32 replies to this topic

[mab01uk]

It seems I am not the only driver who thinks modern LED headlights are making night driving on unlit roads something I now avoid when possible....

A glaring problem.
"The RAC is calling on the Government to commission an independent study into the issue of headlight glare after new research found 85% of those affected believe the problem is getting worse. An RAC survey of 2,000 drivers found a huge nine-in-10 (89%) think at least some headlights on cars on the road today are too bright, of which three-in-10 (28%) – a higher proportion than ever – think most are. Of the all these drivers who complain about the brightness of car headlights, some 91% say they get dazzled when driving with three-quarters (74%) saying this happens regularly.
When it comes to the effects of glare on drivers, two-in-three (67%) who suffer say they have to slow down considerably until they can see clearly again, while a similar proportion (64%) believe some headlights are so bright they risk causing accidents.
In fact, five per cent of these drivers state they have nearly been involved in a collision themselves. Alarmingly, nearly one-in-10 (7%) say they find headlight glare so bad that they avoid driving at night altogether, a figure that rises to 14% for drivers aged 65 and over.
While the RAC has been surveying drivers on dazzling headlights since 2018, these new findings show more drivers than ever appear to be suffering from them, with 85% of those affected stating they believe the problem is getting worse.
As part of its study, the RAC asked drivers to estimate how long it takes them to see clearly again after getting dazzled by other drivers’ lights. While 68% say it takes between one and five seconds, one-in-10 (11%) say it takes six or more – which, staggeringly, is enough for a driver travelling at 60mph to cover 160 metres, the equivalent of 40 car lengths.
The reasons drivers perceive headlight glare to be such an issue are less clear, although an overwhelming 87% of dazzled drivers think it is mainly due to the fact some lights just appear much brighter. This could be as a result of the increasing prevalence of cars fitted with LED headlights, leading to a much more intense and focused beam that the human eye reacts differently to, compared to a conventional ‘yellower’ halogen bulb. While LED headlights are great for improving a driver’s view of the road ahead, this can be to the detriment of other road users who encounter them.
Headlamp aim consistently tops the MOT compliance survey as one of the most likely items to be assessed incorrectly by testers. The increasing popularity of cars that sit higher on the road, especially SUVs, may also be a factor with those in conventional cars such as hatchbacks, saloons or estates suffering the most. Older drivers are likely to be disproportionately affected by headlight glare, so may be more likely to experience difficulties or to decide not to drive at night at all."
More here:-
https://www.rac.co.u...eadlight-glare/

 

[PoolGuy]

to be honest I've got used to it now, I can't remember the last time I was 'blinded' by another vehicle, even the ones that quite obviously have their lights on main beam aren't anything more than mildly annoying.

[Davidmt]

Not been a problem for me and I live out in the country so most oncoming traffic you meet at night start off on main beam.  Not that I would put much credibility in a survey of only 2,000 RAC members (who drive at least once a month) when there are over 35 million people with UK driving licences.  But as the article says - consult your optician if you feel it's an issue for you.

[Designer]

I think most of the time it is because of the Chelsea Tractors. Their headlights being higher up when on dipped beam are almost the equivalent of a normal saloon on high beam. I am sure if you take the angle that a dipped beam on a Chelsea Tractor points down the focal point of the beams will be say for argument sake 50 ft in front of the car. Whereas taking the same angle and applying it to a saloon or estate or other smaller car the focal point will be a shorter distance from the front of the car. On that basis then an MOT rule should be applied so that the distance is the same whatever the car, set to that of the lower car. If that distance is safe driving for the lower car then it is safe driving for the taller car.

[Ethel]

My pet peeve, how can it be necessary to see your own shadow on the headlining when you're being followed at 30mph in a built up area?

 

"It doesn't bother me" isn't an objective test when you're at risk of being run in to by road user it does bother.

 

While I'm ranting - drivers who park on the wrong side of the road with their headlights on and/or the engine running. When did that become fashionable?

