47 replies to this topic

[MaxAndPaddy]

Six points is the maximum if I choose to go to court and lose, but I'm not intending to use the services of mr loophole so as mr cooper man says above it will be the fixed penalty, 3 pts and £100 point fine. I can apply for the speed reduction course and not get the points but I don't think I will.

[adam_93rio]

About the reduced speed limits when there is traffic ahead etc. they've been on the motorways for years (albeit without cameras) and everyone ignored them completely to a point where it was more dangerous to slow down to 50 when there was traffic ahead

The idea behind slowing the cars before they hit the traffic is to give the traffic a chance to move before more cars get there and pile it up into miles of stop start traffic.

If people used their brains in the first place, there would be no need to out cameras on there. Slowing down to 50 was an instruction on the signs to make you less likely to hit traffic

[MaxAndPaddy]

About the reduced speed limits when there is traffic ahead etc. they've been on the motorways for years (albeit without cameras) and everyone ignored them completely to a point where it was more dangerous to slow down to 50 when there was traffic ahead

The idea behind slowing the cars before they hit the traffic is to give the traffic a chance to move before more cars get there and pile it up into miles of stop start traffic.

If people used their brains in the first place, there would be no need to out cameras on there. Slowing down to 50 was an instruction on the signs to make you less likely to hit traffic

 

I agree upto a point but the old signs were not very reliable, so more often than not they were flashing when there wasn't any real issues ahead, so most of the time you just ended up ignoring them.

 

The new modern signs are more actively controlled and there are more cameras watching what is going on, so any instruction is more likely to be a genuine warning, but without the speed camera element, they are still likely to be mostly ignored. As I said above, I don't really have an issue with them, I do think they even out the traffic flow.

 

Having said that, there are a set of non camera'ed lights between the top of the A1 and M1 North of Leeds and they are on at least once every week when I drive to work for no obvious reason.

[MrBounce]

Average speed cameras don't flash in much the same way that mobile speed cameras don't. The only ones I am aware of that "flash" you are the fixed cameras in the yellow boxes by the side of the road. Also, re the "banned for doing 91" driver, it could be that he/she had 9 points or more already and that is why the ban was enforced.

 

In case anyone cares, I work for the Constabulary.

[M J W J]

Average speed cameras don't flash in much the same way that mobile speed cameras don't. The only ones I am aware of that "flash" you are the fixed cameras in the yellow boxes by the side of the road. Also, re the "banned for doing 91" driver, it could be that he/she had 9 points or more already and that is why the ban was enforced.

 

In case anyone cares, I work for the Constabulary.

 

I'm not sure on the exact details. Next time I see them I will ask. To be caught speeding by average speed cameras means you have been constantly speeding for some distance, not just a quick lapse in concentration.

 

As it got to court I am guessing they were probably hit with heavier points and fines for wasting people's time.

 

I suppose they could have gone past 4 cameras and been done 4 times?

[miniyellowmini]

Six points is the maximum if I choose to go to court and lose, but I'm not intending to use the services of mr loophole so as mr cooper man says above it will be the fixed penalty, 3 pts and £100 point fine. I can apply for the speed reduction course and not get the points but I don't think I will.

Bad luck there :-( but better to take the fixed penalty. Personally though, I'd take the speed awareness course rather than points as you'll have to declare any points to your insurance and may affect your premium for the next 3-5 years. As it's not a conviction you wont need to declare the SAC, unless specifically asked by the insurer.

[Mini-Mad-Craig]

I think I would seriously consider the SAC too. I think overall it would work out cheaper over the course of the new few years, declaring your speeding fine on your insurance. Plus, you then know you have a totally clean, earned license.

[MaxAndPaddy]

 

Six points is the maximum if I choose to go to court and lose, but I'm not intending to use the services of mr loophole so as mr cooper man says above it will be the fixed penalty, 3 pts and £100 point fine. I can apply for the speed reduction course and not get the points but I don't think I will.

Bad luck there :-( but better to take the fixed penalty. Personally though, I'd take the speed awareness course rather than points as you'll have to declare any points to your insurance and may affect your premium for the next 3-5 years. As it's not a conviction you wont need to declare the SAC, unless specifically asked by the insurer.

 

 

I drive a crap car and I'm old so the premium hit isn't going to be to bad, I had 5 points when I first took the policy out and it didnt drop much, if at all when I went point free.

