11 replies to this topic

[luiji89]

hey all probably a simple question and answer but i dont have a clue

after i have painted my bonnet/car do i then lacquer it and rub down
or rub down then lacquer after?

cheers

[Ivor Badger]

hey all probably a simple question and answer but i dont have a clue

after i have painted my bonnet/car do i then lacquer it and rub down
or rub down then lacquer after?

cheers

Laquer it within the stated time frame on the instructions, otherwise it's crinkle paint finish time. You do not need to rub it down, you just apply the laquer as an extra coat of paint.

[Big Guns]

hey all probably a simple question and answer but i dont have a clue

after i have painted my bonnet/car do i then lacquer it and rub down
or rub down then lacquer after?

cheers

Laquer it within the stated time frame on the instructions, otherwise it's crinkle paint finish time. You do not need to rub it down, you just apply the laquer as an extra coat of paint.

No offence, but I would TOTALLY disregard that advice. Flat back after priming to give a good key. Again, flat back as you apply the base coats ONLY if you get imperfections, runs, gun spatter etc. Once happy with the base coat finish flat back....USE LOADS OF WATER AND A LITTLE SOAP. Once you've a nice even (dull) finish start the cutting and polishing. When you've got it shining, apply the lacquer. You can flat/cut lacquer just as you can paint. Time IS NOT CRITICAL between base coat and lacquer application. "crinkly" paint is caused by a reaction through using incompatable coverings....ie acrylics/2 pack. Best advice....take your time, be patient and leave plenty of time for the paint to harden before cutting.
Regards.....Dave

[Ivor Badger]

Laquer it within the stated time frame on the instructions, otherwise it's crinkle paint finish time. You do not need to rub it down, you just apply the laquer as an extra coat of paint.
[/quote]

No offence, but I would TOTALLY disregard that advice. Flat back after priming to give a good key. Again, flat back as you apply the base coats ONLY if you get imperfections, runs, gun spatter etc. Once happy with the base coat finish flat back....USE LOADS OF WATER AND A LITTLE SOAP. Once you've a nice even (dull) finish start the cutting and polishing. When you've got it shining, apply the lacquer. You can flat/cut lacquer just as you can paint. Time IS NOT CRITICAL between base coat and lacquer application. "crinkly" paint is caused by a reaction through using incompatable coverings....ie acrylics/2 pack. Best advice....take your time, be patient and leave plenty of time for the paint to harden before cutting.
Regards.....Dave
[/quote]

Since the normal laquer application is simply the addition of another coat of paint during the spraying process, keying it in is not necessary. If you let the basecoat dry excessively, it will react to the laquer. So the application and flash off periods are critical.

You can rub down between coats if you wish and let them dry completely, but not the last coats. If you flat a mettallic in the final coat, you will expose the ends of the aluminium radomly giving a very eneven effect. That's one of the reasons for colour mismatch on mettalics, paint layer thickness and the amount of thinning affect the angle of the alumimium in the applied paint and thus the shade and reflectivness of the paint.

[cobblers]

What type of paints are you using?

Generally, with cellulose, If it's a metallic colour, don't flat the last coat of colour, and aim to get the lacquer on about half an hour to an hour after the last coat of colour (To get a chemical bond between the two)
Non-metallic paints you can flat with a ~800 grit to take out any orange peel/dust/flies before lacquer if you wish and to give the lacquer a mechanical bond to the colour (If you're flatting it, you'll have had to wait for a couple of hours at least so are unlikely to get a chemical bond. You don't really need to lacquer a non-metallic finish though.

You can adopt one of two policies with the top coat (Be it lacquer over a metallic, or the final colour on a solid colour)
Either:
Put it on in few, but fairly thick coats and aim for a good finish out of the gun but risk runs, or
Put it on a bit lighter, about twice as many coats, then flat it with 1200 then 1500 grit and buff it up to a good shine.

The first method is quicker and can give a good finish, but it takes more skill. The second method takes a hell of a lot longer, but relies on less skill while painting.

[midridge2]

Totally agree with the last 2 postings, this is the methods used in all the bodyshop/paintshops i have worked in.

[luiji89]

thanks for the replies guys!

[Surfbluegarage]

[/quote]No offence, but I would TOTALLY disregard that advice. Flat back after priming to give a good key. Again, flat back as you apply the base coats ONLY if you get imperfections, runs, gun spatter etc. Once happy with the base coat finish flat back....USE LOADS OF WATER AND A LITTLE SOAP. Once you've a nice even (dull) finish start the cutting and polishing. When you've got it shining, apply the lacquer. You can flat/cut lacquer just as you can paint. Time IS NOT CRITICAL between base coat and lacquer application. "crinkly" paint is caused by a reaction through using incompatable coverings....ie acrylics/2 pack. Best advice....take your time, be patient and leave plenty of time for the paint to harden before cutting.
Regards.....Dave[/quote]

as regards to this... this is defo a nono.... you do not flat and polish paint THEN laquer it...
you want a rough surface to laquer too otherwise your laquer is coming straight off.

primer the bonnet... flat back with wet and dry 400-600.. then depending on what paint you use, if its base apply your colour and if your going wet on wet and happy with the coverage of the base apply laquer within 30 mins of applying the base.if your not going wet on wet allow base to go dry to the touch, scotch back and laquear ideally within 24 hours
if its celly just lash the paint on (not literally) wait to dry cut back and polish (no real need for laquer) and same again with 2k.. there is no need to laquer 2k or celly paints only base (acrylic,synthetic)

and this "crinkley paint" everyone refurrs to is usually siliconing where a contaminent has come in contact with the surface usually caused in paint shops by either A. oily hands or B, cutting compound such as t cut or farecla...usually B in a bodyshop

Edited by mini_mad_daps, 20 December 2009 - 08:25 PM.

[jack_marshall]

I fail to see why anyone would wait any longer than the time it takes you to wash your gun and equipment and to mix your clearcoat before applying it to your basecoat.

Wait too long and it wont adhere properly, it only needs to be touch dry which you can see by eye.

Scotchbrite your basecoat and you'll see marks through it.

Solid colour basecoats can be laid over primer prepped from 500 upwards.

Metallic basecoats can be laid over primer prepped from 800 upwards.

[Pauly]

Agree with the last 2 posts, you dont flat back base coat, just spray it on, clean gun, mix laquer then spray straight ontop.

If you polish the base before laquer you run the risk of the laquer not sticking to the base.

Paul.

Edited by Pauly, 21 December 2009 - 08:41 AM.

[Surfbluegarage]

I fail to see why anyone would wait any longer than the time it takes you to wash your gun and equipment and to mix your clearcoat before applying it to your basecoat.

Wait too long and it wont adhere properly, it only needs to be touch dry which you can see by eye.

Scotchbrite your basecoat and you'll see marks through it.

Solid colour basecoats can be laid over primer prepped from 500 upwards.

Metallic basecoats can be laid over primer prepped from 800 upwards.

no you can scotch back base colours fine scotch is availiable for this grey ideally...have done many minis scotching back base coats between layers of colour AND before laquer but no not over do it. if any pieces of crap get into the base colour nib out with some 1200 on a block and use the corner of the block to nib out the dust or crap.

[jack_marshall]

Dust can be nibbed from basecoat with 1200 or grey scotch but they need to have another coat before clearcoat or the marks can be seen.