33 replies to this topic

[Carlos W]

At this point I think naming and shaming is going to lose you all potential opportunities to reason with the company.

 

£2500 is too cheap, but that's not your problem.

 

Can you get a magnet and see how well it sticks to the door step?

 

You need to get some facts together and go back to the company with a list of whats wrong and tell them you want to instruct another company to fix the issues at their expense. 

[ibrooks]

Did you pay with a credit card? or at least partly on a credit card? You might be able to get your money back that way.

 

I'd bet the door steps have only had part repairs and the repair panels aren't quite the same profile as the originals and that's why they have the odd distortion. I found this with a Magnum panel a while back and just threw it on the scrap metal pile and bought a genuine one instead.

[-Mini-23-]

Thank you all for taking time to give me some advice.

I have tried getting in touch with the garage again as he has promised me a breakdown of the cost so I can find another garage to evaluate the works that have been carried out.
Unfortunately I am not getting a response and don't know what else to do.

The problem is also that I don't know whether the new parts have really been supplied as I am not knowledgeable enough to see it.

By the way, I also don't know whether all of these works really needed to be carried out as he told me that they needed to be done.

The citizens advice told us that we should try to resolve it with the garage directly but now that I am not receiving a response anymore, I feel a bit helpless.

[-Mini-23-]

I also didn't pay with my credit card but via bank transfer. :-(

[Blatherskite]

Make sure to keep a written log of everything you do, in detail, in relation to your claim, also copies of letters. If you meet the bandit who messed with your car, keep minutes of the meeting, and ask him to sign as an agreed record of whats discussed & agreed. Don't be rude, emotional (hah! I can talk...) and certainly not abusive. Be ready to lay all this out in evidence of a claim.Take clear photos of everything.

It might be worth getting an autoconsultant (AA?) report on the car as well. Those sills look well dodgy.

Edited by Blatherskite, 05 July 2015 - 10:04 AM.

[Blatherskite]

And I'm sorry you have been disappointed so badly with your Mini. Getting the little car back should have been one of the best days in your life :-(

[eean]

Alternatively, what have you paid up to now? 1500? It's easy to say but, just take your car to a reputable garage and get them to sort the sill work for you and that hole where the bumper is, and just wash your hands of them, put it down to experience and enjoy your car, you'll feel better letting go of the downer of it all and the hassle of trying to sort it out. If you don't feel that the car is safe to use at the moment have the AA check over it?

[-Mini-23-]

Again, thank you all for your support.

 

I have received a response from the garage yesterday and it has taken me a few hours to put together a response.

 

The garage has written that I have unreasonable expectations as it is an old car but that they would like to collect the car again and to agree to a reasonable time frame.

 

I have attached the response (in 2 parts due to size) I have put together and it would be fantastic to get some feedback on whether I have done everything correctly and if I have missed to point out anything.

 

Today it also did a funny thing where the engine didn't idle. I am not quite sure how to explain this properly but it was a very odd sensation. It sounded nearly like the car turned itself off when no gas was applied.

Any ideas what that could be?

 

@Blatherskite - Good idea to get a consultant. I have also been wanting to go and visit another garage I have contacted last week but they have unfortunately not responded to my email which makes me always wary.

 

@eean - It has just passed its MOT with few minors so I am not too worried about road safety. We have bought the car on the basis that its mechanically sound. I guess until I bring it to a check, I will have to trust that it is. :-/

 

@ibrooks - They look quite broken underneath as well which makes me think they may not even have been replaced.

 

@Carlos W - I will buy a magnet tomorrow and try this.

 

@Ben_O - He actually said that the little hole is supposed to be there which made me feel very insecure. I hope I have addressed all points in the attachments so they can either get fixed or refunded.

The price was also not negotiated. He quoted £2,500 for all works and we accepted.

