81 replies to this topic

[Captain Mainwaring]

I bet you are an eBay sellers dream customer - you accept everything these guys serve you up, without an element of questioning, something I find very odd from an Industrial chemist.

 

I'm perfectly aware that aluminium has been used in engines for years, and when it is, men with slide rules sit and work out how big the thing needs to be to do the job. 

 

I look a photos of ally rads next to copper rads, and see what appears to be an identical number of tubes and fin spacings, well that doesn't tie up with the material specs - 

 

The corrosion issue is quite relevant - more to the point, the choice of coolant used is critical, again, as a chemist, you already know that.

 

I'm not prejudiced, however it makes me puke to watch engineering co's go broke because the chinese take every last thing they make and copy it. The chinese are quite happy to subsidize sales at a loss until they have a full market share - intellectual property rights mean nothing to them, and I come from a time where there is an element of fair play in business.

 

Not one of the radiators that I have seen for sale from between £40 - £60 including shipping, duty, profit and VAT looks the part, they are clumsily formed up, and the TIG welding looks like an arc strike block - my engine bay is hardly concourse but what on earth would I want to bolt something so terrible looking in it for?

 

 

Radtec are a completely different ball game, just look and see for yourself, but then the price if around 5 times more expensive, I wonder why? 

[Tamworthbay]

I bet you are an eBay sellers dream customer - you accept everything these guys serve you up, without an element of questioning, something I find very odd from an Industrial chemist.
 
I'm perfectly aware that aluminium has been used in engines for years, and when it is, men with slide rules sit and work out how big the thing needs to be to do the job. 
 
I look a photos of ally rads next to copper rads, and see what appears to be an identical number of tubes and fin spacings, well that doesn't tie up with the material specs - 
 
The corrosion issue is quite relevant - more to the point, the choice of coolant used is critical, again, as a chemist, you already know that.
 
I'm not prejudiced, however it makes me puke to watch engineering co's go broke because the chinese take every last thing they make and copy it. The chinese are quite happy to subsidize sales at a loss until they have a full market share - intellectual property rights mean nothing to them, and I come from a time where there is an element of fair play in business.
 
Not one of the radiators that I have seen for sale from between £40 - £60 including shipping, duty, profit and VAT looks the part, they are clumsily formed up, and the TIG welding looks like an arc strike block - my engine bay is hardly concourse but what on earth would I want to bolt something so terrible looking in it for?
 
 
Radtec are a completely different ball game, just look and see for yourself, but then the price if around 5 times more expensive, I wonder why?

Hmmmm, I wonder if someone has interest is Radtec? Seem very keen to promote sales their way as a professional scientist I base my decisions on evidence not random racism. And all I can say is these work. Perhaps you should start a 'I don't like the Chinese because........' thread instead of trying to (incorrectly) bias the facts on here. Just for your information, the race cars we build are a showcase of 'best of British' they use as many British made parts as possible from the best manufacturers in the world, because the best ones in the world are here in the UK. I am fiercely pro-British engineering and volunteer hundreds of bours a year to promote engineering in schools. BUT I can not excuse rip off prices and terrible customer service and that is why a Radtec rad is not on our car and unless they change significantly it never will be. Protecting poor customer service and old fashioned 'it costs this much because we can' attitudes does nothing to promote British manufacturing.

[Captain Mainwaring]

I find your accusation of racism both inaccurate and offensive.

 

I don't choose products where it is clear they are being produced unethically, moreover wherever possible I avoid dealing with a country that openly promotes piracy and plagiarism. 

If I had stated that I found the chinese to be obnoxious and dirty, spitting and crapping everywhere, or that their faces made me feel sick, then you may have grounds to make such a statement.

 

It's unfortunate as a chemist with a PhD in fermentation that you aren't willing to provide any technical input save for "you racist" and "they look shiny".

 

I expect Radtec needs to cover materials and workshop time at the rates that are current in the UK, thus the understandably high price - China has a mountain of scrap (a little smaller now that they sell it on eBay) and cheap (read slave) labour, which explains the price and the quality.

 

I was going to ask if you had ever visited a manufacturing facility in China, but there's no need, it's clear.

When I see comments like yours, I am reassured that it's only a matter of time before the lights get turned out for the last time on british engineering and the chinese move in.

[Barman]

I was going to ask if you had ever visited a manufacturing facility in China, but there's no need, it's clear.

When I see comments like yours, I am reassured that it's only a matter of time before the lights get turned out for the last time on british engineering and the chinese move in.

I have…

 

Very impressive too… I spent a lot of time out there setting up production facilities which would have been too expensive in the UK.

 

One of the issues is the cost of energy and other red tape and regulations imposed on UK businesses… it simply isn’t true that all Chinese workers are slave labourers – they have a large, well educated workforce and cheap energy.

 

The UK is meeting its ridiculous ‘green’ obligations by exporting manufacturing (and CO2 production) to China. Don’t blame people that buy their products for this fact – blame the government.

 

Remember that most electronic goods you use (mobile phones, iPads, etc.) are also manufactured in Chinese factories.

[Captain Mainwaring]

I'm guessing that was a western owned, designed and run factory.

So, with your experience of living in China, how good would you say the salary and general living conditions for the average chinese worker was? On par with the UK? If it wasn't, then it points to "exploitation".

 

 

Without saying you were given rose coloured glasses, you were given rose coloured glasses.

I've worked across Chinese National Tobacco Corp, BJWFC textiles, Kunming Shipbuilding Co (KSEC is huge, over 70 hectares) and a good few more, and with very few exceptions the conditions and workforce were very hard to deal with. 

Yes, there is some skilled chinese labour about, and then there is the rest.

As for flexible - you try dealing with chinese labour and chinese unions.

 

Hold on though, the chinese still claim they are a "developing" country and therefore exempt from the terms of the Kyoto Treaty, how does that work then? 

China on one hand claims it's a world superpower and on the other claims it's exempt from environmental regulations - great, of course it's cheap.

 

I know too that may consumer items are made in China - they aren't made in the government sweat shops though, they're made in closely controlled factories with constant supervision.

 

I'm looking at chinese made equipment now, and wondering how that SS316 L is going "rusty", I'm also wondering why all the structural tubes on a machine distorted the minute it got about 120C....

Take it up with the supplier - he'll give you his own lab report, you tell him it's rubbish, he'll reply back and tell you that now you are in china, and that SS316 is not necessarily 316, and here's the rub, they won't accept an independent lab report.

 

Tell me if you have ever seen equipment that is completely chinese designed and built that goes anywhere on the world market? I really can't think of anything.

[sonikk4]

Ok this has now gone on far enough. The OP originally asked about how good these were for the price.

 

To the OP if you have read the posts you can see the majority say they are ok and have had no issues. If you want to pay top money then go to Radtec, if you are on a limited budget then buy the chinese variety or get your old rad recored.

 

This is not a debate about working practises etc in China, working conditions and so on. If you want to have a debate about this please feel free to do so but not by hijacking this thread.

[klivins]

Done 500 miles now with my fresly rebuilt 1275 engine with this chinese rad and 6 blade fan. In +30 deg heat in motorway speeds the temp never hets past 90 deg mar, hitting town traffic after motorway bit the needle reaches 100 deg, and idling - 110 deg, but engine does not boil. Upon resuming the driving temp drops to 90 deg again.