35 replies to this topic

[PoolGuy]

 

 

Specialist components sell forged A+ rods...  guess where they get them from ;)

Tell us Steve.

 

Oh, i thought it was obvious.. maxspeeding.

 

The old version, or the latest ones too?

[Spider]

 

For some people, Maxpeeding is not a bad option.


http://mk1-forum.net...php?f=5&t=27556

 

Link not working

Because it's a link to a rival forum, that's probably not allowed?

 

 

No, that;s fine. It's odd that it doesn't work. I did a search on the MKI Forum and found this thread;-

 

http://mk1-forum.net...6&p=236194

 

The notes and remarks about these and similar cheap rods is worth reading along with those regarding the Saenz Rods, which are in my view, a decent rod.

 

As best I've been able to determine, the cheap rods are made by sintered process, which is common-ish among some OEM car engines these days, they can be quite a strong and decent rod, however, the process involved is highly specialised and easy, very very easy to get wrong. These rods too, can't be 're-worked' or reconditioned, once they go out of spec, it's a bin job, they can't be closed and honed on the big ends, they can't be straightened when bent or twisted (assuming they survive that in the first place), all those I've seen need modifications to the block to give clearance for them to fit and most are a straight rod, not off set like stock rods. Most also need odd sized gudeon pins.

Quality rods, like the Saenz, Arrow, Carillo etc are forged, like the originals were and hence why they cost so much more. These can be re-worked and reconditioned, just like the originals.

[PACINO]

Exactly. That was the link that I read these days in the MK1 forum and that I put here yesterday but it didn't work. Thanks Spider.
I don't know why you like these con rods so little. Everyone is fitting them on their cars. And I haven't heard anyone speak ill of them except you. Of course, Saenz products are top quality. That no one denies. But maybe we should give Maxpeeding a chance.

By the way; I have been exchanging emails with SWIFTUNE for several days. I've got their Heritage Die Cast pistons, and now I've thought about their connecting rods. They have asked me for the measurements of my original connecting rods to tell me which ones I need, but when I have asked what material they are made of and in what "country" they are made, they have not answered me.

But, maybe we have to start thinking that China is our new best 'friend' and that apart from Maxpeeding and SC (Special Components) there are more companies manufacturanding there.

[PACINO]

https://www.sau.com....grods-con-rods/

[imack]

I looked at the maxspeeding rods a few years ago but didn't find a huge amount of info on them or many reviews from people who had actually built them into engines and used them. I seem to remember that at the time there were a lot of concerns as to whether the ARP bolts were actually genuine and some people had measured them and found the little end bushes to be under sized. I think I found one case of rod failure.
In more recent time I've seen a lot of reviews and people actually building then into engines and they generally get favorable reviews altogether they're heavier and bulkier than expensive versions.
I think older specialist components ones were rebounded maxspeeding rods, don't know about the current versions.
I decided at the time to use factory rods and fit ARP bolts.
More recently I bought Arrow/MED rods for my latest build.

[Cooperman]

In truth, for road-car engines, the A+ rods are fine. If balanced and, if you feel it necessary, polished to remove any stress-raisers, they are good for 8500 rpm. If you are racing and will be using a sustained 8000 - 8500 rpm, then maybe special rods are a good idea, but not many people on here rev to much over 7000 rpm.

The rods to avoid are the A-series rods with the 'lumps' on the big-end caps. Avoid these. Innocenti 1300 rods are also very good abd are strong.

But then, if money is of no importance, that's a different matter.

It's the same with pistons. The 21253 is just about the ideal piston for a road car revving at up to 6500 rpm, but those selling them will claim that a forged piston is necessary. Modern squeeze-cast pistons are very strong.

[sonikk4]

While we are on about rods and how they may or may not be good enough, i follow a chap on Youtube called Steve Morris Engines. He is an exponent in Billet Aluminium engines and builds some absolute monsters. (Yes its predominantly V8 turbo charged monsters, but also Supercharged and he also makes Billet Lambo blocks as well)

 

One of his videos shows his drag car where he had an 8 piston delete episode. All 8 connecting rods shattered and i mean shattered, and after he had some metallurgy carried out he got to the bottom of why.

