54 replies to this topic

[chairchild]

The K&N torque ram, was basically a plenum, which gave nice stable airflow

The large diamter pipe, fed into a LARGER diameter box, which slows the air down, and yes, there will be a SLIGHT pressure increase, but nothing thats even worth mentioning, or attemptting to measure. This, when connected to the relatively small carb, simply gave it a very smooth intake of air, which simply makes fuelling accurately, easier to do

END OF!

And "ram-induction" only works if you have a VERY large scoop, and are doing a good 100mph+, and even then, it would only be a couple of psi. Shoving a bit of your mums ducting from the tumble-drier behind the grille wont do diddly-squat, as the air is still free to pass around it, and isn't being FORCED to enter the tube. The instant that the pressure in the tube reaches atmospheric, there are no forces (other than kinetic, which is very low anyway) which are making the air enter the tube.

And in fact, there is actually a chance if you have a tube with low airflow, pointing into a LARGE amount of airflow, you may be REDUCING the pressure inside the tube! (higher velocity air, flowing over a source of low-velocity air = low velocity air moves towards higher velocity air)


and before someone starts on about "what about drag cars with their intakes" - just think, some of those cars do in EXCESS of 200mph, and for the most part, they just design the scoops to:
1) give smooth airflow
2) give low resistance
3) look nice

any "ramming" would be pure coincidence, and usually not needed, as they have superchargers and turbos for that purpose

This is a dodgy example i know but, at school with the bunsen burners (NOT recomended) you could pass your hand over/through the flame (yellow/safe flame not the blue traingle) and your hand would barely heat up at all and thats with 300c and with your hand moving past no more than 1-2mph at best. With that same (slightly odd admittedly) logic, 20mph over 60-90c will barely heat up the air a fraction of a degree.

That is possibly the BEST example you could use to demonstate this!






And one more note - someone on turbominis stuck some bits of string onto the back of their "raised" bonned to see which way the air flowed - and it's actually sucking IN cool air, not letting the hot air blow out the back

Nearly all of this is very basic physics, based on the ventuuri effect

[M44K TS]

well no-one has really answered the question of where he can get a cold air feed

[Bungle]

yes they did second post on this topic

frontflow?

http://www.frontflow.co.uk

[cap'n crunch]

This is a dodgy example i know but, at school with the bunsen burners (NOT recomended) you could pass your hand over/through the flame (yellow/safe flame not the blue traingle) and your hand would barely heat up at all and thats with 300c and with your hand moving past no more than 1-2mph at best. With that same (slightly odd admittedly) logic, 20mph over 60-90c will barely heat up the air a fraction of a degree.

That is possibly the BEST example you could use to demonstate this!

thanks

[wwinstanley]

Thank you for everyone who has been helpful. But for people telling me not to get one, i appreciate your advice, but what does it matter to you if i do get one? how will it affect your life? I believe the origional question was where to get a cheap air feed. I think i will just make my own now.
I think this thread should be closed.
And for everyone who has speeled off a load of reasons why they are useless... I hope you are seen as a useful source of information for advice on what not to buy in the future.

[cap'n crunch]

Thank you for everyone who has been helpful. But for people telling me not to get one, i appreciate your advice, but what does it matter to you if i do get one? how will it affect your life? I believe the origional question was where to get a cheap air feed. I think i will just make my own now.

correct it does not effect us in the slightest, we were only trying to give you the full picture so you can make an informed desicion. Good luck with the air intake.

[Bungle]

maybe you could get your mini rolling roaded and tell us how much extra power you got from the engine with the ducting

[JetBLICK]

And "ram-induction" only works if you have a VERY large scoop

I have to disagree with that. This is a picture of a 'gruppeM' induction kit for a civic type R, as you can see it has a comparatively small scoop compared to a miglia one. The gruppe M induction kit is very well proven and one of the fav's among CTR peoples, and you dont have to be goin a million miles an hour either. However it is effectively a sealed system.. and thats why it works... i agree that random bits of pipe are not really gonna achieve much.



Each to their own tho, fi you want to put pipes in your engine bay, go for it

[Mini_Magic]

I have a MPi with a K&N cone filter, do I really need the two air feeds? I'd prefer to get rid of them, which would free up more space in a already cramped engine bay!

[Bungle]

have a read of the above topic and make your own mind up who to believe

[nurseholliday]

I'd disagree with the bunsen burner analogy because the engine is in an enclosed space. When you open your bonnet after your engine has been at operating temp does or does not hot air come out?

A correct analogy would be to put a bunsen burner in a small box (perhaps 15cm x 15cm x 15cm), allow it to heat up the air in the box, then pass your hand through.

I'm not saying the Cold Air Feed works or doesn't work, I just don't believe that air passing through the grill reaches the carb at the same temperature it entered the engine bay.

[Bungle]

so you have tryed opening your bonnet at 50 mph to feel the rush of cold air coming in through the grill

[cap'n crunch]

I'd disagree with the bunsen burner analogy because the engine is in an enclosed space. When you open your bonnet after your engine has been at operating temp does or does not hot air come out?

A correct analogy would be to put a bunsen burner in a small box (perhaps 15cm x 15cm x 15cm), allow it to heat up the air in the box, then pass your hand through.

i think you have missed the point...

[Ethel]

so you have tryed opening your bonnet at 50 mph to feel the rush of cold air coming in through the grill

Everyone who as ever driven around with their fresh air vent open or heater on would have some idea.

Similarly if you've ever been to a rolling road, or driven up a really steep hill, and noticed the how hot things get without the usual cooling effects of airflow when driving at road speed you'll have an appreciation of how effective a bit of a draft through the front grill is.




Bet we can keep this running for another week 'n still be no nearer a definitive answer.

[Bungle]

Bet we can keep this running for another week 'n still be no nearer a definitive answer.

i know the definitive answer

its 42