25 replies to this topic

[Fynn]

Hello everyone,

 

I just turned 18 and I'm looking to buy my first car. I don't really need a car, so I'm looking for something fun to drive that doesn't have to be too practical. The classic mini not only perfectly fits those needs, but also looks beautiful.

 

Now to my question:

I'll drive the car almost every day, in the rain/snow the same as in the sun. I live in germany, roads are gritted with salt during winter and I won't have time to wash it off after every ride. The garage is completely filled up, so it'll have to stay outside. I don't mind spending time working on the car, I was just wondering whether it is doable at all under conditions like these?

How much time do you think I'd have to spend on rust repairs alone and how fast does it rust generally? If I decide to take it on vacation and leave it in the rain (maybe even snow?) for a week will it be hopelessly lost?

 

To add onto that, I have absolutely zero experience working on cars. I'd love to learn about the topic and people told me a classic Mini was great for learning, but, realistically, how often would I encounter issues I simply can't fix without prior experience?

 

My budget is around 20k which (I think?) puts me on the higher end of the spectrum. Therefor I'm looking a fully restored, sealed, ready-to-go car. Should I buy or would it be a waste of money? Could anyone give an estimate on running costs (not talking about oil/petrol)?

 

Thanks in advance!

Cheers,

Fynn

[beardylondon]

20k in euros, so 17k in GBP.

 

That is a lot of money and above what most on here would pay for a Classic Mini outright, granted some might spend that over the years maintaining and improving.  In fact people buying cars for that amount probably wouldn't drive them everyday and would definitely garage them to protect them and stop them being stolen.

 

It's your money, but the car will seriously suffer being left outside for long periods of time.

 

It's so hard to give advice, as it's so much down to personal taste, but I have to ask, have you ever driven a classic Mini for long periods? There is so much to consider, I would drive a few and then also a few more classic and modern cars, before spending your money on something, as you say, you don't really need.

 

As for running costs, I wouldn't worry, as you have picked the least expensive car to run, parts and easy to get and cheaper that say a luxury classic, but then running repairs will cost more that modern car, as you will need a specialist, so it's very hard to predict.

Edited by beardylondon, 14 September 2021 - 09:40 AM.

[Fynn]

20k in euros, so 17k in GBP.

 

That is a lot of money and above what most on here would pay for a Classic Mini outright, granted some might spend that over the years maintaining and improving.  In fact people buying cars for that amount probably wouldn't drive them everyday and would definitely garage them to protect them and stop them being stolen.

 

It's your money, but the car will seriously suffer being left outside for long periods of time.

 

It's so hard to give advice, as it's so much down to personal taste, but I have to ask, have you ever driven a classic Mini for long periods? There is so much to consider, I would drive a few and then also a few more classic and modern cars, before spending your money on something, as you say, you don't really need.

 

As for running costs, I wouldn't worry, as you have picked the least expensive car to run, parts and easy to get and cheaper that say a luxury classic, but then running repairs will cost more that modern car, as you will need a specialist, so it's very hard to predict.

Thanks so far! I will definitely test drive one for a longer ride before buying, how much would you recommend spending on a classic mini considering my needs? 

Edited by Fynn, 14 September 2021 - 09:52 AM.

[beardylondon]

In the UK, I would say most people in your position would be looking around £6k-£7k GBP mark for clean and unmodified car, which isn't full of holes, has been looked after and only needs minor improvements, has a decent non smokey engine, good wheels and tyres, acceptable interior, solid underside and good subframes and healthy disks and pads. 

 

something like these

 

https://www.carandcl...uk/car/C1377208

or

https://www.carandcl...uk/car/C1362559

 

 

 

 

 

20k in euros, so 17k in GBP.

 

That is a lot of money and above what most on here would pay for a Classic Mini outright, granted some might spend that over the years maintaining and improving.  In fact people buying cars for that amount probably wouldn't drive them everyday and would definitely garage them to protect them and stop them being stolen.

 

It's your money, but the car will seriously suffer being left outside for long periods of time.

 

It's so hard to give advice, as it's so much down to personal taste, but I have to ask, have you ever driven a classic Mini for long periods? There is so much to consider, I would drive a few and then also a few more classic and modern cars, before spending your money on something, as you say, you don't really need.

 

As for running costs, I wouldn't worry, as you have picked the least expensive car to run, parts and easy to get and cheaper that say a luxury classic, but then running repairs will cost more that modern car, as you will need a specialist, so it's very hard to predict.

Thanks so far! I will definitely test drive one for a longer ride before buying, how much would you recommend spending on a classic mini considering my needs? 

 

Edited by beardylondon, 14 September 2021 - 10:08 AM.

[Ethel]

They all should have been scrapped at least a decade ago, so any estimates are meaningless.

 

Here's some estimates:

 

It'd be sensible to set aside an hour a month for routine maintenance & half a day every 6 months for a service.

 

You should get around 5 years before any rust free and properly coated bodywork needs replacing.

 

You'll have to learn to weld, or sell it, in 7 to 8 years.