 

[imack]

Steve Morris's billet engines are absolutely stunning and the destruction of those rods was mental.
Was fantastic watching him repair that billet block.

Edited by imack, 06 January 2023 - 07:20 PM.

[sonikk4]

Steve Morris's billet engines are absolutely stunning and the destruction of those rods was mental.
Was fantastic watching him repair that billet block.

 

Yep, a good design enabling repairs to be carried out which on a normal engine would have been so much scrap. BUT at $98k plus you would hope there would be something that could be done repair wise. His SMX and SML engines are something else.

 

And his Caprice is mental.

[PACINO]

Has anyone lightened and balanced the original con rods? How much weight can be filed on each connecting rod?

[imack]

I enquired with MED 6 or 7 years ago about getting standard rods lightened, balanced, sized and ARP bolts fitted but was told it would end up almost as expensive as buying high quality aftermarket rods and would be nowhere near as light or reliable.
I think lightening standard rods is a dying art these days as superior rods are now readily available off the shelf.
MED machined some material from the big ends of my A+ rods, no idea how much weight it took off but I wouldn't imagine it was more than a few grams. I forget how much it cost.

Edited by imack, 06 January 2023 - 08:50 PM.

[PACINO]

I enquired with MED 6 or 7 years ago about getting standard rods lightened, balanced, sized and ARP bolts fitted but was told it would end up almost as expensive as buying high quality aftermarket rods and would be nowhere near as light or reliable.
I think lightening standard rods is a dying art these days as superior rods are now readily available off the shelf.
MED machined some material from the big ends of my A+ rods, no idea how much weight it took off but I wouldn't imagine it was more than a few grams. I forget how much it cost.

Thanks for your opinion friend. A couple of days ago I called a company that rectifies engines if they lighten connecting rods, and they told me that it is something unusual but that they did do it for me. Of course, they have not yet seen the connecting rods nor have they told me how much weight they could take off. And the price is around 100euros per connecting rod.

[Steve220]

While we are on about rods and how they may or may not be good enough, i follow a chap on Youtube called Steve Morris Engines. He is an exponent in Billet Aluminium engines and builds some absolute monsters. (Yes its predominantly V8 turbo charged monsters, but also Supercharged and he also makes Billet Lambo blocks as well)

 

One of his videos shows his drag car where he had an 8 piston delete episode. All 8 connecting rods shattered and i mean shattered, and after he had some metallurgy carried out he got to the bottom of why.

 

I started getting into his youtube channel a few months ago when he made a big block for Cleetus's Alco. The thing is a work of art!

[sonikk4]

 

While we are on about rods and how they may or may not be good enough, i follow a chap on Youtube called Steve Morris Engines. He is an exponent in Billet Aluminium engines and builds some absolute monsters. (Yes its predominantly V8 turbo charged monsters, but also Supercharged and he also makes Billet Lambo blocks as well)

 

One of his videos shows his drag car where he had an 8 piston delete episode. All 8 connecting rods shattered and i mean shattered, and after he had some metallurgy carried out he got to the bottom of why.

 

I started getting into his youtube channel a few months ago when he made a big block for Cleetus's Alco. The thing is a work of art!

 

Cleetus's Elco has come on since he decided not to turn it into a jet car and then he gave the car to Kevin of KSR fame to turn into a full blown drag car. However Tom Bailey was the chap i follow who runs a couple of Steve's SMX engines who drew me to Steve.

 

But i digress, even the best looking rods can be utter junk if not made from the correct material. I'm running A + rods with Omega pistons and one of Oz's bladed and wedged cranks in the bottom of my 1293 Billet Ali 7 port. Oz will have done some work i'm sure to the rods etc as a lot has gone into the block. Considering the cam i'm using is one of Keith Calvers with pwr range of 2500 to 7500+ rpm i'm happy to stick to the A+ rods. 

[Spider]

 Everyone is fitting them on their cars.

 

I wouldn't say 'everyone' but in most cases, the people I have spoken with regarding their purchase and the reasons for buying them comes down to cheap bling. If your heart is set on them, knock your socks off

and I'm not the only one to call them out for what they are !

I have some photos, I'll find them and post them up.