80 replies to this topic

[panky]

Apparently bikes, scooters and three wheelers have to wait until 2022

[mm man]

Apparently bikes, scooters and three wheelers have to wait until 2022

???
From Gov website in force now or are things changing?
Exempt vehicles
Other vehicles that don’t need an MOT include:

cars and motorcycles made before 1960
goods vehicles powered by electricity
tractors

[panky]

It will become a rolling forty year exemption from next year unless 'Substantially Modified' - a definition which is yet to be finalised. Bikes etc from 2022 while they sort out how to classify substantially modded for that category.

[mini-mad-mark]

If they just removed the emissions test and kept the rest I would be happy.......

[HUBBA.HUBBA]

It will become a rolling forty year exemption from next year unless 'Substantially Modified' - a definition which is yet to be finalised. Bikes etc from 2022 while they sort out how to classify substantially modded for that category.

Gulp!

[Ethel]

If they just removed the emissions test and kept the rest I would be happy.......

I was just about to reply saying emissions is the one thing it would be hard to waiver, as it'll also affect environmental legislation. Though 1975 is already over 40 years ago, so some would get to skip the exhaust probe from the get go.

 

Googling to be sure I got the dates right dates I found out the MoT was originally only for vehicles of ten years or older 

[panky]

It will become a rolling forty year exemption from next year unless 'Substantially Modified' - a definition which is yet to be finalised. Bikes etc from 2022 while they sort out how to classify substantially modded for that category.

 

Someone on another forum has just done some digging ( same person I got the original info from) and found that forty year old  bikes and scooters will follow other vehicles and be MOT exempt from next year. Sorry for the misleading post.

[YJO]

I think that the current fee is good for an annual piece of mind for items like bearings which we probably don't check regularly... and I have yet to come across an mot man who doesn't appreciate a classic of any breed.

[tiger99]

Thinking about this some more, when you insure a classic you have to tell the insurance company all about it. You likely as not will (should?) ring around several brokers for the best quote. You can ask if they will do a better deal if you will commit to having it MOTd annually. They "should" be able to knock at least a few quid off, in the same way that certain mods such as a "Thatcham" alarm system usually get a discount. You can't lose by asking.

 

If you have success wit this or any other way of getting a better insurance deal, please do let us know.

[Cooperman]

Having a current MoT means very little in safety terms. It just means the car could pass the MoT at a specific time on a specific day. It could be unsafe the following day.

Most classic car owners are very keen on their cars and tend to keep them in top condition. Just go to a classic car show and take a look.

 

What is not clear is how the 15% increase in power is going to be measured. Will it be a 15% increase in the power available to a car with the manufacturer's options fitted and approved on the original homologation papers? Will a car need to go onto a rolling-road to be measured?

 

It's all a bit vague and i might be suspected that if a Classic Mini with a V5 which says it has a 1275 engine and if the owner produces the paperwork for a Cooper 'S' 1275 which states a power output of 76 bhp, how would that be viewed. With many other classics there is only one engine size and configuration, but the Mini was produced for so many years that actual specifications have become very muddled. If you have, for example, a 1965 Ford Zodiac there is only one possible engine to consider, but a classic Mini can have a very wide range of engines from an 850 to an A+ 1275.

[HUBBA.HUBBA]

I think an MOT is essential for safety. Things like corroded brake lines, Worn ball joints, uneven braking, bearings, steering racks all picked up in MOT. Surely it is recognised to a certain standard. Picking up on things that can fail in the future like corroded brake lines.

Edited by HUBBA.HUBBA, 12 October 2017 - 06:59 PM.

[Ethel]

 

It's all a bit vague and i might be suspected that if a Classic Mini with a V5 which says it has a 1275 engine and if the owner produces the paperwork for a Cooper 'S' 1275 which states a power output of 76 bhp, how would that be viewed. With many other classics there is only one engine size and configuration, but the Mini was produced for so many years that actual specifications have become very muddled. If you have, for example, a 1965 Ford Zodiac there is only one possible engine to consider, but a classic Mini can have a very wide range of engines from an 850 to an A+ 1275.

