20 replies to this topic

[Dusky]

Hi!

As per title : are the headlamps permanently live?
Im coverting my bodged wiring loom back to the original 4 fuse setup.

If not: where do th elights get their power ( especially full beam/flasher would puzzle me, as the previous owner used a rainbow of colours... )

 

thanks as always! :)

[sixtyeight]

not sure about late model rovers.. but most are unfused straight off the solenoid/battery terminal. brown wire from solenoid > fuse box > headlight switch. then blue to dip/main beam switch.

 

It is a worthwhile mod though to put a relay and fuse in. you can get a 2 in 1 relay that does both dip and main beam, and has built in fuses as well. Google New-Era relay.

Edited by sixtyeight, 29 September 2016 - 10:31 AM.

[cal844]

i cant comment for MPI cars, however my 1993 sprite is permanent live

 

hope this helps

[tiger99]

Yes permanently live, from the brown circuit. It is illegal and dangerous to feed the entire headlight circuit through one fuse. You should not use a single relay either. You can, and ideally should, fit 4 fuses downstream of the dip switch, as in later Minis, which also separated the earths for the left and right lights.

The flasher is fed from the purple circuit which is permanently live but fused, and also feeds horn, interior light etc, that may be needed when the ignition is off.

[Dusky]

Well it was a succes!

Went from this

To this



Only Have to tidy the wires and wrap everything up again.
Waiting on my 4 fuse box to arrive.

[KernowCooper]

You have remembered that blade fuses and glass type have different ratings? a 15amp blade fuse is not the same as a 15a glass fuse.

 

The marking is different between glass and blade fuses. Glass fuses are labelled with their instant blow current  Blade fuses are labelled with their continuous safe carrying current, so the rule is Blade is 50% of the Glass type amps, which on some there is no 50% in Blade type so you have to use the nearest available try down first though.

[Dusky]

Jep :) Will work Out what fuses I need :)
If I remember correct it was you or David Wilson who commemted this on my Facebook:p

[WiredbyWilson]

It was me, I do the fusebox conversions and such to make life easier for owners.

​Also i have concerns that one of the wires there has "speaker cable" written on it! Definitely not suitable for electronics. You should also avoid using bare terminals (which I think I said on Facebook as well)

Edited by WiredbyWilson, 03 October 2016 - 12:56 PM.

[WiredbyWilson]

Yes permanently live, from the brown circuit. It is illegal and dangerous to feed the entire headlight circuit through one fuse. You should not use a single relay either. You can, and ideally should, fit 4 fuses downstream of the dip switch, as in later Minis, which also separated the earths for the left and right lights.

The flasher is fed from the purple circuit which is permanently live but fused, and also feeds horn, interior light etc, that may be needed when the ignition is off.

 

Can you please point me to the source that says it is illegal and dangerous to fuse the whole headlight system through one fuse, use one relay etc? IMHO it is more dangerous to have no fuse for the system given the switches burn out and cause significant damage to the whole loom.

Modern cars (and later minis) have a maxi fuse system which would wipe out large sections of electronics should it blow, so I'm very curious about this.

 

Many thanks.

[tiger99]

Have you ever had a complete headlight failure on a dark, twisting road at night? I have, in about 1970, and it is something that you don't forget in a hurry, if you survive.

You don't even need to start searching through the Construction and Use Regs, common product liability laws require that all risks which might cause injury or worse are As Low As Reasonably Practical (ALARP). That principle governs EVERYTHING that is made, including car electrical systems. You clearly don't understand safety analysis, so there us no point saying anything more along those lines.

But ALL modern cars have multiple fusing. My daily driver has a single main beam fuse because it has twin headlights and the dips, which are electronically protected, are always on with the mains, so the failure simply results in having dipped lights. That is a rather poor arrangement, but just about safe and legal.

No-one nowadays would dare to do something now regarded as imbecilic like having a single earth for both headlights. Not being ALARP, they would be sued for many millions if someone was killed as a result. If you build a safety system with a single point failure and it fails and causes an accident and kills someone you can rely on having a day or more in court, followed by a long holiday at one of Her Majesty's less salubrious premises, or in a civil court, the loss of probably most of your existing wealth and future earnings.

If you design something less safe than what was there before, you deserve all that you get when it fails. Sadly the innocent victims do not deserve what happens to them.

[Dusky]

 

Yes permanently live, from the brown circuit. It is illegal and dangerous to feed the entire headlight circuit through one fuse. You should not use a single relay either. You can, and ideally should, fit 4 fuses downstream of the dip switch, as in later Minis, which also separated the earths for the left and right lights.

The flasher is fed from the purple circuit which is permanently live but fused, and also feeds horn, interior light etc, that may be needed when the ignition is off.

 

Can you please point me to the source that says it is illegal and dangerous to fuse the whole headlight system through one fuse, use one relay etc? IMHO it is more dangerous to have no fuse for the system given the switches burn out and cause significant damage to the whole loom.

Modern cars (and later minis) have a maxi fuse system which would wipe out large sections of electronics should it blow, so I'm very curious about this.

 

Many thanks.

 

 

 

Have you ever had a complete headlight failure on a dark, twisting road at night? I have, in about 1970, and it is something that you don't forget in a hurry, if you survive.



If you design something less safe than what was there before, you deserve all that you get when it fails. Sadly the innocent victims do not deserve what happens to them.

 

Have you ever had a car that lit on fire because it was unfused .......
David's system is safer than the standard mini. What's your problem then?

[Mini 360]

 

David's system is safer than the standard mini. What's your problem then?

 

Usually his problem is that someone has a different approach/opinion than him and he throws a hissy fit.....

[WiredbyWilson]

If your lights failed due to a blown fuse then there is an issue that would cause the fuse to blow and subsequently it would need to be resolved, as opposed to a full on fire by shorted wires.
What happens if you have a failed alternator which leads to a dead battery?

Most would switch the hazards on on a dark Road if they'd lost there lights....

And to clarify, the supply to the relays in my kit isnt fused, only the supply out of the relays to the lamps. And then each lamp and beam pattern has a separate fuse (4 in total). Furthermore the sidelights are separately powered, hence the user would never be in total darkness.

Overall the kit is safer than the original wiring due to the introduction of a dedicated power supply controlled by amply rated relays and fuses for left/right and dipped/main.

Many thanks

Edited by WiredbyWilson, 03 October 2016 - 07:27 PM.

[Carlos W]

Ultimately the standard mini headlight set up is poor. Upgrading the headlights without upgrading the supply can cause further issues.

Is headlight failure due to a fuse popping any worse than headlight failure due to a fire? Well at least the fire would light the road I suppose

[minifreek1]

Can someone clarify something for me...

 

Blade fuse ratings over glass type fuses....

 

Whats the conversion factor....?

 

By my understanding from an above post..... if a glass fuse is rated at 10 amp the blade fuse should be 5 amp...? basically half the rate... am I correct in this...?

I only ask as I converted from glass fuse to blade fuse, swapping like for like and the same with the fuse value...

 

I am competent in wiring etc.. on cars/vehicles but knew nothing of the different ratings....