16 replies to this topic

[Lt-SilverDragon]

Hey having problems with my mini, it won't start . I'm pretty sure it's the starter (possibly a high resistance fault in the starter if thats possibly?) but would like some opinions as I only bought it (reconditioned unit from DSN) a few weeks ago.

Heres what I know

When I first fitted it, it did manage to crank the engine over nicely but got awfully hot. After a few days I started having problems but managed to get it turning over but needed to jump start it from the solenoid. Took it to the MOT station and it started a few more times till I went to pick it up and it just refuses to crank the engine over quickly, I'm at the point that it can only be the starter as I replaced the battery with a fully charged one and also had one up front connected to the solenoid bypassing the cable that joins the battery to the solenoid as I also think it's needing replaced because it's shorting out or breaking down as my test light is very dim when I put it on the solenoid side and when it's get warm after I try to crank the engine a couple of times nothing happens no ignition lights etc.

Got to the point today that I bypassed everything and tried jumping the engine by connecting a battery directly to the starter, also so I could use the battery earth to rule out any earthing problems in the engine. Turned very slowly, decided to rule out the battery aswell so connected it to a running car battery still no luck so the only thing it could be is the starter surely?

Is there any faults that could cause a starter to fail? Or did I just get unlucky? Had a look at the bushes and they seem to be in pretty good shape but don't know what else to look for in a starter.

[Turbo Nick]

had one exactly the same from minispares before, brand new starter and it was .

[dklawson]

The only remaining test will be for you to pull the starter and power it on the floor while you hold it down with your foot. Use a known good battery and connect it to the motor using jumper cables. You'll only need to tap the cables to the starter to see if it works. If it doesn't come up to speed very quickly and try to leap out from under your foot there is something wrong with the motor.

[Lt-SilverDragon]

The only remaining test will be for you to pull the starter and power it on the floor while you hold it down with your foot. Use a known good battery and connect it to the motor using jumper cables. You'll only need to tap the cables to the starter to see if it works. If it doesn't come up to speed very quickly and try to leap out from under your foot there is something wrong with the motor.

Yeah have done that, does spin but doesn't try to leap out from under my foot. The bit with the teeth that comes back when you put power to it, is that suppose to stay pulled back when theres power as it wonders? Also levered a piece of wood into the teeth while it was spinning to see how well it chewed the wood but all I had was this soft stuff so couldn't tell if the starter was strong or not.

Guess I'll email DSN

[stefaz]

i have been having starting issues also - and have tried the method suggested above. i am wondering about it trying to kick out from under your foot and the bit with the teeth staying back - it spins up but takes a few seconds to get up to speed. cheers guys

Ant

[dklawson]

Getting up to speed on the inertia starter is supposed to be very fast. When working properly the reaction torque for that fast acceleration is what makes the starter want to jump across the floor. If it's taking several seconds to get up to speed you probably have two issues going on, maybe three. Badly worn brushes or broken brush springs won't carry enough current into the motor so it will accelerate slowly if at all. If the commutator on the motor spindle is damaged or heavily dirty this also prevents current flow (cleaning is by light sanding with garnet paper). Lastly, if the bushings supporting the armature are really dry or gummed up, this can cause so much drag that the motor will be hard to turn by hand. Cleaning and polishing the armature shaft is indicated in those situations along with soaking the bushings in the motor end caps with 20W or 30W oil.

by the way, do not be tempted to lube the Bendix unit on the end of the shaft. Opinions over the years have flip-flopped on what's best to do. In all situations, you rinse out any grease, dirt, or oil from the Bendix using a solvent like lacquer thinner or brake cleaner. Then the debate starts. Some say leave the unit completely clean this way. Others say to spray dry graphite or moly powder onto the Bendix splines. Personally, I use graphite but several people have told me not to.

[stefaz]

thanks dkl - i will try that on monday when i get home

[Lt-SilverDragon]

Took a quick vid, picture quality is ******* but maybe enough for somebody to know if the starter is normal or duff. Picking up another starter tomorrow so hopefully it will confirm that its the starter or not.

[Ethel]

Surely the thing to do is take the thing back and get another!

[Lt-SilverDragon]

Yeah thats whats happening but I want to make absolutely sure that its the starter before I send it back, plus they don't have any instock at the mo because of a shortage of old units.

[stefaz]

mine spins up faster than that, but i cant get vids up of it. still going to try the rebuild just to make sure

[Ethel]

Get yer money back 'n go somewhere that has one?

Can't see how there's a more appropriate test than turning your engine over - it could dance around your garage floor all day but it isn't producing the grunt needed to crank your engine.

[Lt-SilverDragon]

Yeah buying a secondhand unit tomorrow, hopefully that'll work. Was thinking of buying an outright unit from minispares but thats another tenner for postage and I hate wasting money on postage if the unit I get tomorrow sorts the problem then I'll just see how long it will take for DSN to get starters instock.

[dklawson]

It's ramping up a bit slow and it lacks that "jump" I was talking about. Since it's new/rebuilt I'd definitely take it back. If it were one you'd had for years I'd say clean the commutator and make sure the bearings/bushings are free.

I'm nosey. I poked around at some of the other pictures. That looks to be nice country you were driving through. And on the yellow car... haven't you had problems with the fuel pump being up that high? The fuel lines are routed above the float valves so there's always going to be a tendency for fuel in the pump body to slowly drain into the float chambers.

[Lt-SilverDragon]

Got the secondhand starter, was seized but gave it a quick blast of WD40 and turned it with a spanner and got it rotating. Bolted it up and got the engine started, gonna remove it and give it a proper clean as I'm waiting for the lead between the battery and solenoid to arrive as I'm gonna replace that aswell because I think it's shorting out. Is it hard to replace?

Haven't driven it enough to know mate, got it a few months ago and have only just got it on the road, haven't touched the engine except to replace the dizzy it's all been done by a previous owner and I've only driven it bout 10 miles but it is a wee bit difficult getting it started if it hasn't been run for a few days sometimes. Where would be a better place to put the pump?

That bit of road is amazing to drive on, inbetween Moffat and Edinburgh came across it by accident but it's a really fun drive with loads of turns once I've got the new mini up and running I'm gonna go take it a blast up there. Shame the picture quality of the vid is so poor, have got a 20 min vid going the other way but it's boring.