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Powerlite Pre-Engaged Starter & Ring Gear Distance


Best Answer ac427 , 02 May 2022 - 10:05 PM

This doesn't help your main point but HRE Paul has a video on YouTube where he machines the boss of a Powerlite starter motor.

https://youtu.be/Xb9inYTjPZ8 Go to the full post


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#1 Icey

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Posted 02 May 2022 - 07:53 PM

Evening all,

 

(Apologies, this ended up being a long post, TL/DR at the end)

 

Final stages of the 998 turbo rebuild. I bought a Powerlite starter (RAC803) during the first build to give me the clearance I needed for the intercooler, and all worked well. It engaged perfectly well with the MED Stg1 verto flywheel. I also used the starter when we switched back to the 1275 (fitted with a MED flywheel as well).

Now, however, something has changed. The starter only just catches the edge of the ring gear. Fine while cranking with no compress (to test oil pressure), but as soon as I put the plugs back in the pinion slips and disengages.

Wedging the pinion and inspecting with the wok removed shows that there is barely 1mm of engagement which means it's right on the chamfered edge of both gears (explains why it can't hold on with compression).

My first thought was that the flywheel assemble was sat too far down the crank tail, maybe I'd missed some crud that was stopping it seating. I also had a problem where the pressure plate bolts were catching the wok slightly (on the raised section for the engine mount thread). Seemed an obvious answer to both problems. But having inspected the engagement between the clutch center and the crank tail - it's damn near perfect (and appears the same as an OEM clutch center I have on the bench).

So I'm left with two other options - either the crank has moved (it's the same crank and thrusts as the first build showing end float of 0.004"), or the transfer case is sitting closer to the block (it's the same case, I don't remember the gasket thickness used in the last build but the clearance on the idler gear was on-spec with the same thrust washers).

 

And then there is of course the option that this is two issues - a slight movement in the transfer case which caused the catch against the wok (as it wasn't enough to stop rotation), and something else which means the starter isn't engaging fully.

To make this even more confusing - I have an unmodified 998 waiting on the bench, the starter is even further away from the ring gear on that one! Was it just a fluke that it worked last time?

Before I mill a small amount off the starter (I'll speak to Powerlite first), is there anything that jumps out that I may have missed?


TL/DR: Powerlite starter doesn't engage with the ring gear, along with clutch catching on the wok slightly. Engine turns freely, with correct crank end float and other measurements in spec. What gives?

A similar question was asked here but no answer was given. The distance quoted in that post is very similar to the spare 998 I tested with. 


Edited by Icey, 02 May 2022 - 08:34 PM.


#2 ac427

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Posted 02 May 2022 - 10:05 PM   Best Answer

This doesn't help your main point but HRE Paul has a video on YouTube where he machines the boss of a Powerlite starter motor.

https://youtu.be/Xb9inYTjPZ8

#3 nicklouse

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Posted 02 May 2022 - 10:16 PM

I fitted one of these with no problems.

http://www.minispare...|Back to search

Think it is the same as you are taking about.  MED flywheel as well.



#4 Icey

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Posted 02 May 2022 - 10:57 PM

This doesn't help your main point but HRE Paul has a video on YouTube where he machines the boss of a Powerlite starter motor.

https://youtu.be/Xb9inYTjPZ8


That’s exactly the problem! Good find!

#5 Icey

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Posted 02 May 2022 - 10:59 PM

I fitted one of these with no problems.
http://www.minispare...|Back to search
Think it is the same as you are taking about. MED flywheel as well.


Yep, that’s the same starter. Fitted without an issue on the 1275 but on the 998 the engagement is too narrow. Watching the video posted above is just what I was looking for. I should be able to take a couple of mm out of the adapter plate and I’ll be golden.

#6 ac427

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Posted 02 May 2022 - 11:29 PM

I fitted one of these with no problems.
http://www.minispare...|Back to search
Think it is the same as you are taking about. MED flywheel as well.


Yep, that’s the same starter. Fitted without an issue on the 1275 but on the 998 the engagement is too narrow. Watching the video posted above is just what I was looking for. I should be able to take a couple of mm out of the adapter plate and I’ll be golden.

Excellent, I'm glad i was able to help.

#7 Icey

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Posted 23 May 2022 - 01:18 PM

Just to close this one off if it comes up in future peoples search - following the video posted by ac427, I took the adapter plate off the starter motor and milled ~3mm off the face which goes against the transfer case. This gave ~50% engagement on the ring gear. Not perfect but was the best I could do with the tooling I have on my mill.

The engine has been stopped/started many times and has covered over 100 miles with no issues. So the root cause was likely a combination of parts/tolerances/clearances.

In-progress picture for fun...

VHjXdyE.jpg



#8 andyapanel

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Posted 24 May 2022 - 06:12 AM

I fitted one to my 1098 with minispares lightened flywheel
The first one had to be replaced as the solenoid failed after a few starts
The second chewed up the ring gear and was one of my worst buys
I replaced with a standard pre engaged and all was fine, although I had to have the ring gear replaced. Apparently the starter had knocked it forward as well as chewing it up
It was in a pick up and bolting and unbolting was a real pain. Attaching the live was difficult.
A nice idea, but best avoided




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