32 replies to this topic

[Spider]

If your old head gasket fire rings failed between cylinders 2 & 3 causing loss of compression, an excess amount of heat would have been apparent in that localised area whereas the rest of the cylinder head face and block would be at a more consistent temperature.

 

 

Retarded Ignition Timing will do just this.

 

The Exhaust Valves for 2 and 3 and right there together and these alone make for a 'natual' hot spot in the head. Retarded Ignition timing only makes that much worse.

[minidave54]

Neal, I will remove the studs and check the head and block face tomorrow also looking for any sign of fretting of the threads.

To answer your other points, the head gasket came from a mini spares head set for an spi.

The water was leaking all along the joint face on the front of the engine between the head and block. There was no signs of any water leak from the rear of the engine .

[sonikk4]

I had this with a minispares gasket kit for a 998. Copper gasket. It leaked water and oil. You need a Payen HG.

[minidave54]

RooBoonix, that's interesting reading as that is the very gasket set i had fitted.

I now have a new gasket, it's there upgraded Payen AF470, mini spares identify GUG705550GM. Maybe fitting this with new studs and nuts might also solve my problem. But i will also carry out the other checks as suggested by other members on here.

[Northernpower]

Neal, I will remove the studs and check the head and block face tomorrow also looking for any sign of fretting of the threads.

To answer your other points, the head gasket came from a mini spares head set for an spi.

The water was leaking all along the joint face on the front of the engine between the head and block. There was no signs of any water leak from the rear of the engine .

When you remove the studs make sure there's no thread sticking out round the stud hole. Were the studs fully screwed into the block? You need to try and find something substantial to wrap some fine wet and dry round to see if there are any low points on the block.

[minidave54]

Moke Spider, the engine I have is an SPI, so as you are probably aware ignition timing and mixture are all controlled by sensors and the ECU.

[minidave54]

I had this with a minispares gasket kit for a 998. Copper gasket. It leaked water and oil. You need a Payen HG.

Thanks Sonikk, i now have a Payen AF470, so this might help.

[neal]

Neal, I will remove the studs and check the head and block face tomorrow also looking for any sign of fretting of the threads.

To answer your other points, the head gasket came from a mini spares head set for an spi.

The water was leaking all along the joint face on the front of the engine between the head and block. There was no signs of any water leak from the rear of the engine .

Is it leaking in the middle at the front, what I'm trying to work out if it is related to where it over heated between cyls 2 & 3 and possibly warped??

[neal]

 

Neal, I will remove the studs and check the head and block face tomorrow also looking for any sign of fretting of the threads.

To answer your other points, the head gasket came from a mini spares head set for an spi.

The water was leaking all along the joint face on the front of the engine between the head and block. There was no signs of any water leak from the rear of the engine .

Is it leaking in the middle at the front, what I'm trying to work out if it is related to where it over heated between cyls 2 & 3 and possibly warped??

 

Me thinks your just going have to whip the head off and take your time checking, checking & checking. Good Luck.

[minidave54]

Neal, I will remove the studs and check the head and block tomorrow also looking for any sign of fretting of the threads.
To answer your other points, the head gasket came from a mini spares head set for an spi.
The water was leaking all along the joint face on the front of the engine between the head and block. There was no signs of any water leak from the rear of the engine .

Is it leaking in the middle at the front, what I'm trying to work out if it is related to where it over heated between cyls 2 & 3 and possibly warped??

It was leaking at various points all along the front of the engine from cylinder numbers 1 to 4. It was as if there was a gap along the front between the head and the engine block. When I removed the head there was no signs of any water in any of the cylinders.

[neal]

 

 

Neal, I will remove the studs and check the head and block tomorrow also looking for any sign of fretting of the threads.
To answer your other points, the head gasket came from a mini spares head set for an spi.
The water was leaking all along the joint face on the front of the engine between the head and block. There was no signs of any water leak from the rear of the engine .

Is it leaking in the middle at the front, what I'm trying to work out if it is related to where it over heated between cyls 2 & 3 and possibly warped??

It was leaking at various points all along the front of the engine from cylinder numbers 1 to 4. It was as if there was a gap along the front between the head and the engine block. When I removed the head there was no signs of any water in any of the cylinders.

 

Interesting, sounds like fretting on the threaded holes or threads exposed on the studs not allowing the head to compress the gasket down, but I'm sure you'll find out.

Let us know how you get on!

[Northernpower]

Neal, I will remove the studs and check the head and block tomorrow also looking for any sign of fretting of the threads.
To answer your other points, the head gasket came from a mini spares head set for an spi.
The water was leaking all along the joint face on the front of the engine between the head and block. There was no signs of any water leak from the rear of the engine .

Is it leaking in the middle at the front, what I'm trying to work out if it is related to where it over heated between cyls 2 & 3 and possibly warped??

It was leaking at various points all along the front of the engine from cylinder numbers 1 to 4. It was as if there was a gap along the front between the head and the engine block. When I removed the head there was no signs of any water in any of the cylinders.

You need to check the face of the block to make sure it's true.

[neal]

 

 

 

Neal, I will remove the studs and check the head and block tomorrow also looking for any sign of fretting of the threads.
To answer your other points, the head gasket came from a mini spares head set for an spi.
The water was leaking all along the joint face on the front of the engine between the head and block. There was no signs of any water leak from the rear of the engine .

Is it leaking in the middle at the front, what I'm trying to work out if it is related to where it over heated between cyls 2 & 3 and possibly warped??

It was leaking at various points all along the front of the engine from cylinder numbers 1 to 4. It was as if there was a gap along the front between the head and the engine block. When I removed the head there was no signs of any water in any of the cylinders.

You need to check the face of the block to make sure it's true.

 

Fingers crossed eh Dave? Hope its just fretting or studs or maybe a dodgy head gasket 

[minidave54]

Not had much chance recently to look at this further in any detail.

Did try one quick check today. Placed the head back on without a gasket and measured the gap between the block and head.
It was 0.06mm at various points along the front edge, the back was tight. I have access to another block so will try the same test on that.
I will also try another head on my block and carry out the same checks to see what shows up.

[nicklouse]

so what is holding it up`?

 

water pump?

 

pulled top threads where the studs go in?