20 replies to this topic

[odo87]

hello, how dangerous are rollcages in road cars? i have heard mixed opinions so far. my mini has bucket seats if that makes a difference and i was going to fit a rollcage to add stability to the car but i have heard they can be dangerous without a crash helmet and padding etc..

[miller 666]

a good trick is to put some pipe insulation around the roll bars to prevent this happeneing


DO NOT USE PIPE LAGGING AS ROLL CAGE PADDING. IT WILL OFFER NO PROTECTION OF ANY KIND. ROLL CAGE PADDING IS VERY SPECIFICALLY ENGINEERED TO PROVIDE PROPER SAFETY

Edited by Dan, 10 September 2008 - 06:45 PM.
Dangerous advice, please read the red box at the top of the page

[Its a mini thing]

just get a half cage, in the rear etc????

[Retro_10s]

If you have a roll cage, then ideally you want Proper roll cage cladding wrapped around it (not pipe cladding), proper Harnesses to hold you in the seats and a crash helmet.

Most Injuries are caused when people have bare cages and no harnesses, meaning they come out of the seat and fracture their skull on the cage bars.

Show cages (like the shiny ones huddersfield spars sell etc) Can be very dangerous, they're prone to breaking in a crash as they're only for show, once they break then you have to share the inside of a rolling car with 2 or three large lengths of heavy pipe.... fun eh.

Edited by Retro_10s, 10 September 2008 - 06:13 PM.

[giz]

you could grow an afro and save a small amount of money

[Dan]

Really quite dangerous. Even if you do only have a rear cage there is a 2" diameter steel or titanium alloy tube a couple of inches behind your skull. In a battle between them, your skull will loose. Standard seats and belts allow a lot of movement in a crash, you only have to watch a crash test video to see that. If your buckets are fixed using direct replacement type subframes they will be no better. Personally I would never ride in a car with a cage unless I were wearing a helmet. And I mean never. A cage will be useful in perhaps 5% of crashes, in most of the rest it can make a minor crash something far more serious. Manufacturers and safety campaigners have spent years removing dangerous parts from inside cars, now you want to put a load of bare steel and nuts and bolts back inside yours.

It's your car and you have to feel safe in it, I'm not telling you not to do this because if it's what you feel you need to do to stay safe then by all means do it. If you do then please buy some proper, full spec FIA cage padding and a helmet. A standard belt will be OK if in good condition but a harness would be better. Also, seriously consider whether you think carrying a passenger is a good idea (you will only be able to carry one because a cage makes the rear seat fairly impractical and very dangerous indeed). If you have fitted the cage, you should be responsible for the safety of anyone in the car. A helmet will at least keep you alive in most circumstances but there are other injuries that a cage can give you besides a busted head.

[Grayedout]

Is it legal to wear a helmet inside a car on the public road ? I know you can for open top ones like Caterhams but something tells me it's not for a car with a roof.

[Dan]

I seem to remember you might be right but it only applies to full face helmets. Open face helmets are fine to my knowledge.

[mini93]

you get funny looks driving around in overall n open face helmet iv done it...get wierd looks filling up at the fuel station in overall's tied round the waist gloves and boots

[miller 666]

hi dan
sorry i didnt mean to give out dangerous advice but its what i was told to use when talking to someone from the f.i.a we know

[Dan]

Is this someone from the FIA now or were they there 20 years ago? Roll cage padding has had a homologation number for a good 10 years now and unapproved padding won't pass scrutineering at any FIA event.

[WillMini]

so what about when minis are put in situations like the roads in north America. a mini isn't going to stand a chance against the massive SUV's that crowd our roads. SO wouldnt a roll cage maybe help in these situations if you had proper padding and harnesses since there is a much larger chance of your car being absolutely dominated. Also, the interior of minis were not made to absorb someones head on impact like vehicles today, so would hitting your head off of the padded rollcage be better than smashing it off of the bare b-pillar or any of the other hard metal surfaces exposed in a mini?

[SukiDawg]

Really quite dangerous. Even if you do only have a rear cage there is a 2" diameter steel or titanium alloy tube a couple of inches behind your skull. In a battle between them, your skull will loose. Standard seats and belts allow a lot of movement in a crash, you only have to watch a crash test video to see that. If your buckets are fixed using direct replacement type subframes they will be no better. Personally I would never ride in a car with a cage unless I were wearing a helmet. And I mean never. A cage will be useful in perhaps 5% of crashes, in most of the rest it can make a minor crash something far more serious. Manufacturers and safety campaigners have spent years removing dangerous parts from inside cars, now you want to put a load of bare steel and nuts and bolts back inside yours.

It's your car and you have to feel safe in it, I'm not telling you not to do this because if it's what you feel you need to do to stay safe then by all means do it. If you do then please buy some proper, full spec FIA cage padding and a helmet. A standard belt will be OK if in good condition but a harness would be better. Also, seriously consider whether you think carrying a passenger is a good idea (you will only be able to carry one because a cage makes the rear seat fairly impractical and very dangerous indeed). If you have fitted the cage, you should be responsible for the safety of anyone in the car. A helmet will at least keep you alive in most circumstances but there are other injuries that a cage can give you besides a busted head.

Firstly - if you're fitting a cage you would surely already have proper belts rather than the standard seatbelt. The only reason you would want to fit a cage to a road car is because a) you're going to be using it for trackdays etc or b) you drive like a loon on the road. Putting the arguments behind b) to one side, there's no point fitting the cage unless you have the proper belts in either case because the improvement in safety per pound spent is going to be a lot more with just the belts before you even think about a cage. Proper belts and a decent seat will also improve your driving because you will be free to operate the controls without having to "hold on" round the corners as well. They're the obvious modification to make first.

Second thing - as you say there's been a lot of work done to improve interior safety over the last couple of decades - but lets face it, barreling around inside a standard mini initerior is not going to be that good for you whatever happens. If you are flying about inside there's a good chance you've rolled - and in that kind of scenario, I'd take my chances with the steel cage anyday - helmet or no helmet (are there Ti cages out there?? - I've worked in professional motorsport for well over a decade now and never seen a Ti one in a proper race car).

Guess what I'm saying is (in my view), so long as you have done the basic stuff, i.e. securely mounted 3 or 4 point belts and a decent, securely mounted seat - strenghening the shell with a roll bar or full cage can only be a good thing.

A cage without proper belts is going to be a bad idea - you've got your priorities back to front I'd say...

[taffy1967]

If you're going to fit a roll-cage, you really need to check it out with your insurers as most frown upon their fitment and assume you're going to drive like a loon as a result.

[Globule]

The only reason you would want to fit a cage to a road car is because a) you're going to be using it for trackdays etc or b) you drive like a loon on the road.

I'm not having a go there but i think you missed something out, im sure there are a higher propotion of people who fit roll cages for the "look" rather than for a or b above?

I know in that scenario a show cage is a possibility, but for a little bit more you can get the real thing!