Reading between the lines, I could see it justifiable on the design capabilities of the chassis, suspension, brakes etc to cope with the extra performance. That would suggest working off the most powerful factory variant on your particular under carriage. I suspect it's really 2 fingers to those who don't fit in with the lobbyists' ideas of what should be done to old cars.

[mk1coopers]

So if you went to special tuning and bought all the bells and whistles you could for your 1275 S you would (could) according to various period magazine articles end up with a car producing 135bhp at the flywheel, all parts available from the factory, with 7.5 inch discs / drums on the rear, so shall we use that as the base figure which we can add the 15% to ?

To my mind the PtW ratio needs to be dropped completely, it's never been a point of any regulation that you couldn't do this so how can it be retrospectively applied, far better to restrict the tuning to 'period' or 'age related' modifications (engine), so if you keep the external mods in the right style you are fine, however if you pop a Honda lump in it (without cutting the body as that tips you into the 8 point rules) you continue to test as you have altered the 'historic' nature / appearance of the vehicle

Edited by mk1coopers, 13 October 2017 - 08:28 PM.

[Trissy B]

I've been reading this post and various other forums etc over the last weeks with some interest. I have a 1971 998 mini with a flip front and 1275 in it. Obviously I will want to retain the registration and to be honest don't really care about the ruling regarding MOT's as i'm sure to get one done or an equivalent yearly garage check, whatever that may be.

 

I think what the exemption generally means that the Goverment don't want to worry about these 300,000 cars (because they are generally well looked after anyway, right?). The DVLA budget has to be a factor in this, surely this means they can issue X amount less of paperwork which might save Y amount of money.

 

The "substantially altered" bit of the exemption is a bit of a strange one and goes against my logic. Why would the DVLA want to spend loads of time, money and effort on checking and re-registering cars? Doesn't seem to sound right and I've always thought that common sense will prevail eventually. Surely those cars with 'period modifications' which have been around forever i.e. webbers with bulkhead box outs, flip fronts and mod'ded up engines; should all be ok?!

 

The new November Mini Magazine has two beautiful Broadspeed minis with fastbacks and hot engines. They aren't standard. Should they get a Q plate? No.

 

The same Mini Magazine mentions that car modifications carried out 30 years ago will duck out of the "substantially altered" rule. This makes total sense, but how will they know? I might have done my flip front yesterday or 30 years ago for all they know. I think the only people that need to worry is anyone with a motorbike engined, space frame pre-76' mini!! I think its all a load of hot air..... (famous last words probably!!)

[mk1coopers]

The rules regarding modifications to the chassis or bodyshell have been in place since 1988 (with 5 points of the 8 having to come from an original unmodified body or chassis and hence the DVLA using this as the cut off date) what hasn't been in place is any restriction on the power you can extract from your (original type) engine, so that (to me) isn't a 'fair' (draft) rule to restrospectivly apply to all vehicles, especially as popping a 998 in an 850 could theoretically put you over this limit even though the factory produced vehicles to this spec.

Unfortunately I suspect the onus will be on the driver (owner) of a modified car to prove it was modified before 1988 if they are running without an MOT, it won't be a case of the DVLA having to prove it when it was / wasn't done, if you have modified the body on a 1989 Mini I don't think there's going to be much of an argument you can make as to when it was done when it gets to 40 years old.

It will allow all the period modified Radfords / Broadspeeds / Minisprints etc to retain their historic / VHI status, as long as they are original period examples (or even copies done before 1988), I'm afraid with this coming in a Q plate may not even be possible for some cars as if the body has been modified (shorties / Speedsters etc) and they didn't go through the correct registration process at the time of build you may end up with nothing more than an unregistered garden ornament if it can't pass the modern test if the system catches up with you (even if you continue to MOT once the car is 40)