22 replies to this topic

[FlyingScot]

Did you remove the flywheel / clutch? 

 

FS

[Elwyn]

Yes, the flywheel / clutch came out

new clutch plate

The old flywheel and pressure plate are unchanged, reassembled exactly as they were and back into the car in the only orientation that the keeway permits

Edited by Elwyn, 03 August 2021 - 10:30 AM.

[Elwyn]

Update

Crank sensor replaced

No change 

Still won't start

 

I changed the injector

I have a spare

 

When I took the injector out, when I pulled it out of it's tight vertical housing at the top of the throttle body, it was covered in fuel

The gap between the injector and the housing was wet with fuel

When I pulled the injector out, this excess fuel sloshed out and down onto the top of the closed butterfly

 

I replaced the injector, tried gain, no engine bang

Went back to the second injector and found the same thing, ie it was covered in fuel

The gap between the injector and the housing was wet with fuel

When I pulled the injector out, this excess fuel sloshed out and down onto the top of the closed butterfly

 

Fuel is going around, not through the injector?

Or is what I found normal and to be expected?

With 2 separate injectors?

 

There's a semi spherical yellow "hat" that sits on and provides power to the injector

Sorry for the terminology

There's an O ring that sits between the yellow hat and the vertical metal tube / housing that the injector sits in

Again sorry

This O ring is a saggy mess

Loose

Hanging out

No fuel is leaking out past this saggy O ring

But not creating a tight seal, not enough pressure?

 

Diagram below

The red oval is the saggy O ring

 Throttle body fuel injector housing o ring.JPG   44.22K   0 downloads

Could this be all or part of the problem?

 

Anyone know where I can get a replacement?
Nothing on Mini Spares

 

Almost all components of the throttle body are no longer available

 

I'll have to keep an eye open for a second hand spare

For when (not if) I need one

 

Or is all this a red herring and this is more an indicator that there's no power to the injector(s)?

 

Fuel being pumped into a small spaces

Injector not injecting (no power) 

Fuel being forced around the the injector

Possibly some through it too

But not following the injected route

 

Engine management relay?

Edited by Elwyn, 04 August 2021 - 08:16 PM.

[Elwyn]

Did you remove the flywheel / clutch? 

 

FS

Hello FS

Your question has been going round in my head for a few days now

The end of the crank shaft and the keyway locking plate can only go together in one position / orientation

I suppose it's possible to force the keyway plate on / in 180 degrees out, but that would take some stubborn walloping

BUT, the flywheel can be put back onto the primary gear in one of 29 orientations (the primary gear having 29 teeth) as long as the clutch plate grooves / slots align with the same on the primary gear

Is that right?

If so, simply putting the keyway back in the right orientation is close to meaningless in terms of the flywheel orientation

Is that also right?

If the answers are yes and yes, it's more than likely that I've put the flywheel back on in one of the 28 wrong positions

Is that what you were thinking when you asked the question?

 

The engine is back in the car, but I can get the wok off and the flywheel out

 

Is there manual / Haynes page reference to refer to for getting this right?

 

Find TDC and locate gap(s) in the reluctor ring with the crankshaft sensor?

 

Presumably a little more to it than that?

 

Thanks in advance

 

Elwyn

Edited by Elwyn, 06 August 2021 - 10:08 AM.

[Elwyn]

In the Rover Service repair manual for SPI Minis, totalling 482 pages (which is VERY good), pages 174 - 178 (inclusive, by PDF page number counter) describe the process of removing the wok, the flywheel / clutch etc and for their subsequent re-fitting.

The same manual describes the function of the gaps in the reluctor ring, the crank sensor, TDC and the ECU MEMS with regards to timing.

Where it talks about the reluctor ring / crank sensor / TDC / ECU timing functionality, it refers you to the Clutch section.

In the clutch section (pages 174 - 178), it makes no reference to the reluctor ring / crankshaft / TDS positioning and alignment that's presumably needed.

It basically says, "put it back on and tighten things up"....not quite those words exactly

 

Does anyone know if it's somewhere else in the 482 pages?

 

Thanks in advance

 

Elwyn

[Bobbins]

Your 29 possible orientations of the clutch plate on the primary gear is a red herring, as soon as you depress the clutch with the engine running the primary gear and clutch plate spin independently of the crankshaft and flywheel assembly.

As I've posted in your other thread, have you assembled the clutch assembly EXACTLY as it was? The relationship between the clutch centre and the flywheel are critical. I don't have the information to hand but there's a degree measurement for the position of the reluctor missing teeth pattern at TDC, this would be worth checking.

[Elwyn]

UPDATE

 

The engine is running

On all 4 cylinders

Still with some fine tuning to do, but it's a huge step forwards 

Thanks for all the helpful advice, thoughts, theories and pointers

 

Regards

 

Elwyn

[humph]

Great news. What was the solution?