32 replies to this topic

[Dan]

if it were the case people wouldnt be using them on competition vehicles

You mean vehicles with engines that have to give up every possible half a horsepower and that are expected to be serviced every race and rebuilt every couple of hundred miles? Of course they would, that's exactly the sort of situation you would use a foam sock or steel gauze for. Race parts are for race cars, road cars need to last longer between services, much longer between rebuilds and the tiny loss of potential output is irrelevant in day to day use. That's why IMHO there is nothing better than an oiled cotton gauze for a road engine.

[mini93]

actualy i was refering to this bit

decrease the volume of air going in

so if you have an answer to that rather than trying to "one up" people at every single point that would be ace...TA!

[morley]

k&n everytime it's all in the vizard bible!

what i've heard about the foam sock filters, is that as the carb is sucking in air it tends to suck in the sock slightly as well making it more dense and thus letting in less air... something like that anyway

[Dan]

so if you have an answer to that rather than trying to "one up" people at every single point that would be ace...TA!

Bad day? The OP asked for opinion, that's mine.

[mini93]

always a bad day i just think there was not such a need to sound so sarcastic thats all but oh well, if thats to be your oppinion

[Carlzilla]

the standard airbox with extra holes and a K&N element is shown to be the most efficient on a road car (read that somewhere, cant remember where)

But nobody really does use that as the airbox is an ugly thing to look at in the engine bay and takes up a lot of space.

K&N Cone filter has got my vote.

Edited by Carlzilla, 29 November 2010 - 08:31 PM.

[Retro_10s]

But nobody really does use that as the airbox is an ugly thing to look at in the engine bay and takes up a lot of space.

I've used that filter setup on every mini I've owned,... It's the quietest set-up, and the filter housing also helps insulate the carb from freezing in cold weather, and i can't see what else the space it takes up could be used for anyway...

you read it in D.Vizards book,.. or somewhere that it was quoted

[MRA]

actualy i was refering to this bit

decrease the volume of air going in

so if you have an answer to that rather than trying to "one up" people at every single point that would be ace...TA!

I wasn't "one upping" anyone, its from experience gained over the last 30 years of Minis, however I am quite willing to hear your side of this debate, I guess that you have lots of information where a sock filter has worked really well then get it heard here and now, let us know of these new developments...

The problem is that when you try something a few times and find it doesn't give you the results you tend to be biased against that product, a filter has only two jobs, 1) to supply clean air, 2) to restrict dust and debris from entering your engine. cosmetics has nothing to do with either.......

And ther eis always a compromise as the 2 jobs of a filter are in direct violation of each other.

So if you have new info then lets get it out here, otherwise no progress has been made.

[mini93]

well apparently people cant read what i was saying propperly...jeez

[Dan]

It's OK Martin, it was me he took issue with not you.

[1964Woody]

But nobody really does use that as the airbox is an ugly thing to look at in the engine bay and takes up a lot of space.

I've used that filter setup on every mini I've owned,... It's the quietest set-up, and the filter housing also helps insulate the carb from freezing in cold weather, and i can't see what else the space it takes up could be used for anyway...

you read it in D.Vizards book,.. or somewhere that it was quoted

I don't have Vizard with me right now but Keith Calver wrote a piece about exactly this issue - concluding that the standard airbox with 6 3/4" holes drilled in it and a K & N filter was better than the standard filter or the K & N cone:

http://www.calverst.com/cc110f.htm

[mini93]

ok, as some people cant read, i was on about foam filters, as in pannel filters not socks, the pannel filters have much more in the way of support, wire frame on the inside so dont suffer the flex of which socks have, also as you have a larger area of which the air is entering (as opposed to sock filters where you have a small opening around the trumpet) you again see less foam flex, so i dont see that area being a problem.
also, the size of the trumpets on my webbers, think you would be hard pushed to fit them inside a convensional K&N unless it was a modified set up.

aaaaaand last of all, i said thats all the persuasion i need...in otherwords its my oppinion

Edited by mini93, 30 November 2010 - 06:51 PM.

[huw_jenks]

From what I remember of David Vizards book, the K&N pancake/cone would come out best in the tests. The big advantage is that they last so long and are reusable.

However, this advantage was only apparent when the pancake filter was used with a stub stack or rampipe! There is no point whatsoever in using a cone or pancake filter without a rampipe, as the shape of the mouth of the carb will actually constrict the air that goes in. A K&N element in the airbox is better than just the cone filter alone!

So IMO, big K&N pancake, rampipe (half donut shape is good) and gas flow the carb and manifold at the same time. Or just read 'The yellow bible' and make up your own mind.

[MRA]

This restriction is called the "vena contracta"

[attachment=105044:vena_contracta.bmp]

The pictures are not great, however what is supposed to be clear is that the first two restrict flow....... and th ethird allows more flow to enter your engine, coupled with more fuel and a tweak or two this should translate to more hp

Edited by mra-minis.co.uk, 30 November 2010 - 09:29 PM.

[Jeffreypang911]

Hate to post on an old thread but I finally found the video I was looking for with the socks moving about...