8 replies to this topic

[spikyrob]

This is a new one on me...

Today i went out to start my car, and it wouldn't start, just turned over and over, no firing.

I changed my ignition coil, spark leads and plugs, used a multi meter to ensure power was getting to the coil and i had wired it correctly, ensured i was getting a good spark and that the engine was getting fuel.

I then decided to retard the timing slightly, it fired , but was running rougher than usual, but i let it warm up.

I stopped the engine, put the dizzy back to the marks and it wouldn't start, the starter was chugging like it didn't have enough power getting to it. so i retarded it again and drove round to a friends garage.

When i got there i reset the timing and tried again, but it still wouldn't start, i then made sure it wasn't a lack of power by getting his battery and jumping it directly onto the starter but it still wouldn't start.

The weird thing is when i adjusted the timing with the engine running so it sounded "happy" it ran fine, but when i tried starting it again it didn't fire even though when running its timing was set properly.

Its a 1380 stg 4 bill richards engine

Has any one got any clues as to what this could be?

Thanks in advance
Rob

[TOMMO0302]

Hmm, very strange, anything out of the ordinary we should know....Has it sat for any length of time for the fuel to go off? Anyone touched it?

[Ethel]

This is a new one on me...

Today i went out to start my car, and it wouldn't start, just turned over and over, no firing.

I changed my ignition coil, spark leads and plugs, used a multi meter to ensure power was getting to the coil and i had wired it correctly, ensured i was getting a good spark and that the engine was getting fuel.

I then decided to retard the timing slightly, it fired , but was running rougher than usual, but i let it warm up.

I stopped the engine, put the dizzy back to the marks and it wouldn't start, the starter was chugging like it didn't have enough power getting to it. so i retarded it again and drove round to a friends garage.

When i got there i reset the timing and tried again, but it still wouldn't start, i then made sure it wasn't a lack of power by getting his battery and jumping it directly onto the starter but it still wouldn't start.

The weird thing is when i adjusted the timing with the engine running so it sounded "happy" it ran fine, but when i tried starting it again it didn't fire even though when running its timing was set properly.

Its a 1380 stg 4 bill richards engine

Has any one got any clues as to what this could be?

Thanks in advance
Rob

[Ethel]

Oops,

Air leak or vacuum advance ?

[dklawson]

Once you get the car running, does it ping/knock or seem underpowered? (Like when you drove it to your friend's house? ) Since you can make the car run at speed once started but find it hard to start... consider checking the advance weights under the breaker plate. Make sure they are free to move (free and lube them if they need it) and make sure the square cam portion of the distributor (that opens and closes the points) is free to advance and retard on the distributor spindle. Also make sure the springs on the advance weights are in place and not broken. If any of those components are stuck you could have the timing locked in one position that doesn't change with RPM or load.

While you're going through this, make sure all the ignition components are working and set properly before moving on to anything in the fuel system.

[spikyrob]

The cars been sat for a week, hardly long enough for the fuel to go off lol

It doesn't have a vac advance or a servo so no air leaks, also sprayed the inlet manifold with WD40 to see if there was any leaks but there wasn't.

I'v just checked the dizzy over and all seems well

It doesn't ping or knock when i reset the timing, and pulls better than when its retarded to get it to start.

i think i'll go and get it booked on the RR, its gettin a new sccr box on soon so any problems can be found before it gets reassembled

[69Cooper]

I had what sounds like the exact same problem.

Just rebuilt a Swiftune 1380 with SCCR gearbox (which took a couple of months, all in all)

Had great trouble getting it started, then when I did I adjusted the timing until I thought it sounded OK when running then it wouldn't start again and thsi caused my starter motor to pack in.

The anser for me was that I'd advanced the timing far too much and it was trying to fire at TDC, not good, piston travelling one way and combustion from spark trying to make it go the other way. So when I did get it started again by retarding the Timing I checked the timing with a Timing light and set it to 6 degree's BTDC, fixed.

It now runs OK but needs some final tweaks when I take it to the rolling road, hope this helps a little.

Strange why it should suddenly happen though?

[dklawson]

Just to clarify 69Cooper's comments...

When you set the timing to fire AT Top Dead Center... that's late or retarded timing, not advanced. Advancing the timing is adding degrees 'before' TDC.

As you increase the timing advance at idle the engine's RPM will increase and it will sound like it's ready to go making all kinds of power. However, when you try to re-start the engine, the spark fires so far before TDC that the piston is pushed back down the bore against the starter without any hope of the piston making it "over the top". This is called kick-back and as mentioned, it's not good for the starter.

A good starting point (regardless of your engine type/size) is to set a STATIC engine timing around 5 degrees Before TDC. Once you have the engine started you can dial in the advance you need/want with a timing light. With the vacuum advance tubing disconnected and plugged at the distributor you should not exceed a TOTAL maximum advance of about 35 degrees BTDC at 4000 RPM. Final timing needs to be adjusted downward from that point based on whether you can hear knocking or pinging under load.

[spikyrob]

I thought it might be something like that, i wasn't too sure though.

i'll let the rolling road guy sort it, at least its running now allbeit a bit rough but its good enough to drive to the rollers

Thanks for your help and clarification

Rob