[Ethel]

I think most of the time it is because of the Chelsea Tractors. Their headlights being higher up when on dipped beam are almost the equivalent of a normal saloon on high beam. I am sure if you take the angle that a dipped beam on a Chelsea Tractor points down the focal point of the beams will be say for argument sake 50 ft in front of the car. Whereas taking the same angle and applying it to a saloon or estate or other smaller car the focal point will be a shorter distance from the front of the car. On that basis then an MOT rule should be applied so that the distance is the same whatever the car, set to that of the lower car. If that distance is safe driving for the lower car then it is safe driving for the taller car.

 

 

The height becomes irrelevant when there's any difference in gradient. We all must know stretches of road where we get routinely blinded by oncoming traffic on a bit of an uphill incline.

[stuart bowes]

can I like this twice 

 

honestly, the blatant disregard for others, I can't understand how anyone can think like that..  "I want extra bright lights and sod everyone else"  It's literally just as bad as driving around with your main beams on (which also some dimwits seem to do as well)

 

and you'd think when they're behind you for ages not just driving past in the opposite direction the mirror dipper takes care of it but no, it's so bright the wing mirrors need to be adjusted outwards as well

 

I've been thinking of ways to get them back like maybe just putting a mirror in my back window?  or having a switch which swaps the rear lights over to a secondary circuit with ultrabright red LED megawatt lights or something, I dunno..  or caltrops maybe

 

in reality though they should just take the extra bright LED lamps off the market, they're clearly illegal or you wouldn't have to write NOT FOR ROAD USE on the side of the box.  but why even be allowed to sell them?  

 

why not just sell crack cocaine and just have a note on the packet, NOT LEGAL

 

it would actually be very easy to install lux sensors around the place and log the numberplate of everyone who exceeds that limit.  an actual positive use for all those ANPR / ULEZ cameras.  add a device that picks up loud popping noises as well while they're at it

 

that's my rant done for the day cheers 

Edited by stuart bowes, 10 January 2024 - 01:01 PM.

[PoolGuy]

 

honestly, the blatant disregard for others, I can't understand how anyone can think like that..  "I want extra bright lights and sod everyone else" 

 

 

Do you really think that that's part of the thought process when buying a new car? My folks have just bought a new car, it has fancy lights, but not because my dad chose to have them, he wouldn't even know that they're different from the last car.

 

Then look at the questions on this very forum, not a month goes by without someone asking how to improve the lights on their Mini.

[Bobbins]

The issue is not aftermarket lighting, it's the o/e LED lights fitted to most modern cars, and although most of us would be happy with the lights 20% less bright it's not a choice we have. Add to that the very defined "cut-off" in the beam pattern and it's easy to see why bright lights become an issue on anything other than very level roads.

[stuart bowes]

the issue round here is definitely an after market thing (as well as new maybe) because I'm quite aware of the age of cars as they drive past and what sort of lighting they would have been originally sold with

 

im sure your 'fancy' lighting is still within the range of legal requirements, or it should be, if not obviously my argument isn't with you or your parents but the people who made it and sold it 

 

still.  there is most definitely a sizeable quantity of people who 'upgrade' their lighting from normal to ridiculous,  even if that is by unknowingly selecting something off the shelf that has no right to be there, because it says 'extra bright' on the front of the pack in really big letters but 'not for road use' on the back in smaller letters.  perhaps it is sometimes a lack of awareness with lamp choice, and not always intentional disregard

 

and yes I'm aware that older cars have issues but again the upgrade doesn't have to be 'substandard' to 'well over the top' .. it could just be 'substandard' to 'good'.  the issue is well known to be fixable by improving the wiring, using relays and decent halogen lamps

Edited by stuart bowes, 10 January 2024 - 03:30 PM.

