as its wetter than most other coolants) and the minimum amount of anit freeeze I can get away with based on the likely temperartures at night..

[Compdoc]

I have been looking for some waterless coolant reviews online and one that gives you con's as well as the pro's seem to be :

https://greengarageb...t-pros-and-cons

It does mention a few con's that in my opinion would cause me not to use it. Just shows I should listen to Nicklouse & Spider more often!

So today, I shall be flushing 90 quids worth of glycol down the drain. (Oops, I meant pouring it into plastic containers and taking it to my local waste disposal site).