[mab01uk]

I would advise you empty your 'filled up' garage and use it to keep your Mini in and give you somewhere to work on and maintain it which will be essential if you using it every day and  leaving it outside in all weathers. In the UK an expensive restored Mini parked outside would also be at high risk of being stolen.....not sure if there is a similar risk of theft of classic cars in your part of Germany?

Edited by mab01uk, 14 September 2021 - 12:25 PM.

[Cooperman]

I don't think a classic Mini is sensible as a first car and a daily driver.
You must remember that it is a 63-year-old design and thus will need a lot of maintenance and servicing.
When my Grandson was 17 he had a Mini-Cooper MPI as his first car. Despite it having been extensively restored it still needed constant minor attention in my workshop.
In the end he sold it and bought a Fiesta 1.25 Zetec which was far more practical for daily use.
10 years on he and I have 4 Minis between us, but his daily driver is a Jaguar.

[MaximMini]

Hi Fynn,

Where are you located in Germany?

As a matter of fact the Mini isn't a particularly practical car and for sure needs much more attention than any modern car. But, it's so much more fun . My son just turned eighteen and love driving our Mini.

I might provide you some information on the Mini market here in Germany and in case you are close would even offer a chance to drive mine. So, if interested, feel free to contact me.


Cheers,
Christian

[SolarB]

Minis have been first cars and all year round daily drivers for millions of people in the past, I suspect including for many on this forum.
True, modern cars are quieter, more comfortable, require less maintenance and are potentially more reliable but we have a choice of daily drivers in my household and the Mini is the first choice 90% of the time.
Most of us here are happy to find the time it takes to run a classic Mini as they are so much fun. If you do buy one be prepared to spend time learning and working on the car and go into it with open eyes.

 

[MiniCarJack]

I've used a couple of classic Minis as daily drivers over the past several years. More recently I had a 1991 Rover Mini Neon with a 998 engine, which was economical, fun and surprisingly practical for the most part, but did need a lot of work over the 18 months I owned it! I also made some additional mods to make it more comfortable for daily use, including seats from another car, brand new uprated suspension, and a new steering wheel amongst other things. Ultimately I've now sold that car to focus on another project and I've since replaced it with a more comfortable, powerful and practical Mk4 Golf for less than 1/10th of the price I got for the Neon; while it was enjoyable driving the Neon around, I just couldn't put it through another winter on salty roads and no garaging at my flat as it's quite unkind to the bodywork. I'm all for the idea of dailying a mini but it really has to suit your situation, ie where will it be kept / what sort of driving do you do / have you got tools and space to work on the car / are you mechanically inclined enough to work on it yourself or do you have disposable income to spend on outsourcing maintenance / etc etc.

[InnoCooperExport]

I don't mean to sound condescending, but 20k buys you a lot of car in Germany. You could even buy a decent Seat or VW Golf for 5k which will be much happier standing outside and driving on the autobahn, that leaves you with 15k to find a nice Mini at your leisure and gives you time to create some space in your garage to house it. Because if left outside it will rust and will cost a lot to repair. That would be my plan of attack with that budget. 

 

I also don't know about German insurance laws, but here in NL if you want to insure an "oldtimer" it needs to be kept under a roof overnight. Failure in doing so will void the insurance, you're also not allowed to use it for your commute. Be sure that these kind of things aren't conditions on insuring a Mini in DE. 

[Clip]

I have a now fully restored 1962 Mk1 850 (fitted with 1275, actually 1310 now). I did all the work myself except for the engine, gearbox and diff reconditioning and fitting. Everything else from front disc conversion, suspension, electrical, interior was replaced by me. They are so easy and cheap to work on. Maintenance is easy, simple and relatively fast to do, so I do it often. I included a few mods to greatly improve the reliability that included electronic distributor, alternator, Isuzu starter motor, high quality electric fuel pump, and added electrical relays with additional fused circuits for everything.

 

I now use it as my everyday drive and also often run down the motorway to visit family. That’s a 200 kilometre round trip at 110k/h and it loves it (so do I). Sometimes I’ll take the scenic route over the ranges that adds more Ks but is loads more fun. It is also incredibly practical for commuting to work, shopping and parking. Everyone should be driving a mini IMO   
 

So I guess I’m saying is yes - go and get one, learn how to maintain it, and you’ll love it. Only suggestion is keep it out of the weather as much as you can and clean out your garage - you’ll be surprised how little space they take up. 

[Icey]

Used a classic as a daily for a few years. Wouldn't do it again. I've welded, painted, rebuilt engines, gearboxes etc... still wouldn't daily one.

Primary reason is the poor condition of UK roads, you need decent sized wheels and tyres to deal with it. Driving our classic around on 10s (or 12s and 13s as it was in the past) is great fun but I spend as much time looking at the surface of the road as I do everything else. That's fine when you're only doing a couple of thousand miles a year, but commuting? It's when, not if, something will get damaged.