[MaxAndPaddy]

they did include some helpful guidance on what are not valid reasons for appealing a speeding ticket

 

I did not know the road

I did not see the signs

I was distracted

I was late

I believe my speedo is faulty

The road was clear/ it was late at night

I have a clean licence

Its my first offence

 

and my personal favourite which I would have used

 

I did not see the speed camera 

[MrBounce]

they did include some helpful guidance on what are not valid reasons for appealing a speeding ticket

 

I did not know the road

I did not see the signs

I was distracted

I was late

I believe my speedo is faulty

The road was clear/ it was late at night

I have a clean licence

Its my first offence

 

and my personal favourite which I would have used

 

I did not see the speed camera 

Add to this "My satnav said I was doing 29" and "I don't believe the camera is calibrated"

[mab01uk]

The idea of variable motorway speed limits is also to even out and reduce the 'phantom traffic jam waves' caused by heavy braking......  

It takes only one small action to create a ripple effect of braking cars which escalates as it moves back down the line, eventually halting traffic.”

 

The Phantom Traffic Jam - an explanation

 

 

Good motorway drivers read the road far ahead, and can see the ripple of stationary traffic coming towards them. If you slow down early and try to avoid stopping, you ‘Kill the ripple’.

 

The ABD offers the following additional advice to drivers to prevent phantom jams:

1. Maintain good lane discipline. If you are not overtaking move to the leftmost lane. If you are blocking an outer lane other drivers have to either slow down or change lane to pass you.
2. Try to avoid braking by keeping a safe distance. If the car in front brakes this gives you time to just ease off a little and avoid a ripple effect. It is quite possible to 'iron out' ripples this way.
3. When leaving the motorway try not to slow down until you are in the slip road. This avoids disturbing traffic flow.
4. When entering the motorway accelerate to the speed of traffic. Never enter at a speed slower than traffic in lane one. It causes braking and needless lane changing.
5. Don't drive unnecessarily slowly. Trucks are electronically governed to 56MPH. If you travel slower than this speed you will create congestion as they move out to pass you. If you don't feel comfortable driving above 50MPH then don't use the motorway.
6. Plan lane changes to cause no disruption to traffic flow. When overtaking accelerate briskly to match speed of traffic in the lane you are moving into. When moving back find a gap large enough that you can slot into without braking.
7. Remember it takes just one driver to block a motorway. Don't be that driver. Think about the effect of your actions on traffic behind you. Ask yourself if other drivers are having to alter course or slow down because of your position or speed.

Edited by mab01uk, 15 October 2014 - 11:07 PM.

[Ben_O]

 

they did include some helpful guidance on what are not valid reasons for appealing a speeding ticket

 

I did not know the road

I did not see the signs

I was distracted

I was late

I believe my speedo is faulty

The road was clear/ it was late at night

I have a clean licence

Its my first offence

 

and my personal favourite which I would have used

 

I did not see the speed camera 

Add to this "My satnav said I was doing 29" and "I don't believe the camera is calibrated"

 

Well that's a bit daft saying those reasons are not valid excuses.

 

What would be a valid reason for appeal then? Seems like they are basically covering every possible reason and listing them as not being grounds for an appeal!

 

I can't think of one thing that would be an excuse that isn't on that list. 

[AVV IT]

The only valid excuse for speeding that I'm aware of is inappropriate/ unclear signage. (I.e you: weren't aware of the speed limit because the speed restriction signs were either missing or obscured). Not likely to work if you were doing over 70mph on a motorway though, on the grounds that you can't really claim that you weren't aware that a 70mph limit was in force, wether signs were present or not.

[M J W J]

If you are trying to get someone to the hospital because of a medical emergency is a valid reason for speeding but you can still be prosecuted for dangerous driving if you cause an accident. You also need to be able to prove that there were no other options (often not the case as you could call an ambulance) and that the person you took to the hospital was actually admitted.

 

Our family friend who banned the driver for doing 90 mph on the motorway, had to eventually overturn one of his rulings as someone was able to prove the above.

 

Also apparently 'my wife was going into labor' is not considered a medical emergency.

[Dan]

Ha ha, yes but seems strange that 2 miles an hour is the difference between innocence and 6 points, id have thought it would be 3 points max plus a fine. Don't really understand how it can be a 6 point offence even if that is a worst case scenario.

It would be the same in all cases, it's only 3 points and a small fine if you accept the summary justice of the camera or the police officer. If you choose court for anything the maximum penalty that can be applied is always greater than what you have been offered because you messed about the system and wasted time when you were guilty.