339 replies to this topic

[mab01uk]

Electric cars threaten national security, defence chiefs warn.
"Concerns Beijing could eavesdrop on conversations using vehicles planned for ministerial and official use, report finds.
Electric cars pose a potential threat to national security as they are vulnerable to Chinese spying, according to an official defence assessment by the Government’s spy lab."
A report by the Defence Science and Technology Laboratory (DSTL) found that there were concerns Beijing – which dominates the market – could effectively eavesdrop on conversations using the vehicles, which are to be introduced for all ministers and officials by the end of 2027.
One source in the Sunak government close to the conversations called it an “oh s---” moment when the implications of the government’s electronic vehicle push were realised.
The source said: “They are basically mobile spying platforms. The array of data you can pick up from these things is extraordinary, particularly conversations that happened in the car.”
There is no blanket ban on Chinese-made electric vehicles being purchased for the government fleet, despite concerns about potential spying.
There are some signs of changes inside Whitehall, however, with the i newspaper revealing on Wednesday that electric cars with Chinese components are now banned from sensitive military sites.
Luke de Pulford, the executive director of the Inter-Parliamentary Alliance on China, said: “Any device requiring remote software update is vulnerable to manipulation.
“The issue with Chinese electric vehicles is that Beijing’s regulations make it possible for the Chinese government to use this capability for ill. With China having already been accused of spying on a ministerial car, this is a risk we should not take.
“If we can only meet the 2027 target by purchasing Chinese electric vehicles, with attendant security risks, the policy needs a rethink. National security comes first.”
Charles Parton, an adviser to the Coalition of Secure Technology, which campaigns to raise awareness of the threat posed by technology produced by potentially hostile states, said about the government fleet: “Do not use a car that is Chinese. And do not use a car that has a Chinese cellular module.
“If you have ministers talking in the back of their cars then that information is vulnerable.”
A DfT spokesman said: “We remain committed to ensuring all central government car and van fleets are zero emission by the end of 2027”.
https://archive.ph/abCMO

 

[Shooter63]

Electric cars threaten national security, defence chiefs warn."Concerns Beijing could eavesdrop on conversations using vehicles planned for ministerial and official use, report finds.Electric cars pose a potential threat to national security as they are vulnerable to Chinese spying, according to an official defence assessment by the Government’s spy lab."A report by the Defence Science and Technology Laboratory (DSTL) found that there were concerns Beijing – which dominates the market – could effectively eavesdrop on conversations using the vehicles, which are to be introduced for all ministers and officials by the end of 2027.One source in the Sunak government close to the conversations called it an “oh s---” moment when the implications of the government’s electronic vehicle push were realised.The source said: “They are basically mobile spying platforms. The array of data you can pick up from these things is extraordinary, particularly conversations that happened in the car.”There is no blanket ban on Chinese-made electric vehicles being purchased for the government fleet, despite concerns about potential spying.There are some signs of changes inside Whitehall, however, with the i newspaper revealing on Wednesday that electric cars with Chinese components are now banned from sensitive military sites.Luke de Pulford, the executive director of the Inter-Parliamentary Alliance on China, said: “Any device requiring remote software update is vulnerable to manipulation.“The issue with Chinese electric vehicles is that Beijing’s regulations make it possible for the Chinese government to use this capability for ill. With China having already been accused of spying on a ministerial car, this is a risk we should not take.“If we can only meet the 2027 target by purchasing Chinese electric vehicles, with attendant security risks, the policy needs a rethink. National security comes first.”Charles Parton, an adviser to the Coalition of Secure Technology, which campaigns to raise awareness of the threat posed by technology produced by potentially hostile states, said about the government fleet: “Do not use a car that is Chinese. And do not use a car that has a Chinese cellular module.“If you have ministers talking in the back of their cars then that information is vulnerable.”A DfT spokesman said: “We remain committed to ensuring all central government car and van fleets are zero emission by the end of 2027”.https://archive.ph/abCMO

Let's be honest here, any device that has the ability to send and receive can be "listened to" which is why the government s of the world want us all to have such devices, be it a phone, smart speaker etc, my daily car speaks to the manufacturer, the above is just a puff piece, it could be just as easily been written about any car/appliance manufacturer.

Shooter

[mab01uk]

How EV makers are trying to make them sound, feel and drive like petrol cars.
"Automakers have been investing in sound design to create electric car sound for two reasons: to adhere to safety regulations and to bring to life the driving experience audibly.
Many drivers find that the absence of sound-induced emotions contributes to a reduced sense of feedback and engagement when driving an EV compared to a combustion car. Driving is an emotive activity, with performance and power conveyed through the sensory experience of engine mechanics - and the need to translate this to EV will shape the future of mobility.
A 2024 poll found that 47 per cent of pedestrians are concerned about how quiet electric vehicles are.
Venson Automotive Solutions' research also revealed that 27 per cent of pedestrians said they had recently been taken by surprise by the silent approach of an EV car.
When polled, 26 per cent of road users indicated they would prefer EV cars to mimic the noises produced by traditional combustion engine cars.
An academic study published in the British Medical Journal (BMJ), which found that EV cars pose a greater risk to pedestrians than ICE cars.  
The published work stated that electric cars are thought to pose a higher risk to pedestrians as they do not hear them approaching in time to react and avoid a collision, leaving pedestrians twice as likely to be hit by an electric or hybrid car than a petrol or diesel one.
EU regulations have required vehicles to use Acoustic Vehicle Alerting Systems (AVAS) since 2019. But without more robust regulations and a uniform approach to the artificial noises EVs make, Venson warns that vulnerable road users stand to be affected."
https://www.thisismo...etrol-cars.html

 

Edited by mab01uk, 21 April 2025 - 09:50 AM.