Attached Files

•  Response to Mini Cooper Repairs 1.pdf   1.93MB   52 downloads
•  Response to Mini Cooper Repairs 2.pdf   1.43MB   41 downloads

[Blatherskite]

I would withhold the remaining payment pending clarification of the issues you raise in your pdfs. The general quality of work looks poor to me, although panel fit is often questionable with Minis. What is reasonable to expect for £2 500 in the UK, I don't know, living in Norway.

That front wing to front panel joint with cracked paint looks mighty like it has filler - hence the cracking. Often conceales a rusty joint.

I would suggest you take the car to the AA or a mini specialist for a detailed opinion, rather than a local outfit who don't answer emails.

[Ben_O]

The PDF looks good to me.

 

You have done a great job of highlighting your concerns but i worry they may take advantage of the parts of the work you have admitted to not knowing how they should be.

Would someone from TMF not be able to come and meet you to advise how it should be and why it is not right and what needs to be done so that you can respond with a stronger more positive reply to them. I would happily come and talk you through everything and point out why things are not right but i'm afraid distance is going to be a problem.

 

Like was mentioned above, Mini panel alignment is never perfect from the factory but yours is shocking. There is no reason for the door to stick out that far when closed so something is not right there.

 

I just think it's terrible that they have the attitude of it's an old car so what do you expect? The process of sorting it out properly is the same as any other car and there is no reason to not finish it properly just because of it's age.

 

Regardless of any other factors, they agreed to do the jobs listed for the price agreed and you would naturally assume that they would be done to a suitable standard.

O.k, so if the price is lower you might not expect the quality to be like that f a more expensive garage but the repairs shown in the photos look very amateurish and are not the results of 10 months labour.

I would say it's been left standing for 9 months and then they just rushed the job once you started to question why it was taking so long. 

 

I really hope you get this sorted because it has the potential to be a lovely car with some fairly minor finishing and rectification.

 

Good luck

[Titchywitch256]

I think you should consider getting an independent report - not one from another garage who could be seen to have a vested interest. You could try these guys

 

http://www.scotiaveh...inspection.com/

 

I've found their work to be very good in the past and I doubt it would cost too much.

 

Then you will know whether the work that they have done is OK and if they deserve to be paid for it. If they haven't done enough to warrant the £1500 then I would start to pursue them for the outstanding amount and then go elsewhere to get the job finished. And pay at least part of it on your credit card 

[eean]

If I'd brought that car back to you in that condition from the pics you've included, I would be ashamed, how the hell can they expect payment for such **** work and service, they haven't even put the indicator side repeater in properly, the paintwork is **** (sorry)
I think you have the nearside mixed up with the offside
Hope you get this sorted satisfactorily

[Carlos W]

Where in London are you?

[-Mini-23-]

@Blatherskite: I am withholding the £1,000 that are still outstanding. I have contacted a mini garage close to me but they have not responded or picked up the phone. I will now try to get an appointment with someone from the AA to advise me. It has passed its MOT recently though and now it is not idling correctly any more and I feel like I have taken on an impossible task.

 

@Ben_O: Thank you for the advice. I have amended my pdf to say that these points need to be checked by an independent garage. I definitely am being made to feel like I have unrealistic expectations and should expect this level of work when dealing with an old car. The thing is, this was not the first car I saw and bought. I had been to see quite a few minis and chose this one because it drove so well and had a low mileage with history. He promised to get the car to look like really good and sturdy when finished and I believed that. 

 

@Titchywitch: Thank you! I will definitely give them a call. Maybe they can check out the points that I am not able to check. :)

 

@eean: You speak from my heart. :)

 

@Carlos W: I have sent you a pm.

 

I have a few things to report since I have last posted so apologies for this being a very long post once again. 

I have been contacting the garage quite often to get a response to my report and have received the following:

 

GARAGE

'Further to our discussions on Thursday 2 July when I delivered your car to you, I have taken time to reflect on what was said, prior to responding to you. You made it crystal clear you were not happy with the finished result, from my part I will add that I feel your expectations of a car designed over 50 years ago and manufactured over 20 years ago are some what unrealistic, but that aside I want to resolve this matter amicably. I note you have spoken to the Citizens Advice Bureau, and agree we need to talk. The best course of action is to return the car to us and give us the opportunity to rectify any agreed faults in a realistic time frame. Please suggest a date and time to return the car to us.'