Then there's the I don't want to damage something valuable point. I can replace my R55 (MINI Clubman, current daily) for £1-2k if needed, can't say the same for a classic anymore. Between the road conditions, the weather, and other drivers, your daily needs to be something you've got no great attachment to. No one else cares about it, be prepared for it to be wiped out.

And on that latter point, as has already been pointed out, the more time you spend on the road the more important safety is. When dealing with dopey commuters, tired from their day at work, fiddling with the radio/their phone, I want some protection. I can't say too much as I also ride motorbikes, but that's a different problem space. As a young/first time driver, safety is also from yourself. You might be alright, but stats show young drivers are likely to wreck their first car....

On the servicing side, yeah, it's easy on a Mini and fairly cheap. But.... You have to do it regularly. That means no matter the weather you need to be working on it. Fine if you have a garage, if you don't, servicing outside in winter is such a miserable affair, I wouldn't ever do it again by choice.

I've posted much the same elsewhere, but these days, if I was starting out, I'd buy a cheap R50 to thrash around/commute in, then once I've got some experience under my belt, buy the classic as a weekend toy to tinker with and enjoy.

Edited by Icey, 15 September 2021 - 01:22 PM.

[MiniCarJack]

Used a classic as a daily for a few years. Wouldn't do it again. I've welded, painted, rebuilt engines, gearboxes etc... still wouldn't daily one.

Primary reason is the poor condition of UK roads, you need decent sized wheels and tyres to deal with it. Driving our classic around on 10s (or 12s and 13s as it was in the past) is great fun but I spend as much time looking at the surface of the road as I do everything else. That's fine when you're only doing a couple of thousand miles a year, but commuting? It's when, not if, something will get damaged.

Then there's the I don't want to damage something valuable point. I can replace my R55 (MINI Clubman, current daily) for £1-2k if needed, can't say the same for a classic anymore. Between the road conditions, the weather, and other drivers, your daily needs to be something you've got no great attachment to. No one else cares about it, be prepared for it to be wiped out.

And on that latter point, as has already been pointed out, the more time you spend on the road the more important safety is. When dealing with dopey commuters, tired from their day at work, fiddling with the radio/their phone, I want some protection. I can't say too much as I also ride motorbikes, but that's a different problem space. As a young/first time driver, safety is also from yourself. You might be alright, but stats show young drivers are likely to wreck their first car....

On the servicing side, yeah, it's easy on a Mini and fairly cheap. But.... You have to do it regularly. That means no matter the weather you need to be working on it. Fine if you have a garage, if you don't, servicing outside in winter is such a miserable affair, I wouldn't ever do it again by choice.

I've posted much the same elsewhere, but these days, if I was starting out, I'd buy a cheap R50 to thrash around/commute in, then once I've got some experience under my belt, buy the classic as a weekend toy to tinker with and enjoy.

 

I should've added a similar point on safety to my post as well, this is a very important consideration... something that also helped to sway me to go back to a modern daily driver was getting rear ended in my Neon earlier this year. The lack of a high level brake light and being so small & low makes you nearly invisible to drivers, especially if they aren't paying attention. I was lucky that my car was quite solid and held up well enough, but it could've been a lot worse. I like to think I'm a confident and competent driver, but no amount of driving skill and attention can prevent another inattentive / poor driver from smashing into you with no way of avoiding it.

[Cooperman]

Used a classic as a daily for a few years. Wouldn't do it again. I've welded, painted, rebuilt engines, gearboxes etc... still wouldn't daily one.

Primary reason is the poor condition of UK roads, you need decent sized wheels and tyres to deal with it. Driving our classic around on 10s (or 12s and 13s as it was in the past) is great fun but I spend as much time looking at the surface of the road as I do everything else. That's fine when you're only doing a couple of thousand miles a year, but commuting? It's when, not if, something will get damaged.

Then there's the I don't want to damage something valuable point. I can replace my R55 (MINI Clubman, current daily) for £1-2k if needed, can't say the same for a classic anymore. Between the road conditions, the weather, and other drivers, your daily needs to be something you've got no great attachment to. No one else cares about it, be prepared for it to be wiped out.

And on that latter point, as has already been pointed out, the more time you spend on the road the more important safety is. When dealing with dopey commuters, tired from their day at work, fiddling with the radio/their phone, I want some protection. I can't say too much as I also ride motorbikes, but that's a different problem space. As a young/first time driver, safety is also from yourself. You might be alright, but stats show young drivers are likely to wreck their first car....

On the servicing side, yeah, it's easy on a Mini and fairly cheap. But.... You have to do it regularly. That means no matter the weather you need to be working on it. Fine if you have a garage, if you don't, servicing outside in winter is such a miserable affair, I wouldn't ever do it again by choice.

I've posted much the same elsewhere, but these days, if I was starting out, I'd buy a cheap R50 to thrash around/commute in, then once I've got some experience under my belt, buy the classic as a weekend toy to tinker with and enjoy.

This is an excellent post and it explains the real situation with ownership of an old classic car - not just a Mini. With a low purchase price and low maintenance modern car, you will have plenty of time and money to own a really nice old Mini for fun days in the sun.

Good luck with your first car.