8 replies to this topic

[Dave the Rave]

My mini (disk brake) has wide wheels and seems to eat through bearings, regardless of them being Timken or cheap ones.

I went into a local motor factors to buy some and he pulled out ball bearing ones as opposed to taper bearings. He double
checked the part number and said he thought they were interchangeable as these were the only one's they get in. I didn't buy them but it got me thinking.

I've searched on here before and have heard of people using ball bearing instead of taper bearings on disk brake mini's. But then why would they change from ball to taper in production?

Any comments? If they can be interchanged what's the fitting procedure? Lower torque etc?

[TOMMO0302]

AFAIK ball bearings were used on drum braked mini hubs and also metro hubs, but all minis after 1984 had rollers....metro disc braked hubs and drum braked mini hubs used the same (ball) bearing but not sure if you could use them in a disc braked mini hub?

[Guess-Works.com]

You can use them, but the reason metro's get away with using balls is the offset of the wheel, unlike a disk braked mini, and especially ones with wider than std wheels, the metro wheel is offsets it over the hub, therefore not requiring the stronger load bearing tapers....

The main reason why tapers fail is due to incorrect installation. when torqing up the hub, a BIG FLAT washer should be used first, without the tapered split washer installed, this sets the tapers in the right place, then the nut should be undone and then after installing the tapered washer, re torqued to the prescribed setting.. 150lbft for dual hole CV's and 180lbft for single hole CV's ( and align to next hole for split pin )

[Dave the Rave]

So would the ball bearing race be stronger than the tapers?

I've thought of every possibility of why mine fail so often. I install them exactly as per Haynes, i.e. using the big washer first to seat the bearing. In the end i just put it down to the wide wheels straining them.

[andyps]

The ball bearings will not last as long as the tapered roller ones. To understand why, think about the fact that with a ball bearing you have a point of contact where the ball touches the race and that is it, with a tapered one you have full line contact all along the roller so the capacity is higher. Sorry about that - I used to work for Timken and you say these things so often that it becomes habit!!

It was originaly the Coopers which had the tapered bearings, but they were also used on all disc braked cars. If you have wider wheels that standard, with a greater offset then the bearings will not last as long as with the standard ones - the load is massively increased when this happens.

[Dan]

Which is exactly why the taper roller was fitted originally. As said above the Mini originally had the centreline of the wheel aligned more or less with the centreline of the bearing which puts the minimum load and axial torque on the bearing. The disc brakes were all accomodated by moving the wheel centreline further from the hub (unless you get reverse rim wheels) by an inch which increases the load on the bearing. The further you move it out the more load you put on. A ball bearing just won't last.

[Dave the Rave]

Great answers guys, just what i was looking for.

I thought the tapered bearings would be better, also hence the change to them, was just sure i heard taper bearings weren't as strong. Must have been garbage. I'll be sticking with the taper bearings.

Doesn't really explain why the guy in shop said they were interchangeable and both part numbers use the same bearing. Unless that was a load of cr@p.

[cowboy]

if you have standard wheels the bearings are interchangable

but if you have the wider wheels you need to use the tappered.

i changed mine to tappered as i preffer them, plus i have wider wheels and i haven't had any problems with them yet 2 years later

[Guess-Works.com]

Disk brakes Mini's should have tapered, no matter the wheel, std ot offset, as there is already 1" offset added by the disk brakes...

I believe the problem is with Part books, garages look up mini and see two bearing notices one pre 1984 and one post 84, and also see that those post 84 are 2 to 3 times more expensive.... so opt for the cheap option, and then charge the customer 2-3 times more anyway...

Some may think, metro's are the same, and see there is only 1 part number for them ( the ball bearing type ) and then think, well if they're ok for a metro then they're ok for a mini...