[Shooter63]

How EV makers are trying to make them sound, feel and drive like petrol cars."Automakers have been investing in sound design to create electric car sound for two reasons: to adhere to safety regulations and to bring to life the driving experience audibly.Many drivers find that the absence of sound-induced emotions contributes to a reduced sense of feedback and engagement when driving an EV compared to a combustion car. Driving is an emotive activity, with performance and power conveyed through the sensory experience of engine mechanics - and the need to translate this to EV will shape the future of mobility.A 2024 poll found that 47 per cent of pedestrians are concerned about how quiet electric vehicles are.Venson Automotive Solutions' research also revealed that 27 per cent of pedestrians said they had recently been taken by surprise by the silent approach of an EV car.When polled, 26 per cent of road users indicated they would prefer EV cars to mimic the noises produced by traditional combustion engine cars.An academic study published in the British Medical Journal (BMJ), which found that EV cars pose a greater risk to pedestrians than ICE cars.  The published work stated that electric cars are thought to pose a higher risk to pedestrians as they do not hear them approaching in time to react and avoid a collision, leaving pedestrians twice as likely to be hit by an electric or hybrid car than a petrol or diesel one.EU regulations have required vehicles to use Acoustic Vehicle Alerting Systems (AVAS) since 2019. But without more robust regulations and a uniform approach to the artificial noises EVs make, Venson warns that vulnerable road users stand to be affected."https://www.thisismo...etrol-cars.html

No need to invest millions, just make it compulsory for every EV owner to fit one of these bad boys,

Shooter

Attached Files

•  b155b44b4098354c0106afdb732fbf18~2.jpg   41.48K   0 downloads

[PoolGuy]

Toyota chairman nails it  https://www.forbes.c...th-predictions/

[Blumeanie]

"How EV makers are trying to make them sound, feel and drive like petrol cars"

 

I've read about attempts to use a manual shift for an EV. I would see this useful for low gear 'crawling' in an off road application. But you could also address this by reducing the throttle sensitivity. It is pretty silly otherwise as Electric motors do not need gears across their rev range.

EVs make a sound when moving below 5mph. - Early on, users could add their own sound to their EV to make noise for the benefit of pedestrians. I was partial to the Jetson's spaceship noise - from the cartoon show.

I've always driven a manual gearbox - on or Off-road. I refuse to drive an automatic - i think they are moronic appliances. However, I do not mind driving an electric drivetrain without a third pedal. It is just so much better.

Yes - there is something about the grumble from a V8 or a V12 - but how many of us are really doing that in a daily driver these days? Most of us would be driving a turbo'd inline 4, or maybe a 6 cyl. at best...

I like the lack of maintenance and free fuel (from the sun) available for an EV. Who wants the hassle and cost of fuel, repairs, and maintenance, and trips to hand $$ over at the fuel station when they can be avoided on a daily driver?

Remember - I have the mini for all that!

[Blumeanie]

Toyota chairman nails it  https://www.forbes.c...th-predictions/

 

And yet:
https://electrek.co/...7-what-we-know/

 

What else are they going to say... They goofed!

Toyota simply fell way behind due to their hydrogen folly (investment in H2 keeps shrinking) and then lost further ground trying to protect their hybrid dominance. They are desperately playing catch-up now.

 

 

I'll add this - well because conspiracy theories...

https://www.msn.com/...cid=socialshare

This is a good start - but I believe there is enough material to make 10 more of these myths videos.

Edited by Blumeanie, 11 June 2025 - 11:27 PM.

[humph]

"How EV makers are trying to make them sound, feel and drive like petrol cars"

 

The big question is why would you want to, except to convert the sceptics.  I love the sound of a good petrol engine, and prefer to drive my Minis without any kind of radio/stereo so that I can here the a series doing it's thing, but the lack of a engine drone is what makes driving our EV a much more relaxing experience.  We regularly do north west to south coast and in our previous ICE cars we'd arrive exhausted and stressed from hold ups, these days it's a much better experience in my opinion.  Same goes for any kind of fake manual shift. MINI put 'fake' gear shifts into their CVT gearbox and for me that was a terrible driving experience. Like most things everybody will have an opinion and a preference, giving the people the option to switch these bits on and off might be the answer.

 

The option to choose your own external noise sounds great when thinking about what you'd have personally. Think about it more from a point of walking down you local urban road to a cacophony of space shifts, lazer blasters, light sabres, jet engines etc. and all of a sudden it becomes a very bad idea, we'd all be mental wrecks!!!

[Bobbins]

"How EV makers are trying to make them sound, feel and drive like petrol cars"

The big question is why would you want to, except to convert the sceptics

But you think differently because you drive an EV, I’m the same. I recall the thought process I went through prior to experiencing EV ownership and it wasn’t dissimilar, I want it to make noise, I want to change gear!

What is most interesting is listening to the CEOs of major car manufacturing companies who bang on about the same, very clear that individually they have very little EV experience. Shareholders should be banging on CEO doors and forcing them to go through the EV experience.

[sonscar]

Why should we be "forcing"anybody.I am not anti EV at all but I am pro choice.Steve..