[Designer]

 

I think most of the time it is because of the Chelsea Tractors. Their headlights being higher up when on dipped beam are almost the equivalent of a normal saloon on high beam. I am sure if you take the angle that a dipped beam on a Chelsea Tractor points down the focal point of the beams will be say for argument sake 50 ft in front of the car. Whereas taking the same angle and applying it to a saloon or estate or other smaller car the focal point will be a shorter distance from the front of the car. On that basis then an MOT rule should be applied so that the distance is the same whatever the car, set to that of the lower car. If that distance is safe driving for the lower car then it is safe driving for the taller car.

 

 

The height becomes irrelevant when there's any difference in gradient. We all must know stretches of road where we get routinely blinded by oncoming traffic on a bit of an uphill incline.

 

 

I have had cases of being blinded by on coming traffic and following traffic on level roads. For example on a road near me about a mile long with no lighting, thick trees on both sides and the road is level even though it is a long very minor slope. More often than not as it is quite a busy road I will be dazzled by someone's lights either from the front or behind

 

I even had a case where I was blinded by a car behind me and assumed he had his main beam on. We were stopped by a set of lights that I knew was along stop so got out and asked the driver to dip his lights only to be told they were and he proved it by putting them on main beam then dipped them back.

Edited by Designer, 10 January 2024 - 06:51 PM.

[mab01uk]

I have even been blinded by those cyclists who wear a very bright white LED light (sometimes flashing) mounted on their bike helmet, with the beam bouncing around in all directions!

[mab01uk]

Cheap LED aftermarket bulbs

"One other cause of the rise in dazzling on the road is the use of sub-standard LED bulbs that can be purchased online.

Cheap replacements, especially for older cars using halogen bulbs, can be dangerously bright or produce the wrong beam pattern, both of which can temporarily blind oncoming motorists.

Only bulbs with an 'E' mark are deemed legal in Britain, but aftermarket LED upgrades cannot be issued one of these certified marks. This is because no legislation currently exists for the use of LED technology in a headlight unit built for halogens.

However, this is difficult to police. And even MOT testers are not required to check if a bulb is E marked due to the time-consuming nature of having to access the product.

This is why it is always recommended to purchase replacement bulbs from your car from reputable manufacturers, such as Osram and Philips."

 

[68+86auto]

Often it is blinding to look in my side mirrors.

[sonikk4]

Cheap LED aftermarket bulbs
"One other cause of the rise in dazzling on the road is the use of sub-standard LED bulbs that can be purchased online.
Cheap replacements, especially for older cars using halogen bulbs, can be dangerously bright or produce the wrong beam pattern, both of which can temporarily blind oncoming motorists.
Only bulbs with an 'E' mark are deemed legal in Britain, but aftermarket LED upgrades cannot be issued one of these certified marks. This is because no legislation currently exists for the use of LED technology in a headlight unit built for halogens.
However, this is difficult to police. And even MOT testers are not required to check if a bulb is E marked due to the time-consuming nature of having to access the product.
This is why it is always recommended to purchase replacement bulbs from your car from reputable manufacturers, such as Osram and Philips."

Down on the A27 going East on my early starts I would always meet a white transit van that had lights that were no way legal. Obviously aftermarket and the dazzle was stupid. And they were on dip as I flashed him on highs and he flashed back. Melted my retinas.

Now on the A40 the worst offenders are poorly adjusted or just badly fitted bulbs or light assys. I love my Bi xenon’s on my A6 and the difference between those and the standard halogens on the wife’s Polo to excuse the pun is night and day. Driving down the B roads where I live makes a huge difference but I am mindful of other drivers.

I will also say this especially over the past week when we had the storms, so many people decided to drive with main beams on in flowing traffic. I’m sorry but there is no reason for that. If you cannot see the car in front then back off move over into the inside lane on the motorways. On single carriage roads be mindful of other drivers, nothing worse than having some throbber behind you with more illumination on than the Blackpool tower. There is no need and all it does raise tempers.