27 replies to this topic

[tiger99]

If the clutch is being worked on, the crankshaft will likely have been moved to its extreme position as regards end float. Is it possible that a thrust washer has managed to escape from its proper place and become wedged?

This would of course be possible only if the thrusts were very worn. However it used to happen depressingly often on a vaguely similar engine of similar vintage, the Triumph Herald/Spitfire.

[DJS911]

Thanks for all the suggestions so far.
Cam chain has a tensioner on it and all appears to be ok with that. In attempting to turn the crank pulley there doesn't appear to be any winding up of the chain. Chain and gear wheels appear ok with no obvious problems.
I've had all 8 cam followers out and nothing appears to be fouling the camshaft that I can see from above. A finger in the fuel pump drive hole doesn't reveal any problems.

On reflection I suspect that the problem may well be related to my attempt to remove the clutch/flywheel. Until I can get this off I can't strip things any further. ATM the flywheel appears to be loose (c1mm of movement compared to the clutch when very gently levering on the ring gear) so I'll get another puller and see how things go from there.

[ryomini]

Some flywheels come off easy, others seem to be  a pain

 

the bigger more expensive pullers are better and a good technique I believe is to wind it up and leave it a few hours if it doesn't want to budge

the pullers with more threads on the bolt pull better - check out this video it may help

if not Sollis mini engine rebuild video shows how he uses a big puller

 

[DJS911]

Thanks. It was actually Mini Sport's Heavy Duty puller I was using.
A 3 foot breaker bar and scaffold pole on the end eventually stripped the thread on the centre bolt.
I had the puller on for a few days and was tightening it bit by bit without success!
I believe that the flywheel is now loose as there is a bit of play in it but the clutch is rock solid still and stopping the flywheel coming off.

[tiger99]

Have you turned the engine to the wrong position and had the thrust washer locking clip drop out? If so, budget for a new flywheel as you will be cutting it off. It is a situation which in most cases is irrecoverable any other way.

The only other way that the clutch can hold up flywheel removal is if the pressure plate is seized on the primary gear splines due to severe rust. That would respond to lots of real penetrating oil, and time, or as a last resort, a rust - dissolving product.

[DJS911]

Thanks. The slot in the crankshaft was horizontal as we tried to remove the flywheel but given that it hasn't shifted could the clip have dropped out? Or is the clip free to drop after removing the flywheel bolt? If the latter then I suspect that is our problem as the engine has been turned over after the bolt was removed.
Also, if the clip has dropped out is it likely to get jammed and make the engine very hard to turn over?

Edited by DJS911, 09 October 2016 - 08:22 PM.

[nicklouse]

The clip can only move when the flywheel is removed. As in the actual action of moving it of the taper. I can drop into a grove in the flywheel jamming it all up.

[DJS911]

Thanks Nick, at least it doesn't appear to be that clip that's my problem then!
WRT crankshaft position to avoid this happening I have seen two different pieces of advice: one says to have the slot in the end of the crankshaft horizontal and the other says to have piston no 1 at TDC.
Which would you recommend?

[GraemeC]

Is this a verto or pre-verto clutch assembly?
If pre-verto and the flywheel is loose, just dismantle it in situ and remove it then worry about the clutch plate. No need for the puller.

That said, I'd be surprised at the clutch plate seizing onto the splines that well to destroy a puller. However it f it has, it could be that the primary gear has pulled hard against its backing ring, hence the extra resistance to the engine turning over.

[nicklouse]

Thanks Nick, at least it doesn't appear to be that clip that's my problem then!
WRT crankshaft position to avoid this happening I have seen two different pieces of advice: one says to have the slot in the end of the crankshaft horizontal and the other says to have piston no 1 at TDC.
Which would you recommend?

Horizontal.

 

see the slot and how it is orientated to the journals

at TDC the C ring has a 50/50 chance of dropping out into the flywheel.

Edited by nicklouse, 10 October 2016 - 07:34 AM.

[tiger99]

Sadly the need to set at TDC has been repeated many times in magazine articles etc, and like many other myths becomes established "fact" even when it is completely wrong. It causes immense grief to almost half those who follow it. I say almost, because in a very few cases the C clip stays in place while upside down. I have seen that once. He was very lucky indeed!

As clearly demonstrated by nicklouse above, pistons at half stroke is where the crank must remain when removing the flywheel. Lying on its side, it doesn't matter which way round the clip is. It has no incentive to fall.

[Cooperman]

Sadly the need to set at TDC has been repeated many times in magazine articles etc, and like many other myths becomes established "fact" even when it is completely wrong. It causes immense grief to almost half those who follow it. I say almost, because in a very few cases the C clip stays in place while upside down. I have seen that once. He was very lucky indeed!

As clearly demonstrated by nicklouse above, pistons at half stroke is where the crank must remain when removing the flywheel. Lying on its side, it doesn't matter which way round the clip is. It has no incentive to fall.

+2 on this.

[DJS911]

Thanks everybody for your comments and advice - much appreciated.

GraemeC - it's a Verto.

I'll be having another go at the weekend so will let you know any progress!