 

MY RESPONSE

'We also had time to reflect since you have brought us the car.

We have gotten some advice in a mini forum and the feedback generally was that the work has been done to poor standards.

 

I don't expect a 20 year old car to look like a new-build but I do expect you to carry your work out with due diligence to the standards agreed which means that all items need to be fit for purpose and of satisfactory quality.

It is clear that the car in its current state is not.

 

The car is very dirty and we have found quite a few holes and rust in the base.

Please find attached an overview of queries and feedback on the works carried out which I would like you to respond to point by point.

 

What do you deem as a reasonable time frame to remedy all defects as listed?

 

The car has also started giving us issues when idling and we have only driven it twice for 15-20 minutes.'

 

This is when I sent my report to him. It took a few days for him to get back to us and I have also sent him a couple of texts to ask when a response will be sent.

He then sent us an e-mail and forgot to attach the response.

However, I have received it now including the following response:

 

GARAGE

'Please find attached your PDF that I have commented in red.

 

I suggest you return the car to our workshop, so we can go through all the issues your are highlighting. This way we can have other Minis around to show you how parts are fitted and manufactured, this will remove further possibilities of confusion.

 

Some of your comments are a realistic expectations which I have agreed to address. When can you return the car to us?'

 

I have attached the PDF with the comments from the garage added in red to my report here also so you can see it.

He hasn't responded to quite a few points which I have made and also not to the really important ones like holes in in the metal underneath the carpet where the sills should have been replaced or the blistering paint on the roof or the door not being aligned etc:

 

MY RESPONSE (via text, not email)

'We have read your email and have noticed that you haven't made a comment on quite a few points we have made. Please have a look again. Thank you.'

 

GARAGE

'In response to your text highlighting certain points that remain uncommented, As I wrote yesterday, the car must be returned to our workshop so we can discuss all points in a conciliatory manner.

 

You included a picture that contained the rear swing arm pin that has a round hole in the casting, this is in fact how it was manufactured to allow a tool to be fitted to facilitate tightening. The cut outs in the roof trim are factory standard to allow water to drain through the roof holes, the red boot liner you showed is a liner not a carpet.

 

Thus the only way we can resolve further misunderstandings is having the car in our workshop with you both present, only at this juncture can we compile a list of what is realistic and agree any reasonable faults which we are more than happy to correct, some of which I have already agreed to do.

 

Again, please suggest a date that is convenient.'

 

I have not responded as of yet as I feel quite drained and don't know what to do. There is no point in myself being present in a garage as I am not a mechanic. I have seen a sufficient amount of Minis to know that my car does not look right!

 

I am really worried now because of the issue with the idling and have only driven it twice for 15 minutes since it has been delivered to me. 

Now one of the front tyres looks like its loosing air too. I feel like I have made a big mistake buying my little car.

Attached Files

•  Response to Mini Cooper Repairs 3.pdf   1.93MB   18 downloads
•  Response to Mini Cooper Repairs 4.pdf   1.43MB   10 downloads

Edited by -Mini-23-, 18 July 2015 - 10:03 AM.

[Carlos W]

The hole in the rear subframe bolt is indeed standard.

 

The door would take less than 5 minutes to line up with the rear 1/4. It just wants the striker plate loosened, moved out and tightened.

 

The sills have been stone chipped prior to painting. The very last picture in PDF 3 is rusty, and needs sorted, but I can't tell where it is.

 

PDF 4, the chrome strip on the roof does have a join.

 

I can't work out where the paint is with the bits in, but that's poor preparation and painting in dusty conditions.

 

I don't know what you've agreed, but there is going to be chipped paint on the seat frames, marks on the head lining etc I'd class that as consistent with age.

 

The side repeaters aren't fitted properly, this is nothing but lazy and showing no pride in their work.