17 replies to this topic

[Mini-Hazel-Nut]

Hi all. My Classic Hot Rod has Metro vented discs up front and Minifins with the built in spacer at the rear. Wheels are 13" Superlites and when the open-ended nuts are done up the stud does not reach the end of the nut. Unfortunately a rule of the formula is that the nuts must be full of thread. If I were to fit the next size of studs up would my nuts bottom out before gripping the wheel? If anyone out there has had experience and knows the answer I`d be grateful. I gotta get this sorted soon as my first race is on Sunday and I don`t want the scroot telling me to ........go away.

[GraemeC]

You'd need to tell us what length the current studs are before we can say whether the next ones up would have sufficient thread (and even then we might not know!). There's so many variables.

Most of the studs listed on MiniSpares tell you the overall length and the thread length.

 

The correct rule of thumb is that the nut should have engagement equal to at least 1.5x the diameter of the thread. So for a 5/16" UNF wheel stud you should have at least 1/2" of thread engagement. 

If the nut has a total of 1" of female thread and the stud reaches over halfway then it is OK.

 

If you are confident that you have sufficient engagement but are worried the scrutineers may pick up on the fact the stud looks too far down the nut, then get closed ended nuts!

[gazza82]

Guess it depends how much will be used by the stud before the threads start or how much the wheels take ..

 

There are several options

 

http://www.minispare...uds.aspx?200105

[Mini-Hazel-Nut]

Know what you mean and I would use closed end nuts but again the rules say I must use open nuts. I KNOW there is enough thread in each nut but as I said the nut must be full. I tried using steel-wheel nuts and the studs protruded lots beyond them, looked daft so I went back to the others. According to Minispares the next length of stud from standard is plus 1/2 inch but I don`t want to go down the route of spacers and give myself clearance problems etc. I could "suck it and see" but the thought of all that stripping down, reassembly and then finding I still got a problem makes me shudder, hence my question on here.  Thanks people.

  Oh, and I have thought of screwing short lengths of stud into the ends of the nuts to fool the scroot but...............

[nicklouse]

measure current studs.

[GraemeC]

What nuts do you have? If standard steel wheel nuts leave lots protruding and yours look ‘empty’ there must be a fair difference in nut length?
I’d almost be tempted to shorten your nuts to suit the stud length!!

[cal844]

You must make sure your threads come through the nuts,they must be open ended, daft rules I know but that's how it is! Also make sure you have sufficient clearance lock to lock( might be checked, might not!)


Could you not make studs up?

Edited by cal844, 30 April 2018 - 08:34 PM.

[Mini-Hazel-Nut]

Someone else suggested shortening the nuts on Facebook but it would look so obvious even when cut on a machine as I would do if I went down that route. I just measured the ones on my road car (Cooper S brakes) and to do the same to that I would need the 50mm ones for the front and 78mm ones for the back. Easy enough but as I said, I`m afraid of bottoming and I think studs are too hard to run a die down - unless one of you knows different?

[Will16]

I think studs are too hard to run a die down - unless one of you knows different?

Ive cut more threads onto a stud, just take your time and use cutting compound, however its worth mentioning something I was told, which is that studs are hardened, some people say it might weaken the stud. Mine ended up being too long anyway, but I know of a couple people using died studs and have been fine (with wide banded steels and spacers!)

 

Edited by Will16, 01 May 2018 - 03:23 PM.

[Mini-Hazel-Nut]

 

I think studs are too hard to run a die down - unless one of you knows different?

Ive cut more threads onto a stud, just take your time and use cutting compound, however its worth mentioning something I was told, which is that studs are hardened, some people say it might weaken the stud. Mine ended up being too long anyway, but I know of a couple people using died studs and have been fine (with wide banded steels and spacers!)

 

That`s wicked Will. Now I know what must be done. Thanks everybody but this is the best answer yet.  Hazel

[nicklouse]

so are we going to get any info on what studs you have etc?  i would not be cutting threads. there were not cut originally due to needing to keep the strength. 

 

and will i can not see why you need so much thread!

[Will16]

and will i can not see why you need so much thread!

Dont ask me why but I bought the longest studs I could find then cut and threaded them and put them on before realising I was an idiot and bought shorter studs!

[GraemeC]

I wouldn’t be cutting threads on wheel studs either - that’s a lot of stress raisers on a component that goes through a lot of heat cycles.
Plus if they’re cut well into the wheel the side loading could shear them easily.

Shortening the nuts is far more sensible. And even if it is obvious that’s been done, is it against the rules? If it’s questioned, whip a nut off and prove there is sufficient engagement.

[cal844]

I wouldnt be cutting threads on wheel studs either - thats a lot of stress raisers on a component that goes through a lot of heat cycles.
Plus if theyre cut well into the wheel the side loading could shear them easily.

Shortening the nuts is far more sensible. And even if it is obvious thats been done, is it against the rules? If its questioned, whip a nut off and prove there is sufficient engagement.

Here is an attached screenshot of the rules regarding wheel nut thread engagement  2018-05-01_10-41-57.jpg   28.67K   8 downloads  2018-05-01_10-41-57.jpg   28.67K   8 downloads

Edited by cal844, 01 May 2018 - 09:43 PM.

[GraemeC]

Nothing there about not shortening the nuts?